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TranceAddict Forums > Other > Political Discussion / Debate > Ok so the bailout was rejected, or whatever
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Groundhog Boy
Stupidity Offends Me



Registered: May 2005
Location: New York, NY

quote:
Originally posted by Q5echo
so you support this bill? interesting

in typical ill-informed and politically naive fashion Groundhog Boy can't come up with a simple explaination as to why the worst Speaker of the House in the history of the Republic can't corral a dozen of her own hand-picked seats to pass this "crap sandwich" of a bill. amazing.

i mean forget that literaly thousands, maybe millions, of concerned citizens across this country leaned on their elected officials Democrat and Republican pleading with them not to pass this bill. no. you gotta take a page from Pelosi to make some petty partisaned comment. bravo. 2 points for originality.

this fight is not over yet. the sky hasn't fallen quite yet. when the next comprimise bill comes along are you going blindly follow Madame Speaker again? or will you bring more of the same after the fact again? i'll be waiting

It's not hard. The bailout isn't favored by the public. The election is in 30-some days. The Democrats refuse to go down in flames to attempt saving this country's economy, only to be voted out of office.

Party isn't the problem here, lack of information, lack of forsight, and stupidity are.


___________________
"Go back to bed america your government is in control
Here's American Gladiators, here is 56 channels of it,
Watch these picturary retards bang their fuckin' skulls together and congratulate you on living in the land of freedom,
Here you go America you are free to do as we tell you
We want your soul
Your cash, your house, your phone, your cash, your house, your life" -Adam Freeland - We Want Your Soul

Old Post Sep-30-2008 02:44  United States
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Groundhog Boy
Stupidity Offends Me



Registered: May 2005
Location: New York, NY

quote:
Originally posted by Lira
That surprised me as well (link in Portuguese). The weird thing is: As far as I know, our economy is doing fine.


From my understanding, Brazil revolves around commodities trading. Global growth is bottom-barrel and China isn't buying from Vale at the prices they're requiring and have boycotted their company. Similarly, the shipping companies that take commodities out of Brazil are getting trounced now.

On a related note, all US steel producers (X, NUE, AKS) were down 10-20%, MTL in Russia was down 18%


___________________
"Go back to bed america your government is in control
Here's American Gladiators, here is 56 channels of it,
Watch these picturary retards bang their fuckin' skulls together and congratulate you on living in the land of freedom,
Here you go America you are free to do as we tell you
We want your soul
Your cash, your house, your phone, your cash, your house, your life" -Adam Freeland - We Want Your Soul

Old Post Sep-30-2008 02:49  United States
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Lebezniatnikov
Stupidity Annoys Me



Registered: Feb 2004
Location: DC

quote:
Originally posted by Q5echo
so you support this bill? interesting

in typical ill-informed and politically naive fashion Groundhog Boy can't come up with a simple explaination as to why the worst Speaker of the House in the history of the Republic can't corral a dozen of her own hand-picked seats to pass this "crap sandwich" of a bill. amazing.

i mean forget that literaly thousands, maybe millions, of concerned citizens across this country leaned on their elected officials Democrat and Republican pleading with them not to pass this bill. no. you gotta take a page from Pelosi to make some petty partisaned comment. bravo. 2 points for originality.

this fight is not over yet. the sky hasn't fallen quite yet. when the next comprimise bill comes along are you going blindly follow Madame Speaker again? or will you bring more of the same after the fact again? i'll be waiting




You can stop waiting now.



c0r version:

Eric Cantor (R) : Waaaaah waaaaah Speaker Pelosi insulted me. My pride is hurt, so I'm gonna throw a tantrum and screw over the economy (again)!

Barney Frank (D) : Eric Cantor disgusts me, but I'll talk dirty to him if it will coax him into doing something for the good of his country for once.


