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TranceAddict Forums > Local Scene Info / Discussion / EDM Event Listings > Canada > Canada - Toronto & Southern Ont. > Tips & Low Prices, or No Tips & Higher Prices
Which of the two would you rather have?
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I'd prefer higher prices on everything, but no tips required or expected. 14 23.73%
I like the lower prices and tipping for service. 45 76.27%
Total: 59 votes 100%
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Enraptured
Supreme tranceaddict



Registered: Nov 2003
Location: Right here, Right now, All the way.

quote:
Originally posted by TO guy
It's not that I'm against tipping or anything like that. But how is this an argument? Lots of people have shitty jobs. Lots of people are working when everyone else is having fun. If you don't like your job, get a better one. Why should people feel sorry for people that don't like their jobs?


I didn't say that people SHOULD tip the coat check, I just said that I do. I'm not here to tell YOU what you should and shouldn't do, you have a conscience for that, I assume.

I'm just saying that's MY opinion... I have a pretty strong suspicion that the people working coat check don't make very good money. So a couple of bucks, if they get it from every person coming through their line, will make them happy. And I'm all for making people happy.

What's a toonie to me? But if say... five hundred people leave their coats, and a toonie, well that's a very good night for coat-check, no?

Think about what a club would be like with NO coat check, because they couldn't get anyone to do it? Yeah. Not fun. Or a coat-check you couldn't trust?

As for the bouncers, they are paid WAY WAY better than the coat-check... it's not the same thing. They are not "service" personnel.


___________________
anyone lived in a pretty how town
(with up so floating many bells down)
spring summer autumn winter
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-e.e. cummings


My Blog Space... Veritas Lux Mea

Old Post Jun-09-2006 17:06  Canada
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zokissima
Supreme tranceaddict



Registered: Dec 2004
Location: Toronto

quote:
If my server...

a.) is friendly and polite
b.) comes by and asks how the meal is
c.) checks every once in a while for refills
d.) asks how every thing was when bringing the bill

i usually tip 20%

if they fail to do any of the above mentioned, knock off roughly 5% for each missed.


That's roughly the system I follow. I base my tip on the service provided.
But there are exceptions. For example; there's a new mexican food (practically fast food) store, and their Interac machine allows the tip option. I hate "non-full-service" restaurant staff asking for tips. Fcuk off, they make the legal minimum wage, and I had to bust my balls for years working those jobs too. We all gotta do it at one time or another. Don't like your job, quit.
My gf used to work in the food industry, and as a waitress as well. Thanks to her urging, I now spend a fortune on tips. All the while grumbling

Old Post Jun-09-2006 17:21  Yugoslavia
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Euphorica
Next level beats



Registered: Sep 2004
Location: GTA

trying to talk with "servers " etc about tipping is like trying to get a square block into a round hole ...


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Old Post Jun-09-2006 17:29  Canada
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Enraptured
Supreme tranceaddict



Registered: Nov 2003
Location: Right here, Right now, All the way.

quote:
Originally posted by Euphorica
trying to talk with "servers " etc about tipping is like trying to get a square block into a round hole ...


Heh... are you detecting a bias??

But really, all kidding aside, even BEFORE I was a server I tipped well.

Now that I see how hard it really IS to be aserver, especially when it's really BUSY... i can appreciate the amount of work it takes.

Perspective is everything, right?


___________________
anyone lived in a pretty how town
(with up so floating many bells down)
spring summer autumn winter
he sang his didn't he danced his did.
-e.e. cummings


My Blog Space... Veritas Lux Mea

Old Post Jun-09-2006 17:40  Canada
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geroin
Supreme tranceaddict



Registered: Nov 2003
Location:

Servers make 6.25 h, without tips they make nothing so they highly depends on it. Also working on the floor and in the kitchen is not comparable. Kitchen is strictly a physical job, do this, do that and youre done. When you're on the floor you have to be constantly smiling and be happy no matter whats on your mind. Customers always complain no matter how good you are and most of the time you bust your ass off to make the money you do. I used to carry like 5 plates in each hand because we had no time to go and comebck and they would burn the hands and forearms because the food was so fucking hot and the plates jsut came out from a dishwasher. People always bitch that its not what they ordered so when you have to comeback you have another tables food coming out so you had to deal with already busy kitchen to remake the food for that table which caused extreme confusion for everyone. There is way way more things i dont have time to mention right now but you basically bust your ass for the money you make so tipping is important.

Old Post Jun-09-2006 18:02  Russia
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Enraptured
Supreme tranceaddict



Registered: Nov 2003
Location: Right here, Right now, All the way.

Interesting article...

http://www.newyorker.com/talk/conte...talk_surowiecki

"In an extensive survey of tipping studies, Michael Lynn, a professor at Cornell, found only a weak correlation between the quality of service that people report receiving and the tips they give. On average, exceptional service raised tips by about 1.5 per cent, which, Lynn argues, is too small for waiters to notice. And countries where there’s no tipping—like Australia and Japan—don’t have worse service than the United States."

Sort of flies against what I'VE been saying eh? I like shooting down my own arguments!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tipping

Breaks down tipping practices by region/country.


___________________
anyone lived in a pretty how town
(with up so floating many bells down)
spring summer autumn winter
he sang his didn't he danced his did.
-e.e. cummings


My Blog Space... Veritas Lux Mea

Old Post Jun-09-2006 18:40  Canada
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Cosmic Fur
Debbie Downer



Registered: Jan 2005
Location: Mississauga, Canada

So far, the argument that I see is that tipping is an incentive to work harder. But, if that were true, so would the following:

=> People with jobs that are not tipped, and thus have no incentive to work well, wouldn't do an up-to-par job. That is not true. If people get paid well, even if it is flat-rate, they are generally happy and generally do an up-to-par job. So pay servers well for the work that they do, and they'll generally do a good job like the rest of us. A high flat-rate pay is as much incentive to walk around with a smile as is getting tips.

