Re: Zombie0915,
I'm not trying to associate "intelligent" music (to be honest, I think that idea is fairly ambiguous, and as you said, dick waggery) with complex music. Intelligent music has to do with the words and meanings an artist tries to attach to the music, not unlike the name, progressive. Complexity, on the other hand, is something that is inherent in the music itself. It's true that many artists who consider themselves "intelligent" utilize complexity to such an end, but that shouldn't blind one to the producers that simply use it to make danceable music, for such people do exist.

And certainly there is no shame in simple stuff, but then I think I've already made it clear that the complexity in a piece of music and its "goodness" are not related.

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Originally posted by Spirit5 Oh and you misspelled "nazi", it's NAZI not "naxi" so now i'm being the spelling nazi..i mean naxi...

I didnt even notice I hit x instead of z, lol.

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Originally posted by thoughtlessjex And certainly there is no shame in simple stuff, but then I think I've already made it clear that the complexity in a piece of music and its "goodness" are not related.

Precisely. I was adressing what ish said about EDM supposedly being simple, but I've known alot of music that was incredibly complex and I really didn't like, as well as some really simple pieces that are some of my favorite.

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Originally posted by thoughtlessjex Intelligent music has to do with the words and meanings an artist tries to attach to the music, not unlike the name, progressive.

I find this idea annoying and interesting at the same time. So music in itself cannot be intelligent, but a musician can do things in attempt to assiciate his music with being intelligent. So you are considering "intelligent music" as a meme, rather than an adjective that actually describes some observable trait in the sound. I argue that the people who flock to stuff that treats intelligence like a buzzword are no more intelligent than your average trance fan, much in the same way the progressive flock is no more forward thinking. These types of things bother me because they are just gimmicks that musicians use, and no gimmick is inherently surperior to any other, yet they all spout on about the merits of their chosen gimmick like its the second(third?) coming of jesus, then people come to this site and parrot all that bullshit. So people make simple dancable music that they market with the word "intelligent". I am aware that these types exist, personally I would prefer that they used a different strategy though, say, describing the actual traits of their sound instead of spouting buzzwords, that is goofy .com bubble business bullshit. I guess if it were up to me, all the musical descriptions would be actual musical descriptions rather than buzzwords that artists of a particular style associate themselves with(I would even call trance by a different name for that very reason, but it is not my decision). Music carries no meaning(aside from vocals and enclosed program notes) in itself without cultural context, so such buzzword named genres are defined by their marketing and the culture surrounding them.

I wasn't actually directing any of those comments at you speficically jex, I realize you weren't the one saying that complexity = surperiority and were just trying to show how the underworld track was complex without containing the specific features ishkur named, and I agree, complexity can exist in a track that demonstrates some things that were not mentioned in his post.

So thoughtlessjex, words and meanings much like the ones found in BT - Fibonacci Sequence? would that qualify as intelligent?(most people I meet seem to think that song is stupid, but I enjoy it, heheh)

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Originally posted by thoughtlessjex There is no doubt in my mind that performing classical violin is more complex a procedure than performing trance

Of course. I wasn't referring to the performance part either, I meant the music itself.

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Tell me where someone directly says that. You are inferring a logical fallacy to aid your argument by working me into a semantic corner and I have no time for that. Stick to the topic, please.

Sorry to waste your valuable time.

Note the word "seem" in my post. I get the impression that people have that view. Especially when they feel the eager to prove their view on EDM as "complex". I didn't refer to you specifically if that's what you thought.

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So thoughtlessjex, words and meanings much like the ones found in BT - Fibonacci Sequence? would that qualify as intelligent?

I think it's a geek joke, really. So I wouldn't call it intelligent as much as I'd call it geeky, sort of like the sample used in Man With No Name - Teleport. Ish is at least right insofar as saying that EDM is often very silly. Personally, I'd say Fibonacci Sequence is one of those songs that's stupid, but doesn't take itself seriously, at least as far as the words are concerned, so one is free to enjoy it and laugh at the joke.

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Of course. I wasn't referring to the performance part either, I meant the music itself.

Would you care, then, to back up your sweeping statement with proof that all classical music is inherently more complex than trance?

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Note the word "seem" in my post. I get the impression that people have that view. Especially when they feel the eager to prove their view on EDM as "complex".

And note that I said "inferring." I know perfectly well that you were stating nothing as fact, I was simply pointing out that there was no reason for the comment you made.

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I think personality has more to do with musical preference than IQ. but even then the relationship is very complex. I was gonna do some correlational research for a project for uni on personality traits vs musical tastes but there is ZERO research about personality or IQ vs msucial preference in psychology so i scraped it.

Call me a moron, but the people I know of that listen to Trance seem rather open-minded, mature and somewhat more intelligent, however those that listen to hip-hip/rap etc. generally have limited knowledge in comparison and tend to be very ignorant. I don't know, I'm not saying everyone's like that, it's just what I've witnessed.

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Originally posted by stealthman Call me a moron, but the people I know of that listen to Trance seem rather open-minded, mature and somewhat more intelligent, however those that listen to hip-hip/rap etc. generally have limited knowledge in comparison and tend to be very ignorant. I don't know, I'm not saying everyone's like that, it's just what I've witnessed.

Alot of trance people are very closed-minded towards rap and hip hop. But I see your point. However this is because trance isn't mainstream so you have to dig a bit to find it, which requires you to be open to begin with, it doesn't have anything to do with the actual music.

trance > IQ