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Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles She didn't really know much about the philosophers she attacked. Just to give one example, she had a well-known hatred for Kant and Nietzsche, yet for some reason Kantian and Nietzschean ideas pop up repeatedly in her books.

Haha, yeah, this is especially true for Nietzsche.

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Originally posted by Zild plain and simple it IS. if you don't have the capacity to understand that well i'm not surprised. i don't have the time nor do you have the desire for me to properly educate you but i can guarantee given that education you would realize there is much more creativity and beauty in upper level mathematics than you will find in all of Da Vinci's works of art.

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This is probably the best place to share this thought too...

I've been doing a criminology subject this year at university, where we've been looking at capitalism as a pathological structure. It's interesting, it made me reconsider my views of how effective western society really is. I did an essay on the beltway snipers (remember them?) and came to the conclusion that they were motivated mainly by the inherent pressures imposed by a capitalist system.

However, we also know that socialism and communism aren't successful in the long run, and this has led me to believe that we are yet to discover a societal structure worth maintaining. Thoughts?

What was it that Churchill said, "Democracy is a terrible societal structure, but it's the best we've found yet."

The economic system is obviously imperfect as well (credit bubbles, rampant inequality and poverty, etc.), but in practice free-market capitalism somehow works about as well as anything else we've tried. Except for Scandinavian state-led capitalism maybe.

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Originally posted by Domesticated However, we also know that socialism and communism aren't successful in the long run, and this has led me to believe that we are yet to discover a societal structure worth maintaining. Thoughts?

isms are outmoded. there is no single social or political theory that can encompass the needs of all the people. you can't possibly tie millions of individuals with completely different ideals, motivations and goals into a social order where everything is peachy for everyone.

a mixed economy balanced by democratic government is the best i think we'll find until long after we're all dead.

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Personally, I think any form of government or economy led by Barack Obama is the best, but I'm just a sheep.

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I haven't read anything by her, but Atlas shrugged sounds like a colossal load of crap.

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Originally posted by Lebezniatnikov What was it that Churchill said, "Democracy is a terrible societal structure, but it's the best we've found yet."

Democracy is one of the worst systems ever, but it's only advantage lead to it's popularity. It's stable. Democracy is a system of mediocrity, where a decisions actual worth, quality and usefulness has lost any relevance compared to it's popularity. And ironically it's stable because people believe they all have a certain influence, when indeed everybodys voice has been diluted to nothing at all.

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Then stop coloring and visit Meat187's mix archive!

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Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN isms are outmoded.

Indeed.

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Originally posted by Domesticated led me to believe that we are yet to discover a societal structure worth maintaining. Thoughts?

After reading The Fountainhead a second time, I've come to the conclusion that she has a ridiculously wooden prose, which made the second reading a lot more of a strain. Hummm...

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Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN maybe one day, when my young hatred of her has died down. im not sure how many pages i could get through though, she makes me so angry.

That's funny, because when I picked up Atlas Shrugged I was determined to hate it, and her. After 3 pages I was in love (with the book).

We must also remember the regime that Rand lived under before going to America. I think you can forgive some of her more extreme ideas knowing that.