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Old Post Sep-30-2008 02:51  United Nations
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Lira
Ancient BassAddict



Registered: Nov 2001
Location: Brasilia, Brazil

By the way, a journalist today said that, the same way the fall of the Berlin Wall represented the demise of communism, this crisis marks the end of economic liberalism.

Is that so?


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Old Post Sep-30-2008 02:55  Brazil
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jerZ07002
Supreme tranceaddict



Registered: Dec 2006
Location:

quote:
Originally posted by Capitalizt
finally, some common sense on this whole bailout business..


In principal i agree with that economist. However, the reality is likely much bleaker. While I can withstand the some pain with de-leveraging, i can't withstand a 500 basis point LIBOR adjustment on my student loans, or real property tax increases because of increased abandoned properties in town. There are collateral consequences that aren't easily measured and are entirely not academic.

Old Post Sep-30-2008 04:04  United States
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MisterOpus1
Grumpy Old Fart



Registered: Dec 2001
Location: Kansas City

quote:
Originally posted by Lebezniatnikov


You can stop waiting now.



c0r version:

Eric Cantor (R) : Waaaaah waaaaah Speaker Pelosi insulted me. My pride is hurt, so I'm gonna throw a tantrum and screw over the economy (again)!

Barney Frank (D) : Eric Cantor disgusts me, but I'll talk dirty to him if it will coax him into doing something for the good of his country for once.


Granted, I'm no fan of Pelosi either, and I've made my disagreements with her and the Democratic leaders well known here in the past. But I really found Frank's statements hilarious and right on the money. This really calls for a "WTF" moment to seriously believe what Republicans are crying about here. Are you guys honestly going to try and sell us the fact that you got your feewings all hurt so badly that you decided to help destroy our economy?

Look, I know many progressive Dems didn't vote for the bill. I'm not so sure I would have done it myself, and again there's rightful criticism of Pelosi being a weak-ass leader to not have the ability to whip her party in line very well (God I can't believe I just agreed with Limbaugh today). But to make the claim that the Republican party decided not to go in because of their feelings getting hurt by what Pelosi said (which there's a lovely amount of truth in it, but I digress), man, I just didn't realize how, ummm, sensitive those darn House Republicans were. Perhaps it was even more appropriate to have Barney Frank address you specifically afterall.......


___________________
Whence September dusk grows crisper still,
with leaves all crimson conquered,
I yearn to shout,
and dance about,
and stick pickles in my honker...

Old Post Sep-30-2008 04:16  United States
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MisterOpus1
Grumpy Old Fart



Registered: Dec 2001
Location: Kansas City

BTW:

quote:
McCain takes credit for bill before it loses



Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.) and his top aides took credit for building a winning bailout coalition – hours before the vote failed and stocks tanked.

Shortly before the vote, McCain had bragged about his involvement and mocked Sen. Barack Obama for staying on the sidelines.

“I've never been afraid of stepping in to solve problems for the American people, and I'm not going to stop now,” McCain told a rally in Columbus, Ohio. “Sen. Obama took a very different approach to the crisis our country faced. At first he didn't want to get involved. Then he was monitoring the situation.”
McCain, grinning, flashed a sarcastic thumbs up.

“That's not leadership. That's watching from the sidelines,” he added to cheers and applause.

Doug Holtz-Eakin, McCain's senior policy adviser, told reporters on a conference call that McCain "dedicated the past week" to addressing the problem but made "a conscious decision not to attract attention to John McCain."

"He's made dozens of calls," Holtz-Eakin said.

Asked if McCain bears any responsibility for the bill's failure, Holtz-Eakin said McCain "improved it greatly — took the lead in the need for taxpayer protections."

Making a similar point earlier on MSNBC, Holtz-Eakin said McCain deliberately "kept a low profile."

"John McCain understands that had he looked like he was going to be the key to the success, that Democrats would attack him and kill the deal," Holtz-Eakin said. "That's what you saw today. They were not going to let John McCain do the job that he was trying to do: deliver a bill that would help the American people."

