jerz clearly you are missing my point (as usual). And to tell me to read about something that I deal with on a DAILY basis as my full time job is just ludicrous.

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Originally posted by yankeeBaby jerz clearly you are missing my point (as usual). And to tell me to read about something that I deal with on a DAILY basis as my full time job is just ludicrous.

no, i am not missing your point. you are saying i'm excluding the "grey" area which you apparently think is more expansive than the black and white area combine. i just don't agree with you. for the most part, criminals are usually the victims of crime. of course there are exceptions, but they are called exceptions because it is not the base case.

EDIT: I happen to know grey areas very well. i get paid to find and exploit grey areas. i wouldn't even have a job if grey areas didn't exist.

Last edited by jerZ07002 on Nov-28-2007 at 22:52

thats sad as I don't like to see anybody hurt or killed around the club scene. In Seattle we've had a good 10-15 incidents over the last year or two involving shootings, stabbings, beatings, etc etc. in or around several clubs. Its sad because our local government (mainly just the seattle mayor) is basically trying to shut down the ENTIRE nightlife scene as a result. So because 2 or 3 clubs have a bad rap, the rest of the clubs in the entire city get punished for it. They have a paddy wagon that sits outside of the #1 club in the entire northwest (The Last Supper Club) where I play at with its lights flashing to use as intimidation. He put a huge article in the newspaper how this club was 1 of the top 8 most dangerous clubs in the city yet I've never seen a fight inside the club and have never seen a fight directly outside the front doors of the club

Larry's Nightclub here in Seattle was shut down after Ken Hamlin (who plays for the Seahawks) got beaten into a coma a while back and I think thats what started the mayors push. And instead of looking for a solution that is a win win for everyone, he's goin in and trying to require clubs to pay for an expensive nightclub license (which most couldn't afford anyways) which he can revoke at anytime (which would force them to shut down).

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Originally posted by jerZ07002 no, i am not missing your point. you are saying i'm excluding the "grey" area which you think is more expansive that the black and white area combine. i just don't agree with you. for the most part, criminals are usually the victims of crime. of course their are exceptions, but they are called exceptions because it is not the base case.

Actually you ARE missing my point because what I was trying to say was that people assume too much about the crime before they even know the facts. Names are called, assumptions are made, and conclusions are drawn..... and I was also trying to point out the varying demographics affect how the media presents the info (if they even do at all). I could careless about WHOM is killing WHOM, I was merely stating the various reasons for being involved in a crime is wide.

and for that matter, I really dont give a shit about you constantly looking up shit on wikipedia and google and websites for defintions and facts. The fact that you keep putting up links in every damn thread makes me not even want to respond to your "opinions."

there is no need to repspond to this because you arent going to change my opinion by throwing a website or even your own conclusions at me. I work with criminals daily......I see what I see everyday and I know what I know, and THAT my friend is fact enough for me.

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Originally posted by jerZ07002 EDIT: I happen to know grey areas very well. i get paid to find and exploit grey areas. i wouldn't even have a job if grey areas didn't exist.

yes I know this, jerz, good for you and your job, but I am just saying you dont speak (type?) in a manner that gives any sort of grey area throughout these threads.

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Originally posted by yankeeBaby yes I know this, jerz, good for you and your job, but I am just saying you dont speak (type?) in a manner that gives any sort of grey area throughout these threads.

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Originally posted by jerZ07002 which isn't to say that innocent people are to blame for the crimes committed on them, just that most victims of crimes have a role in what happens to them (e.g., drug dealer getting shot for ripping someone off, gang violence between bloods and crips, etc...)

i would call that grey area. by saying that "most victims of crime" and no "all victims of crime" clearly shows i understand there are other situations. it's just a waste of time to give it more thought than that.

The fact that this was a malicious clime that resulted in a death is the reason people jump to conclusions and start pointing fingers. If the dude died in a car accident nobody would give two shits about his criminal history. I agree with ProggieGuy......9 times out of 10 when shit like this happens in the hip hop community it's a result of putting yourself in that situation. Live like a thug.....die like a thug.

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Originally posted by vtec junkie The fact that this was a malicious clime that resulted in a death is the reason people jump to conclusions and start pointing fingers. If the dude died in a car accident nobody would give two shits about his criminal history. I agree with ProggieGuy......9 times out of 10 when shit like this happens in the hip hop community it's a result of putting yourself in that situation. Live like a thug.....die like a thug.

Yankee: where's the grey in that statement? Live like a thug...die like a thug...this seems to be the consensus, which you seemlying want to ignore.

