quote:

Originally posted by DJ_Octane Oh yeah, I forgot. Whatever you decide to do...just make sure you can back it up.

agreed. doing a mix on the computer might give promoters a false sense of your skill. true track selection is important, but id think that mixing skill and creativity is equal parts..


leX MIc cHekA

For FUCK sakes! Yes, do it on the computer, all the biggest DJ's in the world do so why shouldn’t you?

I think its about the end product. I really don’t give a shit if some DJ is mixing on vinyl rather then some computer, rather I would prefer more DJ's use a computer.

___________________
~ Under the spell of a 303 ~

All you touch and all you see is all your life will ever be.

quote:

Originally posted by hooknife For FUCK sakes! Yes, do it on the computer, all the biggest DJ's in the world do so why shouldn’t you? I think its about the end product. I really don’t give a shit if some DJ is mixing on vinyl rather then some computer, rather I would prefer more DJ's use a computer.

Hmmmm, I have to say that I don't really agree with this one.

If your goal is to produce a compilation, then yes, why not pull out all the stops to make it sound as good as possible.

But if you are assembling a demo to show the local promoters what you are capable of, producing the whole thing on a computer sort of defeats the purpose of the demo...

___________________
DJ Kibon



Click below to download my most recent trance set:
DJ Kibon - August 2004

quote:

Originally posted by hooknife For FUCK sakes! Yes, do it on the computer, all the biggest DJ's in the world do so why shouldn’t you? I think its about the end product. I really don’t give a shit if some DJ is mixing on vinyl rather then some computer, rather I would prefer more DJ's use a computer.

Dude, I think you're confusing 'demo' and 'compilation.'

What we're talking about here is a CD you send out to club owners/promoters to showcase your live mixing skills, in order to get gigs. Anyone who thinks they can get away with mixing one of those in a computer had better have the skills to back it up once they're in the club or at the party, or they're not going to get very many gigs. Of course, if you have the skills to back it up, why on earth would you need to do it in the computer?

What you're talking about are compilations and mix CD's, which are often mixed in something like ProTools, just to make it perfect for the masses. I don't much like that either, as there doesn't seem to be much point to it. But that, at least, isn't cheating: by and large, mix CD's are made by DJ's who've already proven they can play live (except, of course, Chris Sheppard, but we won't go there). Demo CD's, by their very nature, are not made by DJ's whose name are known.

quote:

[i][b] But if you are assembling a demo to show the local promoters what you are capable of, producing the whole thing on a computer sort of defeats the purpose of the demo...

I know what you are saying believe me, you seem like you are one of those hard chargers and believe in honest work.

Alot of you are missing the point, but there is truth in all. It all comes down to ability.

First and foremost, if you were not ready for a live gig, you would not even be handing out a demo- right?

If I am in a office and fighting for the executive position, I am going to do all it takes to get to that position because I know that when I get there, I will be able to produce quality material and perform well. If my peers are using typewriters for their resumes, I will use wordperfect for f#ck sakes and get that sh!t looking hot. Once I get to the top, as long as I have the ability to do what I did before, I will stay there or go higher.

But in reality, its marketing! The idea is to give the best quality work you have to offer providing that you can equal it live- period! A promoter can only listen to the beat matching and quality of sound movement- that's all! Is your music blending nice and are your beats on point. That's all that is available for him to make his assement. He has nothing else. So, once you get the job, it over. What you do from there is basically starting all over.

He knows that you are in your own bedroom or whatever and expects perfection on that cd. He also knows that when you come to his place, using his equipment, it might take time to get adjusted and you will mess up. But you should be professional enough to recover properly.

That is by getting the crowd involved and carrying the set with your tunes no matter if your cd was perfect but you are a little off beat live.- That stuff happens. Most great djs will tell you that it took years to have a flawless gig!

The key word is presentation.

And the key question is do you have the skill to do it again pc or no pc?

No. There's a big difference here. If you move into the executive office, you have time to adjust, to get up to speed.

When you step behind the decks, you have two hours. That's it. And if you fuck up, if you don't have the skill to back up the demo you created on your PC (and again, I ask, if you do have the skill, why are you using a PC? You have the skill or you don't. If you need a PC to make your demo flawless, you don't have the skill to play live), you're going to be doing all of the following, to a greater or lesser extent:

1) Screwing your chance of ever getting booked by that promoter again, as well as any promoters s/he knows.
2) Screwing up the night for a bunch of people who want to have a good time.
3) Likely hurting the promoter's chances of a big turnout at their next event.