"John McCain understood that had he kept a low profile, talked with members of Congress as he did, asked them where they were in their votes, called those members who were reluctant. He was doing his job, and doing it with a low profile [that was] necessary," Holtz-Eakin added.

Holtz-Eakin told MSNBC that Obama was "phoning it in" instead of working hard on a rescue. "Where was Barack Obama for today?" Holtz-Eakin said. "He's phoning it in — phoning it in — one more time."

McCain initially had been modest about his role. On Sunday, he said on ABC’s “This Week” that congressional negotiators deserve “great credit” for the bipartisan deal. “"It wasn’t because of me,” McCain said. “They did it themselves.”

But at almost the same time, McCain senior adviser Steve Schmidt was saying on NBC’s “Meet the Press”: “What Sen. McCain was able to do … was to help get all of the parties to the table. There had been announcements by Senate leaders saying that a deal had been reached earlier in the week. There were no votes for that deal.

“Sen. McCain knew time was short and he came back, he listened and he helped put together the framework of getting everybody to the table, which was necessary to produce a package to avoid a financial catastrophe for this country.”

On Monday morning, McCain campaign communications director Jill Hazelbaker said on Fox News that the deal would not have happened “without Sen. McCain.”

“Sen. McCain interrupted his campaign, suspended his campaign activity to come back to Washington to get Republicans around a table,” Hazelbaker said. “Without Sen. McCain, House Republicans would not have appointed a negotiator, which would not have moved this bill forward.

“It’s really Sen. McCain who got all parties around a table to hammer out a deal that hopefully is in the best interests of the American taxpayer.”

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0908/14088.html


Holy God, John. Is there anything you can get right lately? That guy's got the worst foot-in-mouth syndrome right now.


___________________
Whence September dusk grows crisper still,
with leaves all crimson conquered,
I yearn to shout,
and dance about,
and stick pickles in my honker...

Old Post Sep-30-2008 04:28  United States
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occrider
Traveladdict



Registered: Oct 2000
Location: New York

We are so so so so fucked. This was a massive failure on congress/government on multiple levels. Paulson and Bernanke correctly characterized this crises as it was ... something that is very very big. Bush failed to convince his own fucking party that this is the biggest financial crisis since the great depression. Pelosi is retarded for giving an unnecessarily partisan speech. But by and large, congressional house republicans will probably go down in history as putting partisanship, politics, and their own political ambitions before the sake of our country. As retarded as Pelosi's speech was, that is absolutely no excuse for refusing to pass the bailout package. And at least Pelosi was able to deliver a majority of democrats.

Forget the fact that equity markets dropped $1.2 trillion in value alone today. NONE of the banks are lending. The potential for a severe cash crunch is hitting main street now and companies are at risk for defaulting on their debt. At particular risk to poor liquidity are GM and United Airlines. Nat City is going under. Watching asian markets now, I think tomorrow is going to be brutal.

I moved half of my investments into funds that invested in treasuries half a year ago. I just moved the rest earlier this week.


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Retro ...

Old Post Sep-30-2008 04:37  United States
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Groundhog Boy
Stupidity Offends Me



Registered: May 2005
Location: New York, NY

quote:
Originally posted by jerZ07002
While I can withstand the some pain with de-leveraging, i can't withstand a 500 basis point LIBOR adjustment on my student loans, or real property tax increases because of increased abandoned properties in town.

STOP!

JUST STOP!


Stop talking all intellectual. Who cares about LIBOR when your wife's cousin is in LABOR? It's inconsequential and won't affect us anyway.



Sorry, I'm pretty jaded after today. I thought I'd set the bar low to emotionally avoid this...I was wrong. I have a fairly high tolerance for risk given my age.



That said, this stupidity today is seriously endangering the next 30-40 years, AKA, my entire adulthood.


