So what does "master" mean?

Is the same as when Big Dave makes me call him master at the Happy Man's Leather Club over in big town?

___________________
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quote:

Originally posted by DJ Shibby Perhaps the suggestion to mix after arranging was given by someone in a different era? In 2006, if you buy a new PC, you can even MASTER while arranging!

I got it, and I lol'd. At first I was like Shibby, but THEN I realized you were being sorta sarcastic.

We have to all write a great new DAW. We'll call it "Gold Button"

It will only have one button when you load the program, and it will compose, arrange, mix, and master an entire track!


---
Back on topic:

I am working on a project right now. Where I'm going to do my intensive mixing after the fact. Shibby, personally one of my favorite sub-genres of electronic music is Psy, so I do spend LOTS of technical time during composing to get the kick and bass feeling just right. But aside from that... I still tend to do all my mixing after the track is arranged.

But it's a hard habit of new "producers" like myself, having been born in the age of computers, to shake myself of just "doing it all in one go."

I have SO many unfinished projects, simply because I lost the creative juice train. I lost it! Because I kept getting buggered out about the mixing. I'm serious. I'm looking at my Nuendo projects, my Reason projects, and my Acid projects and there's like in total 40 projects or so (with actual "meat" in them) that never got finished.

So recently, as I said above, I'm really trying to separate the fun part of music creation from the different-sort-of-fun part (mixing):

1. Fun = Composing & Arranging
2. Fun = Arranging & Creative Mixing (Crazy panning and make bass sounds hot)
3. Different Fun = Intensive Mixing
4. Not Really Fun = Mastering (and at this point I give it to someone else to do)

Because when it comes right down to it. Unless you're really good with making sure while you're mixing you're also doing some comparative listening, you will by BIASED by the time you're done mixing. So it's GENERALLY always better to have someone else master your track.

---

*Read all of this before you knee-jerk-reply*

Oh and to some of the people in this thread going on about "OH you're complicating things mannnnnnn, it's about the music, mannnnnnn." Grow up you fucking hippies. lol. (I just wanted to say "fucking hippies" no offense meant)

Because in the real world of music production, generally, hippies don't make the cheddar, don't see success, and basically don't make good music. Sure they "feel" the music, and are "connecting" to some kind of vibe. But I don't know about you, but as much as I "feel" my music. I WANT TO MAKE IT ACCESSIBLE TO OTHER PEOPLE! Because I want other people to feel my music, and it's a good feeling when people come up to you and go "wow that was really a good song, good job."

EVERYONE LIKES THAT FEELING. Otherwise you wouldn't create art in the first place. You think your own art is just about you? And the way it makes just YOU feel. Then why would play your music for other people?

And I know some people will say to me: "Jeeze, that DJFreaq kid, damn what a retard, srsly"

Now I know I'm still young relatively (20 yrs) and I have no real experience in the music business. But I've been going to the Art Institute of Seattle for about 2 years now, and I've seen this argument too many times. It happens between students, and it happens between students and teachers. And it's an interesting dynamic. Mainly because some of the teachers are washed up engineers that had limited success, and some are engineers that were/ARE successful. But both those types of teachers have the same argument.

Hippies never win.

And I guess this comes down to separating, what's a hobby, and what's an obsession. Because if it's a hobby to you, then arguments like--"Oh you're complicating it, it's about the music"--make sense. And in essence it IS about the music. That's why I'm obsessed with it. That's why I like being creative. But that doesn't mean I loose sight of tried and true methods for creating good polished pieces of art that everyone can enjoy.

WOW. Excuse the rant. I need to boil that down sometime into some more coherent thoughts. K. I tried highlighting the important points.

EDIT: This is an interesting side-thought, its not original, and I it's a very common occurance.

Why not make a team effort on creating a track? Thios was saying "Oh just be creative, and one day you'll make awesome stuff." That is WRONG by itself. And then other people like Deriv is saying "You HAVE to be technical and MIX MIX after your arrange compose." And that is SORT of wrong by itself.

Shit. Just make music with a partner. That essentially what you're doing with a ROCK BAND + RECORDING ENGINEER. Some of the best electronic music acts out there are duos. One guy can be retarded about technical mixing aspects, and just make good sounding tunes, and the other dude can be still pretty creative, but more focused on mixing the track. My friend Vadim and I are doing that right now. And it works pretty well.

