While the number of bigger djs making the switch is certainly a step forward the way in which they use ableton has most certainly been very weak so far.

I can't wait for some of them to actually step up and use the program to it's fullest extent.

If you go on the ableton forums you can imagine how these mega 1337 users feel insulted when you see a screenshot of sasha playing on his G5 imac with only 7 samples loaded. That's such a weak usage of the software.

So far the only one who has genuinely impressed me has been Richie Hawtin. He is surely responsible for a lot of the improvements with Ableton having been involved with their development team directly working on specific projects ( like Mutek 2004 liveset which was a milestone. Check out the video footage you'll understand )

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Originally posted by Toufas sasha doesnt use ableton on its full potential...

Also...so what if hes not using the software to its full potential. He's using it the way he wants, to get the sound he wants. Its just another tool. Nobody bashes Digweed for using CDJs but not looping/scratching like Zabiela does.

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Originally posted by ******** Seplling don't demonstrate intelligence and educatoin - knowing does.

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Originally posted by Col Ditto. No skill involved.

umm.. im guessing the only thing that you have seen use ableton live is your dog. to a decent dj, beatmatching on decks and cdjs involves no skill, lets face it its a piece of piss. using ableton live opens up doors that decks and cdjs are unable to offer. if a "dj" uses ableton to do nothing but mix one tune into another using the god dam cross fader and bass knob then yes there is no skill required, but do u really think thats whats involved? go see a decent dj use ableton live, then come back and tell me it involves no skill. there is little skill involved in beatmatching, the only thing that makes ableton any easier is that you dont have to do this simple task which takes about 10 seconds anyway if you are a good dj.

sure its impossible to trainwreck (unless you are a complete knobber) but djing has evolved from just mixing one tune into another, its becoming more artistic and inventive, its changing and delevoping like everything else. get over it.

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I'm so so so so so SO sick of hearing everyone rant and rave about Ableton whenever it comes up. You have people going on either about how it's the biggest thing since wax, or the complete opposite with people hating on it saying it takes absolutely no skill.

Just like turntables and CDJs, Ableton is just another way for the music to be expressed. It's not the program that makes the DJ, it's the DJ that makes the DJ. Not any old person can step up to turntables and sound innovative and amazing - the same thing applies here. Working in Ableton takes a lot of practice to sound good and seasoned. You can't just load it up and become the next big thing. I've been working with it since 2.5 and I'm still not perfect - it's a work in progress, just like with turntables and CDJs. This is NOT the death of the DJ, it's just another way for DJs to get music out to the masses. It's not about just pressing play and calling it a day, it really is more than that.

I'm not going to say that them including mp3 support in Live 5 doesn't make me a little jealous because it does - it makes it easier for people to jump right in and start working with it. However, this will force people like me to step up their game, spend more time with the program, and get a better sound with it and really improve the music as a whole.

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http://www.myspace.com/retrobytemusic

Last two replies are excellent...

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Originally posted by ******** Seplling don't demonstrate intelligence and educatoin - knowing does.

Nic Fanciulli used ableton when he was at Lush last week. And besides the people in the dj booth noone even noticed! Simply cause everyone was having to good a time with some awsome music to give a fuck!

Its about music...plain and simple! Personally i dont care at all if the djs use records, cds or a laptop. Im not there to watch them take a record out of its cover, a cdj out of its sleeve in the case, or to see him hitting some buttons on a laptop. Im there for the music...

It doesnt take very long to get to grips with mixing...to be honest if u practised enough not very long at all. Once uve got it...theres fuk all to it. Theres alot more to djing than getting two records matched up. Ableton doesnt take anything like track selection, programming of mixes, reading the crowd, etc away from the dj.

If your a bad dj with vinyls cds etc ableton isnt going to make you good...the only difference being maybe ur mixies will be in time.

Its people with no imagination wotsoever that are agaisnt it. They are scared cause atm mostly everyone does the exact same as they are doing..line up to tracks and mix them, repeat till end of the set. But what happens when you can edit tracks on the fly, edit here there and everywhere differently in every set you play, do things you just cudnt think of using vinyls and traditional mixing techniques. If people are happy to simply get 2 tracks at the same speed and play the exact same track over and over in different sets then fair enough.

Rant over...dont be so small minded to not give it a chance ffs. Use it alongside vinyls, cds etc. Its an amazing tool that like it or not is part of the future and imo will set good djs apart even more from the typical copycats.

Deleted my post by accident lol

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Originally posted by Demoted I agree mostly with this, save the whole "I'm not there to see the dj." Sure, I'm there for the music, in fact, that's the main reason why I'm there. But I also like it when a dj interacts with a crowd. When I go to a rave or a club I usually like to get right up next to the dj booth so I can shake hands with the dj and sometimes even request tracks. I just think it's a unique experience when a musician you admire actually will take personal requests from fans live on set. With Abelton, most of the djs I've seen use it live spend their entire time stuck behind the monitor trying to lace the tracks a certain way. Now, if a dj can use Abelton, and cdjs, and vinyl, and all of this, and still maintain crowd interaction, I'm all for it. I don't have a problem at all with Abelton, just the djs who can't seem to tear themselves awway from the computer to actually get in with what the crowd is feeling and shake hands with some of the many, many fans.

Thats why i think atm using ableton with cdjs,technics etc is such a good idea. It gives u the chance to do all the normal bits but then create really really special parts of a set. I really really dont see why so many people are agaisnt it.....the skill issue is the biggest load of bullshit ever.

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Originally posted by Toufas so when u are using a laptop u are sitting down....right...

thats obviously not what i meant

my point is, it wouldnt be the same if a dj was sitting down, thers nothin wrong with it.... but its not the same


IMO its the same mixing just of a laptop, thers nothing really wrong with it, but its just not the same for me,

PS. im willing to to be changed on this, if i find myself stood behind sasha while he mixes thinkin "Wow, thats amazing", then il be changed

iv never seen a DJ using ableton live, tho i hav got zabs set done on ableton

as of yet tho i just dont see the point, maybe iv just not seen it used to full potential yet

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Originally posted by Rob H PS. im willing to to be changed on this, if i find myself stood behind sasha while he mixes thinkin "Wow, thats amazing", then il be changed iv never seen a DJ using ableton live, tho i hav got zabs set done on ableton as of yet tho i just dont see the point, maybe iv just not seen it used to full potential yet

well do u think people are just doing it coz they cant be bothered to beatmatch? if so you are oh so wrong.

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Originally posted by Rob H PS. im willing to to be changed on this, if i find myself stood behind sasha while he mixes thinkin "Wow, thats amazing", then il be changed iv never seen a DJ using ableton live, tho i hav got zabs set done on ableton as of yet tho i just dont see the point, maybe iv just not seen it used to full potential yet

Like Sasha said...it puts a little magic back into it.

I saw him live...and he even spent quite some time crouched behind his laptop so all you could see was the very top of his head and his hands, one on the maven and one on his trackball.

He would manipulate the sounds while sitting like this so it was almost impossible to tell what the hell he was doing. Hands down most amazing DJ I have seen yet.

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Originally posted by ******** Seplling don't demonstrate intelligence and educatoin - knowing does.