ok it would take me about half an hour to quote in full from the dictionary but the part that applies to me is

2.(GOD) (in christian and other montheistic religions) the creator and ruler of the universe;the supreme being

it dosnt mention that i do have to believe..so if i dont believe i still maintain that i am an atheist

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Originally posted by ::TranceVanDyk:: oh, he didnt?? where are his remains? why were there more than 500 eye-witnesses who saw him. the accounts of his life were written by eye-witnesses, and there were 4 accounts of his life, each written with a different aspect in mind. the romans have account of that gaurds were posted at his tomb to ward off the possibility of his followers taking his body and claiming he rose from the dead. but the gaurds abandoned the tomb because something scared them so much, that they just ran. the huge door to the tomb was rolled open, and no body was found. he appeared to more than 500 people. not just a few. and it was he himself, in the flesh, because thomas actually touched his wounds because he was skeptical himself. he even ate with his disciples. jesus did certainy rise from the dead.

Ok, first of all, and perhaps most importantly of all, Jesus did not rise from the dead because people do not rise from the dead, it is not physically possible.

Secondly, to say the accounts of his life were written by "eye-witnesses" is laughable. They weren't. They were written years and years after Jesus died. There are no "eye-witness" accounts, just legends and myths passed down the generations by word of mouth.

Thirdly, I am led to believe there is evidence in the Bible that it could have been possible for Jesus to faje his crucifiction as it happened in Joseph's private garden while the crowd were far away.

quote:

Originally posted by zig ok it would take me about half an hour to quote in full from the dictionary but the part that applies to me is 2.(GOD) (in christian and other montheistic religions) the creator and ruler of the universe;the supreme being it dosnt mention that i do have to believe..so if i dont believe i still maintain that i am an atheist

Honestly mate! Leave the definitions alone it will all end in tears!

I agree with you about the definitions you just get bogged down..at the same time i still maintain that i or anyone else can be an atheist as regard religion god or whatever

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Originally posted by zig ok it would take me about half an hour to quote in full from the dictionary but the part that applies to me is 2.(GOD) (in christian and other montheistic religions) the creator and ruler of the universe;the supreme being it dosnt mention that i do have to believe..so if i dont believe i still maintain that i am an atheist

u still dont get it. below are definitions for god, religion, and belief. im taking 3 certain definitions out of the three words.

god 3 : a person or thing of supreme value

religon 4 : a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with ardor and faith

belief 1 : a state or habit of mind in which trust or confidence is placed in some person or thing

u believe in science. your religion is science. and your god is science. look at these definitions. put it together. science is a thing. its a system of beliefs. your faith is in science. your trust and confidence is in science.

ill say again. your belief, is your religion, and your religion is that of your god. your belief in science, is your religion, and science is your god. there is no such thing as an atheist.
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Main Entry: 1god
Pronunciation: 'gäd also 'god
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English, from Old English; akin to Old High German got god
1 capitalized : the supreme or ultimate reality: as a : the Being perfect in power, wisdom, and goodness who is worshiped as creator and ruler of the universe b Christian Science : the incorporeal divine Principle ruling over all as eternal Spirit : infinite Mind
2 : a being or object believed to have more than natural attributes and powers and to require human worship; specifically : one controlling a particular aspect or part of reality
3 : a person or thing of supreme value
4 : a powerful ruler

Main Entry: re·li·gion
Pronunciation: ri-'li-j&n
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English religioun, from Latin religion-, religio supernatural constraint, sanction, religious practice, perhaps from religare to restrain, tie back -- more at RELY
1 a : the state of a religious b (1) : the service and worship of God or the supernatural (2) : commitment or devotion to religious faith or observance
2 : a personal set or institutionalized system of religious attitudes, beliefs, and practices
3 archaic : scrupulous conformity : CONSCIENTIOUSNESS
4 : a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with ardor and faith

Main Entry: be·lief
Pronunciation: b&-'lEf
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English beleave, probably alteration of Old English gelEafa, from ge-, associative prefix + lEafa; akin to Old English lyfan
1 : a state or habit of mind in which trust or confidence is placed in some person or thing
2 : something believed; especially : a tenet or body of tenets held by a group
3 : conviction of the truth of some statement or the reality of some being or phenomenon especially when based on examination of evidence

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Dont think u get it

Oxford English Dictionary

Atheism.the theory or belief that god does not exist

i dont believe in the theory or belief that god exists therefore i am an atheist

quote:

Originally posted by George Smiley Ok, first of all, and perhaps most importantly of all, Jesus did not rise from the dead because people do not rise from the dead, it is not physically possible. Secondly, to say the accounts of his life were written by "eye-witnesses" is laughable. They weren't. They were written years and years after Jesus died. There are no "eye-witness" accounts, just legends and myths passed down the generations by word of mouth. Thirdly, I am led to believe there is evidence in the Bible that it could have been possible for Jesus to fake his crucifiction as it happened in Joseph's private garden while the crowd were far away.

whoever said jesus was the average man. are u saying god doesnt have the power to raise people from the dead?? jesus is god himself, how could death defeat god?? it is physically possbile because there are many accounts of people rising from the dead. even today, people are rising from the dead.

tell me how the accounts werent written by eye-witnesses? they were written by matthew, mark, luke, and john. and corroborated by numourous other documents and books. luke was not an eye-witness, but if u read the first chapter, his goal was to interview all the eye-witnesses and make the best account possible. luke was very educated, and his book is the offspring of his investigation into jesus's life. mathew, mark, and john all spent 3 years with jesus and saw everything that went on. all their accounts were written within 40 years of jesus's death and resurrection. what would be the purpose to write their books immediatly after jesus died and rose?? the story wasnt over yet. there was time needed to gather all this that had gone and to finally write a book about it.

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Thirdly, I am led to believe there is evidence in the Bible that it could have been possible for Jesus to fake his crucifiction as it happened in Joseph's private garden while the crowd were far away.

where is this in the bible. show it to me?? so, the trial in the synagogue, the trial before pilate, the physical torture the roman put him in, the whipping, the flogging, the spitting, the beating, his summoning before herod, and his final judgement from pilate are all false?? the romans and jews just staged a play and faked it all?? there is no more heard of joseph after the story of jesus teaching in the synagogue when he was 12. so by the time jesus was 33, its thought that he was probably dead, or not around.

your arguements have no basis behind them.

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I agree with you about the definitions you just get bogged down..at the same time i still maintain that i or anyone else can be an atheist as regard religion god or whatever

so, clarification, even though it proves u wrong, is bogging everybody down?? your arguement as well is just stated opinion with no basis. the reason im putting up definitions is to bring facts into this arugement. the dictionary is factual. you have put up nothing but stated opinions. ive proved my point. prove yours.

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That is trully a pointless reply...

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First thing we learn about emotion, is that it has it's price. A complete paradox. But without control, without restraint, emotion is C H A O S.

Seriously TranceVanDyk, you cannot cross examine someone's thoughts and mind on the internet just through a process where you have vaguely understood the person and strongly claims that he is not an athesist. An athesist is a person that does no believe in God itself, or the person might not be that cultivated in philosophical thoughts, and believe there 'might' be one, but not the ones represented in popular culture (Allah, God) etc.; those people are deists...

So you are saying

Belief => Religion
Religion => God

thus

science isa belief
however; as a normal 'atheist'; he cultivate his thoughts on that there is no God, what he sees what he can touch, and is "real" in this world is his believes. He knows if he jumps off a 10 storey building that that Laws of Physics would certainly kill the poor buggar, that's where his beliefs are.

Some of the definitions you put down there are kinda FUBAR, they use the similar words in the definition itself; for example, in the definition 'religion'.

As i said, are those definition 'for all' or just loose definitions? If they are loose definitions, then you can "loosely" imply that
Belief => Religion
Religion => God
However, that use it completely to define a character, that he has a God, and he is the God of Science :|...

You havnt proven your point you keep giving definitions for 1.God 2.Religion 3.Belief

Now go to the oxford english and get a definition for atheism ive quoted it twice allready its very short and simple.

The reason i get down bogged down with handling script or passages of it is 1.i cant type very fast 2.my html skills are pretty bad ..i dont get bogged down in making the point that i or anyone else can consider themself an atheist

Look up the definition of the word and post that word for word

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Originally posted by zig Dont think u get it Oxford English Dictionary Atheism.the theory or belief that god does not exist i dont believe in the theory or belief that god exists therefore i am an atheist

can u show me the oxford english dictionary. i tried to find it but couldnt find the place to look up words. definition 2, clauses A and B states 2 a : a disbelief in the existence of deity b : the doctrine that there is no deity

doesnt say god. nobody ever god has to be a diety. i can call tiesto or paul van dyk god if i want, but they are not supernatural dieties. so, to say u dont believe in god, is to say u dont believe in anything, science, religion(any), you just sit there with no opinions, no belief system.

Main Entry: athe·ism
Pronunciation: 'A-thE-"i-z&m
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle French athéisme, from athée atheist, from Greek atheos godless, from a- + theos god
1 archaic : UNGODLINESS, WICKEDNESS
2 a : a disbelief in the existence of deity b : the doctrine that there is no deity

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Ill post you the book its quite large though..