Anyway, I haven't eaten breakfast and I'm starting to rant again. Fuck. I might just delete this post.

___________________
Soundcloud

Last edited by wrzonance on Jun-14-2006 at 16:01

quote:

Originally posted by DJFreaq I got it, and I lol'd. At first I was like Shibby, but THEN I realized you were being sorta sarcastic. We have to all write a great new DAW. We'll call it "Gold Button" It will only have one button when you load the program, and it will compose, arrange, mix, and master an entire track! --- Back on topic: I am working on a project right now. Where I'm going to do my intensive mixing after the fact. Shibby, personally one of my favorite sub-genres of electronic music is Psy, so I do spend LOTS of technical time during composing to get the kick and bass feeling just right. But aside from that... I still tend to do all my mixing after the track is arranged. But it's a hard habit of new "producers" like myself, having been born in the age of computers, to shake myself of just "doing it all in one go." I have SO many unfinished projects, simply because I lost the creative juice train. I lost it! Because I kept getting buggered out about the mixing. I'm serious. I'm looking at my Nuendo projects, my Reason projects, and my Acid projects and there's like in total 40 projects or so (with actual "meat" in them) that never got finished. So recently, as I said above, I'm really trying to separate the fun part of music creation from the different-sort-of-fun part (mixing): 1. Fun = Composing & Arranging 2. Fun = Arranging & Creative Mixing (Crazy panning and make bass sounds hot) 3. Different Fun = Intensive Mixing 4. Not Really Fun = Mastering (and at this point I give it to someone else to do) Because when it comes right down to it. Unless you're really good with making sure while you're mixing you're also doing some comparative listening, you will by BIASED by the time you're done mixing. So it's GENERALLY always better to have someone else master your track. --- *Read all of this before you knee-jerk-reply* Oh and to some of the people in this thread going on about "OH you're complicating things mannnnnnn, it's about the music, mannnnnnn." Grow up you fucking hippies. lol. (I just wanted to say "fucking hippies" no offense meant) Because in the real world of music production, generally, hippies don't make the cheddar, don't see success, and basically don't make good music. Sure they "feel" the music, and are "connecting" to some kind of vibe. But I don't know about you, but as much as I "feel" my music. I WANT TO MAKE IT ACCESSIBLE TO OTHER PEOPLE! Because I want other people to feel my music, and it's a good feeling when people come up to you and go "wow that was really a good song, good job." EVERYONE LIKES THAT FEELING. Otherwise you wouldn't create art in the first place. You think your own art is just about you? And the way it makes just YOU feel. Then why would play your music for other people? And I know some people will say to me: "Jeeze, that DJFreaq kid, damn what a retard, srsly" Now I know I'm still young relatively (20 yrs) and I have no real experience in the music business. But I've been going to the Art Institute of Seattle for about 2 years now, and I've seen this argument too many times. It happens between students, and it happens between students and teachers. And it's an interesting dynamic. Mainly because some of the teachers are washed up engineers that had limited success, and some are engineers that were/ARE successful. But both those types of teachers have the same argument. Hippies never win. And I guess this comes down to separating, what's a hobby, and what's an obsession. Because if it's a hobby to you, then arguments like--"Oh you're complicating it, it's about the music"--make sense. And in essence it IS about the music. That's why I'm obsessed with it. That's why I like being creative. But that doesn't mean I loose sight of tried and true methods for creating good polished pieces of art that everyone can enjoy. WOW. Excuse the rant. I need to boil that down sometime into some more coherent thoughts. K. I tried highlighting the important points. EDIT: This is an interesting side-thought, its not original, and I it's a very common occurance. Why not make a team effort on creating a track? Thios was saying "Oh just be creative, and one day you'll make awesome stuff." That is WRONG by itself. And then other people like Deriv is saying "You HAVE to be technical and MIX MIX after your arrange compose." And that is SORT of wrong by itself. Shit. Just make music with a partner. That essentially what you're doing with a ROCK BAND + RECORDING ENGINEER. Some of the best electronic music acts out there are duos. One guy can be retarded about technical mixing aspects, and just make good sounding tunes, and the other dude can be still pretty creative, but more focused on mixing the track. My friend Vadim and I are doing that right now. And it works pretty well. Anyway, I haven't eaten breakfast and I'm starting to rant again. Fuck. I might just delete this post.