Because of external factors (quality of food, performance of kitchen staff) that servers have no control over, people who tip 15% regardless of service, cheap people who tip 5% even if you worked your ass off, generous people, and people who tip based on attractiveness; all that more than offsets people like Floorwhore who religiously tip properly based on the actual service, so on average you getyour 15% tips regardless of how well you worked today. And this amkes the tipping system as inefficient as the flat rate system.

My gripe is not with tipping when you get great service. My gripe is with feeling obligated to tip when I received up-to-par service.

In non-tipping positions, people who excel at their jobs also get rewarded - raises, promotions, etc. People who are up-to-par stay in the same place. People who aren't, eventually either quit or get fired. I don't see why a manager in a restaurant can't do the same with their employees.

Oh, and the argument "we work hard so we should get tipped" is completely bogus - if you work hard, you should be paid more, if you don't like it, quit. Free-market forces work well enough that if everybody suddenly stopped paying the mandatory tips, restaurant wages and prices would rise to the point where there would be a pool of workers willing to do the job well at the market wage.


___________________
I'm the trouble starter, fuckin' instigator.
I'm the fear-addicted, danger illustrated.

Old Post Jun-09-2006 19:17  Canada
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simms327
Ministry of Small



Registered: Nov 2003
Location: part of the generation of low attention spans

quote:
Originally posted by Enraptured
"In an extensive survey of tipping studies, Michael Lynn, a professor at Cornell, found only a weak correlation between the quality of service that people report receiving and the tips they give. On average, exceptional service raised tips by about 1.5 per cent, which, Lynn argues, is too small for waiters to notice.


thats my argument against tipping, it has become so standard, that some people leave tip regardless, and if all exceptional service gets you 1.5% extra, then thats not a huge incentive...

so some people expect tip regardless of if all they said was "hi, what would you like" and then leave a smiley on the bill.

Old Post Jun-09-2006 19:24  Canada
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Cosmic Fur
Debbie Downer



Registered: Jan 2005
Location: Mississauga, Canada

quote:
Originally posted by simms327
so some people expect tip regardless of if all they said was "hi, what would you like" and then leave a smiley on the bill.


EXACTLY!

If they did EXACTLY the job they are supposed to (and I think being nice ot the customer is part of the job), why do I have to pay them extra?


___________________
I'm the trouble starter, fuckin' instigator.
I'm the fear-addicted, danger illustrated.

Old Post Jun-09-2006 19:32  Canada
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geroin
Supreme tranceaddict



Registered: Nov 2003
Location:

quote:
Originally posted by Cosmic Fur
EXACTLY!

If they did EXACTLY the job they are supposed to (and I think being nice ot the customer is part of the job), why do I have to pay them extra?


you never have to tip them anything, that is why it is called a tip. It's pretty much a courtesy or a tradition where you tip a waiter after you've been served. It also shows that you have class especially when you're with a girl.

Plus depending on the tip you leave them next time you will recieve a better service, examples would be: Restaurant is full and one table is left, i will seat people that were nicer to me the previous night and i will seat them first, make sure their drinks are right there and ready and the food the best it could be. Yes, we do remember nice customers that tip well 85% of the time. If you show up 2-3times, leave a nice tip i will remember you 100% and i will give you the best and the fastest service I can provide so you will comeback and will tip me well again.

Another example would be me getting a haircut at a local barber place, because i tippped well they let me stay and get my haircut 5minutes before their closing time everytime i showed up, but kicked everybody else out because they tip a loonie or a toonie. The haircut was like 14 bucks and i would always leave a 20 so no matter what i always got my haircut if its busy or not.

Old Post Jun-09-2006 19:52  Russia
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Cosmic Fur
Debbie Downer



Registered: Jan 2005
Location: Mississauga, Canada

quote:
Originally posted by geroin
Plus depending on the tip you leave them next time you will recieve a better service, examples would be: Restaurant is full and one table is left, i will seat people that were nicer to me the previous night and i will seat them first, make sure their drinks are right there and ready and the food the best it could be. Yes, we do remember nice customers that tip well 85% of the time. If you show up 2-3times, leave a nice tip i will remember you 100% and i will give you the best and the fastest service I can provide so you will comeback and will tip me well again.

Another example would be me getting a haircut at a local barber place, because i tippped well they let me stay and get my haircut 5minutes before their closing time everytime i showed up, but kicked everybody else out because they tip a loonie or a toonie. The haircut was like 14 bucks and i would always leave a 20 so no matter what i always got my haircut if its busy or not.


That's just bribery. ESPECIALLY the barbershop example.


___________________
I'm the trouble starter, fuckin' instigator.
I'm the fear-addicted, danger illustrated.

Old Post Jun-09-2006 19:58  Canada
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geroin
Supreme tranceaddict



Registered: Nov 2003
Location:

quote:
Originally posted by Cosmic Fur
That's just bribery. ESPECIALLY the barbershop example.


call it what you want but thats the way most if not all places operate.

Old Post Jun-09-2006 20:08  Russia
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TranceAddict Forums > Local Scene Info / Discussion / EDM Event Listings > Canada > Canada - Toronto & Southern Ont. > Tips & Low Prices, or No Tips & Higher Prices
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