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Originally posted by yankeeBaby what IF this fight WAS the result of two women's fight and this dude just happened to get caught up in something he had nothing to do with? Not to mention, if you are gonna bring up drugs, there are 500000000 people on this board and in the edm community that use/sell drugs. But if some NYU kid selling/using ecstacy in PACHA was killed, it would be a MUCH bigger headline than the kid selling crack trying to put food on his table in the south bronx, because no one gives a fuck about THAT guy.....when in fact I personally believe that selling drugs to survive/eat/provide shelter/etc.... is slightly more reasonable than selling drugs when you already have tons of money in the bank and you just wanna have "fun" with it.

This is irrelevant. NO ONE, no matter who they are, where they are from and what they are should be selling/buying dope for cash. THAT is just stupid. Putting food on your kids table that was bought with drug money? I am COMPLETELY against that and that person deserves to be punished if caught, as much as the NYU kid deserves to be punished if caught. I mean, drugs are bad, period. People that are in the "business" should know this, otherwise, you are stupid and you deserve it. Theres more to it but I think all of you can draw conclusions based on what I have written here. This is not directed to only you yankeeBaby, but you wrote it and I feel that you are taking it too personal and you need to look at things from a different perspective. In summary, selling/buying drugs to put food on the table is NOT reasonable. Working late to put food on the table, REASONABLE.

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Originally posted by jerZ07002 Yankee: where's the grey in that statement? Live like a thug...die like a thug...this seems to be the consensus, which you seemlying want to ignore.

I am not ignoring that whatsoever. I 100% agree that there are people in gangs or up to no good that they are in a much higher position to be involved in something negative like this.
But I am also saying that MANY people that are doing what they ought to do in life and they are assumed to be this hard-core gangster because they were in the wrong place at the wrong time, or defending themsleves or family, (or whatever the reason may be...). thats ALL I am trying to say. We need to stop making assumptions when we dont know the FACTS (I know you like that word james.) I have a girl client who is smart, intelligent and on the track to college. one night, she ran out of her project building to stop a fight because she saw a girl run after her friend with a knife because of mistaken identity (she thought it was a girl sleeping with her man when in fact it was the wrong person) Both girls were stabbed with the same knife (the one girl grabbed it in defense). Her friend died, and along with it, her only witness. When she was pulling the girls off, the cops came and arrested HER and now she is going to court on: murder charges, gang-related violence, and assault with a deadly weapon. Her whole life lies in the hand of a judge for something she wasnt initially involved in. I have 5000 more stories if you wanna hear them, or ask meredith because she has heard a chunk.


DJ Lord: Maybe I should have written it different. I dont condone anyone out selling drugs, I just see the bias when it comes to the different demographics doing/selling drugs. I see a big difference between what is said about the businessmen who slip off on the weekend and snort a few lines, then the people who are poor and smoke a pipe. I also said "personally" so its just my opinion, that, even tho I dont necessarily condone drugs, I also sometimes see people who cant pay rent because their **jobs** dont pay well enough and they need to find extra ways to pay for their kids food, medicines, etc until they find something better. I also am not a big supporter of people who make a living out of it because its one thing to use it to put yourself thru school or to pay for your kids medical bills or something temporarily for good use (go with me here), but its a whole other thing to be lazy and not get off your ass and get a job EVER. I have worked in a drug addiction center and there are various reasons why people use....some people use up welfare and sit on there asses injecting heroin all day, and this is NOT the type of people I am talking about.

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Originally posted by yankeeBaby I am not ignoring that whatsoever. I 100% agree that there are people in gangs or up to no good that they are in a much higher position to be involved in something negative like this. But I am also saying that MANY people that are doing what they ought to do in life and they are assumed to be this hard-core gangster because they were in the wrong place at the wrong time, or defending themsleves or family, (or whatever the reason may be...). thats ALL I am trying to say. We need to stop making assumptions when we dont know the FACTS (I know you like that word james.) I have a girl client who is smart, intelligent and on the track to college. one night, she ran out of her project building to stop a fight because she saw a girl run after her friend with a knife because of mistaken identity (she thought it was a girl sleeping with her man when in fact it was the wrong person) Both girls were stabbed with the same knife (the one girl grabbed it in defense). Her friend died, and along with it, her only witness. When she was pulling the girls off, the cops came and arrested HER and now she is going to court on: murder charges, gang-related violence, and assault with a deadly weapon. Her whole life lies in the hand of a judge for something she wasnt initially involved in. I have 5000 more stories if you wanna hear them, or ask meredith because she has heard a chunk.

i haven't, nor would i ever, deny that those unfortunate events occur. But the FACT of the matter is that most victims of crime know the perpetrator, and have had some sort of role to play in the crime. obviously that isn't always the case.

i know your mother has said this to you, "stay away from him/her because he/she will get you in trouble." that statement is so true. if you don't involve yourself with elements of crime, the chances of being a victim of crime are not that great.

Last edited by jerZ07002 on Nov-29-2007 at 18:29