Yep, that about wraps it up :-D
DJS

___________________
MYSPACE
http://www.myspace.com/djsentinelmusic

quote:

Originally posted by DJFreaq I got it, and I lol'd. At first I was like Shibby, but THEN I realized you were being sorta sarcastic. We have to all write a great new DAW. We'll call it "Gold Button" It will only have one button when you load the program, and it will compose, arrange, mix, and master an entire track! --- Back on topic: I am working on a project right now. Where I'm going to do my intensive mixing after the fact. Shibby, personally one of my favorite sub-genres of electronic music is Psy, so I do spend LOTS of technical time during composing to get the kick and bass feeling just right. But aside from that... I still tend to do all my mixing after the track is arranged. But it's a hard habit of new "producers" like myself, having been born in the age of computers, to shake myself of just "doing it all in one go." I have SO many unfinished projects, simply because I lost the creative juice train. I lost it! Because I kept getting buggered out about the mixing. I'm serious. I'm looking at my Nuendo projects, my Reason projects, and my Acid projects and there's like in total 40 projects or so (with actual "meat" in them) that never got finished. So recently, as I said above, I'm really trying to separate the fun part of music creation from the different-sort-of-fun part (mixing): 1. Fun = Composing & Arranging 2. Fun = Arranging & Creative Mixing (Crazy panning and make bass sounds hot) 3. Different Fun = Intensive Mixing 4. Not Really Fun = Mastering (and at this point I give it to someone else to do) Because when it comes right down to it. Unless you're really good with making sure while you're mixing you're also doing some comparative listening, you will by BIASED by the time you're done mixing. So it's GENERALLY always better to have someone else master your track. --- *Read all of this before you knee-jerk-reply* Oh and to some of the people in this thread going on about "OH you're complicating things mannnnnnn, it's about the music, mannnnnnn." Grow up you fucking hippies. lol. (I just wanted to say "fucking hippies" no offense meant) Because in the real world of music production, generally, hippies don't make the cheddar, don't see success, and basically don't make good music. Sure they "feel" the music, and are "connecting" to some kind of vibe. But I don't know about you, but as much as I "feel" my music. I WANT TO MAKE IT ACCESSIBLE TO OTHER PEOPLE! Because I want other people to feel my music, and it's a good feeling when people come up to you and go "wow that was really a good song, good job." EVERYONE LIKES THAT FEELING. Otherwise you wouldn't create art in the first place. You think your own art is just about you? And the way it makes just YOU feel. Then why would play your music for other people? And I know some people will say to me: "Jeeze, that DJFreaq kid, damn what a retard, srsly" Now I know I'm still young relatively (20 yrs) and I have no real experience in the music business. But I've been going to the Art Institute of Seattle for about 2 years now, and I've seen this argument too many times. It happens between students, and it happens between students and teachers. And it's an interesting dynamic. Mainly because some of the teachers are washed up engineers that had limited success, and some are engineers that were/ARE successful. But both those types of teachers have the same argument. Hippies never win. And I guess this comes down to separating, what's a hobby, and what's an obsession. Because if it's a hobby to you, then arguments like--"Oh you're complicating it, it's about the music"--make sense. And in essence it IS about the music. That's why I'm obsessed with it. That's why I like being creative. But that doesn't mean I loose sight of tried and true methods for creating good polished pieces of art that everyone can enjoy. WOW. Excuse the rant. I need to boil that down sometime into some more coherent thoughts. K. I tried highlighting the important points. EDIT: This is an interesting side-thought, its not original, and I it's a very common occurance. Why not make a team effort on creating a track? Thios was saying "Oh just be creative, and one day you'll make awesome stuff." That is WRONG by itself. And then other people like Deriv is saying "You HAVE to be technical and MIX MIX after your arrange compose." And that is SORT of wrong by itself. Shit. Just make music with a partner. That essentially what you're doing with a ROCK BAND + RECORDING ENGINEER. Some of the best electronic music acts out there are duos. One guy can be retarded about technical mixing aspects, and just make good sounding tunes, and the other dude can be still pretty creative, but more focused on mixing the track. My friend Vadim and I are doing that right now. And it works pretty well. Anyway, I haven't eaten breakfast and I'm starting to rant again. Fuck. I might just delete this post.

Ahmen!

Hippies also smell bad!