This entire industry is word of mouth. People hear about a DJ who fucked up, they're not just going to avoid that DJ. They're going to avoid things associated with that DJ, which means the promoter as well. Even really big name DJ's get avoided if they fuck up too much. Anyone even remember Keoki anymore? Everyone loses because of your inability to recognize your shortcomings.


Your demo must show what you can do reliably, live and on the fly, in (often) poor lighting conditions, while under stress. If you need a PC to make your demo good, when you're recording in your controlled environment, without interruptions, and without stress, then you are simply not ready to perform. Period.

Put it this way. Angela (as we'll call her) is auditioning for a part in a musical. The producers ask for demo tapes before the auditions, so she sends hers in. Lucky for her, Angela is friends with someone at Tranceaddict who puts her demo in his PC, and corrects all of her mistakes, making sure that the demo is perfectly in key, even if she wasn't. Unfortunately, Angela doesn't get the part. Why? Because at the audition, she couldn't hit a note with a baseball bat. Why? Because instead of practicing, she used computer trickery to make herself sound better than she actually is.


To summarize the summary: If you can't record a practically flawless demo, you can't play live.

ok quick question what about when you edit your levels afterward so the mix sounds a bit clearer.Kind of like remastering the mix so it has a bit more clarity.Is this cheating?I think it would be a good idea nonetheless as it would make your demo crisper than the rest he gets.

quote:

Originally posted by dj prometheus ok quick question what about when you edit your levels afterward so the mix sounds a bit clearer.Kind of like remastering the mix so it has a bit more clarity.Is this cheating?I think it would be a good idea nonetheless as it would make your demo crisper than the rest he gets.

i would say that depends on the quality of your gain control in the first place. its fine to master it a little to make it sound a little nicer (when you play in a club the sound system should be set up to sound good anyway), but if your tracks have drastic drops and rises in volume then its time to re-record

cheating would be to alter the volume in each part of the set, to make it all the same level. if you do this, you will never learn your gain control properly, and that is an important part of playing club gigs

___________________
MUGGETS

quote:

Originally posted by KB2 I know what you are saying believe me, you seem like you are one of those hard chargers and believe in honest work. Alot of you are missing the point, but there is truth in all. It all comes down to ability. First and foremost, if you were not ready for a live gig, you would not even be handing out a demo- right? If I am in a office and fighting for the executive position, I am going to do all it takes to get to that position because I know that when I get there, I will be able to produce quality material and perform well. If my peers are using typewriters for their resumes, I will use wordperfect for f#ck sakes and get that sh!t looking hot. Once I get to the top, as long as I have the ability to do what I did before, I will stay there or go higher. But in reality, its marketing! The idea is to give the best quality work you have to offer providing that you can equal it live- period! A promoter can only listen to the beat matching and quality of sound movement- that's all! Is your music blending nice and are your beats on point. That's all that is available for him to make his assement. He has nothing else. So, once you get the job, it over. What you do from there is basically starting all over. He knows that you are in your own bedroom or whatever and expects perfection on that cd. He also knows that when you come to his place, using his equipment, it might take time to get adjusted and you will mess up. But you should be professional enough to recover properly. That is by getting the crowd involved and carrying the set with your tunes no matter if your cd was perfect but you are a little off beat live.- That stuff happens. Most great djs will tell you that it took years to have a flawless gig!

You are right on! Could not have said it better myself!!!

PERFECT!

This is not only a hobby its a job for some people and when it comes to getting work you MUST have a kill or be killed attitude.

Lets think about this for a second...If both you and I are trying to get a DJ spot and politics are not involved, another words, you don’t know the promoter and I don’t either, then I tell you what...you better use a computer to make your demo because I promise I did. Its not a fair world out there and I’m well aware of this but like I said above, kill or be killed.

fyi...if I got the job I would also be able to back up my demo.

___________________
~ Under the spell of a 303 ~

All you touch and all you see is all your life will ever be.

quote:

Originally posted by hooknife fyi...if I got the job I would also be able to back up my demo.

Then answer my question: If you have the skill to spin that well live, why would you need to resort to editing your demo on a PC?

Fact is, any edited mix is always going to be better than what you can do live. (This doesn't go for every DJ; I'm talking about DJ's who are at a point where they still need to send out demo CD's).

Sure, it's a cutthroat business. But if you actually have the chops, then you don't need to edit your demo on a PC. If you don't have the chops, editing makes you look like you do, and you will make a fool out of yourself when you get into the DJ booth at the gig.

Either way, there's no point.