___________________
"Go back to bed america your government is in control
Here's American Gladiators, here is 56 channels of it,
Watch these picturary retards bang their fuckin' skulls together and congratulate you on living in the land of freedom,
Here you go America you are free to do as we tell you
We want your soul
Your cash, your house, your phone, your cash, your house, your life" -Adam Freeland - We Want Your Soul

Old Post Sep-30-2008 06:10  United States
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Groundhog Boy
Stupidity Offends Me



Registered: May 2005
Location: New York, NY

quote:
Originally posted by occrider
Pelosi is retarded for giving an unnecessarily partisan speech. But by and large, congressional house republicans will probably go down in history as putting partisanship, politics, and their own political ambitions before the sake of our country. As retarded as Pelosi's speech was, that is absolutely no excuse for refusing to pass the bailout package. And at least Pelosi was able to deliver a majority of democrats.

I'm drunk and infuriated - Did the House GOP catch Down's Syndrome from Palin's kid? I'm really struggling to understand how they could be this incredibly dumb.

I pray that the nationwide fallout from this precedes Election Day. But it won't, and these assholes will be re-elected because "they stuck up for voters," A/K/A "Fucked us all by pandering to the stupidity of the masses."


___________________
"Go back to bed america your government is in control
Here's American Gladiators, here is 56 channels of it,
Watch these picturary retards bang their fuckin' skulls together and congratulate you on living in the land of freedom,
Here you go America you are free to do as we tell you
We want your soul
Your cash, your house, your phone, your cash, your house, your life" -Adam Freeland - We Want Your Soul

Old Post Sep-30-2008 06:24  United States
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Q5echo
asymetrical scepticism



Registered: Feb 2004
Location: Dallas

quote:
Originally posted by occrider
And at least Pelosi was able to deliver a majority of democrats.


you're happy that she could only deliver 60% of her own caucus to prevent Armageddon? talk about lowering standards.

if this was such a great package why the hell couldn't she deliver a straight party line vote? she doesn't need a single Republican to pass this if it's as serious as she's advertized

what the hell are House Republicans supposed to do with a bill that they despised a week ago anyway, prior to the clean-up of it, when she's not telling any of her own House seats to vote yes on it? who cares really what partisaned crap she said before the vote.

here, listen to a simple observer's take on all this.

Last edited by Q5echo on Sep-30-2008 at 06:32

Old Post Sep-30-2008 06:24  United States
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Groundhog Boy
Stupidity Offends Me



Registered: May 2005
Location: New York, NY

quote:
Originally posted by Q5echo
you're happy that she could only deliver 60% of her own caucus to prevent Armageddon? talking about lowering standards.

if this was such a great package why the hell couldn't she deliver a straight party line vote? she doesn't need a single Republican to pass this if it's as serious as she's advertised[quote]
Stop bitching about the other party and worry about the 65+% of your party that shot it down, after agreeing to it. Congrats on embarrassing Pelosi & the rest of the Dems. You win the award of a credit freeze and market plunge.

[quote]what the hell are House Republicans supposed to do with a bill that they despised a week ago anyway, prior to the clean-up of it, when she's not telling any of her own House seats to vote yes on it? who cares really what partisaned crap

here, listen to a simple observer's take on all this.

The bill changed so much from Friday to Sunday that it's outstanding. In favor of the Republican ideals. Just stop. Please. I don't have the time to rip your stupidity to shreads on this one.

On the plus side for me, litigation's never been better than now.


___________________
"Go back to bed america your government is in control
Here's American Gladiators, here is 56 channels of it,
Watch these picturary retards bang their fuckin' skulls together and congratulate you on living in the land of freedom,
Here you go America you are free to do as we tell you
We want your soul
Your cash, your house, your phone, your cash, your house, your life" -Adam Freeland - We Want Your Soul

Old Post Sep-30-2008 06:33  United States
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TranceAddict Forums > Other > Political Discussion / Debate > Ok so the bailout was rejected, or whatever
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