___________________
Audio-s

quote:

Originally posted by DJFreaq I got it, and I lol'd. At first I was like Shibby, but THEN I realized you were being sorta sarcastic. We have to all write a great new DAW. We'll call it "Gold Button" It will only have one button when you load the program, and it will compose, arrange, mix, and master an entire track! --- Back on topic: I am working on a project right now. Where I'm going to do my intensive mixing after the fact. Shibby, personally one of my favorite sub-genres of electronic music is Psy, so I do spend LOTS of technical time during composing to get the kick and bass feeling just right. But aside from that... I still tend to do all my mixing after the track is arranged. But it's a hard habit of new "producers" like myself, having been born in the age of computers, to shake myself of just "doing it all in one go." I have SO many unfinished projects, simply because I lost the creative juice train. I lost it! Because I kept getting buggered out about the mixing. I'm serious. I'm looking at my Nuendo projects, my Reason projects, and my Acid projects and there's like in total 40 projects or so (with actual "meat" in them) that never got finished. So recently, as I said above, I'm really trying to separate the fun part of music creation from the different-sort-of-fun part (mixing): 1. Fun = Composing & Arranging 2. Fun = Arranging & Creative Mixing (Crazy panning and make bass sounds hot) 3. Different Fun = Intensive Mixing 4. Not Really Fun = Mastering (and at this point I give it to someone else to do) Because when it comes right down to it. Unless you're really good with making sure while you're mixing you're also doing some comparative listening, you will by BIASED by the time you're done mixing. So it's GENERALLY always better to have someone else master your track. --- *Read all of this before you knee-jerk-reply* Oh and to some of the people in this thread going on about "OH you're complicating things mannnnnnn, it's about the music, mannnnnnn." Grow up you fucking hippies. lol. (I just wanted to say "fucking hippies" no offense meant) Because in the real world of music production, generally, hippies don't make the cheddar, don't see success, and basically don't make good music. Sure they "feel" the music, and are "connecting" to some kind of vibe. But I don't know about you, but as much as I "feel" my music. I WANT TO MAKE IT ACCESSIBLE TO OTHER PEOPLE! Because I want other people to feel my music, and it's a good feeling when people come up to you and go "wow that was really a good song, good job." EVERYONE LIKES THAT FEELING. Otherwise you wouldn't create art in the first place. You think your own art is just about you? And the way it makes just YOU feel. Then why would play your music for other people? And I know some people will say to me: "Jeeze, that DJFreaq kid, damn what a retard, srsly" Now I know I'm still young relatively (20 yrs) and I have no real experience in the music business. But I've been going to the Art Institute of Seattle for about 2 years now, and I've seen this argument too many times. It happens between students, and it happens between students and teachers. And it's an interesting dynamic. Mainly because some of the teachers are washed up engineers that had limited success, and some are engineers that were/ARE successful. But both those types of teachers have the same argument. Hippies never win. And I guess this comes down to separating, what's a hobby, and what's an obsession. Because if it's a hobby to you, then arguments like--"Oh you're complicating it, it's about the music"--make sense. And in essence it IS about the music. That's why I'm obsessed with it. That's why I like being creative. But that doesn't mean I loose sight of tried and true methods for creating good polished pieces of art that everyone can enjoy. WOW. Excuse the rant. I need to boil that down sometime into some more coherent thoughts. K. I tried highlighting the important points. EDIT: This is an interesting side-thought, its not original, and I it's a very common occurance. Why not make a team effort on creating a track? Thios was saying "Oh just be creative, and one day you'll make awesome stuff." That is WRONG by itself. And then other people like Deriv is saying "You HAVE to be technical and MIX MIX after your arrange compose." And that is SORT of wrong by itself. Shit. Just make music with a partner. That essentially what you're doing with a ROCK BAND + RECORDING ENGINEER. Some of the best electronic music acts out there are duos. One guy can be retarded about technical mixing aspects, and just make good sounding tunes, and the other dude can be still pretty creative, but more focused on mixing the track. My friend Vadim and I are doing that right now. And it works pretty well. Anyway, I haven't eaten breakfast and I'm starting to rant again. Fuck. I might just delete this post.

+1

As far as "mastering" goes, by the time you're done, it isn't even so much a process of doing much. At this point, your track should be mixed airtight, and "mastering" should just be a few small changes, checking the stereo field and phasing, and listening on a shitload of different systems subjectively.

Good post.

But, but, but... hippies are great when you need a quick hit of some dank green to kick back and relax (like me and digi here!)

+1

Note to self.. Posting on forums when you have a sore back makes you grouchy..