So digital rights are more important than individual rights and freedoms?

While i agree its also an issue to be dealt with, the daily lives of citizens and the place in which they live and work are a tad more important. Even the little things in this regard as they are all symptoms of the big picture. That is, the government trying to bleed us into their control by manipulation. I didnt say it, councillor Moscoe did!

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Originally posted by daves have you ever truly tried to consider what someone else's opinion is on anything... without having a retort ready in moment's notice? how about the opinions of 30-something-million others? is it only your way or the highway? do you speak for the majority?

Funny you say that. Because oddly enough its not "my way or the highway". In fact my whole arguement is the reverse! How about "you do it your way and ill do it my way!"

Yeah thats more like it!

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Originally posted by StereoPrincess some people do have pretty fucking shitty lawnmowers. more black smoke comes out than an 18-wheeler. they are small enough that they all should be electric/solar powered eventually.

At least in the article, they mentioned hydro-carbons, which are very bad for air quality, and a legitimate concern, unlike CO2. But, there is no real alternative.

Electric mowers are not powerful enough, and, yes you do have the danger of the cord. Plus, the cord length itself is an issue. What if you have a big lawn? You are expected to keep, and maintain a 100+ foot electrical cord? Ok, great, we got that sorted out, where is all that electricity coming from? Hmm...since we live in Ontario, coal and nuclear, not exactly 'green'.

Solar? Yeah right. Same problems. They must be fitted with batteries, which consume a lot of power to produce.

IMO, yes two stroke engines pollute, but in terms of a balance between effectiveness, power consumption, and availability, they are still our best bet.

The biggest problem is not that these guys ban things, they just don't know why they are banning them. The toronto and ontario governments have gotten in the habit of outsourcing research that they are supposed to be doing. So either, we spend tones of money, and get a pretty good answer, or we spend too little money and get shitty plans like this one.

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Originally posted by Jayx1 So digital rights are more important than individual rights and freedoms? While i agree its also an issue to be dealt with, the daily lives of citizens and the place in which they live and work are a tad more important. Even the little things in this regard as they are all symptoms of the big picture. That is, the government trying to bleed us into their control by manipulation. I didnt say it, councillor Moscoe did!

Yes. Digital rights and "unbiased" research organizations funded by the government being in bed with Lobbyist groups are infinitely more important than lawnmowers.

I do agree that both issues are reflective of a larger issue though.

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Last edited by Dave Akermanis on May-26-2009 at 18:04

There's way more black smoke coming out of municpal trucks and pickups I see driving by every day.

Also, comparing lawnmowers to cars and comparing the numbers side by side, don't mean sh!t.

For an average city lot, a lawnmower is used about 15 minutes.
Average car commute to work in the GTA is 45 minutes.
1 lawn mow per week maximum.
Even more car driving on weekends.

I don't push my lawnmower for 60km everyday like I drive to work.
I push my lawnmower for 200m, tops.

So to make the lawnmower stats look aweful to cars, is true, but to get that figure, you'd have to run your lawnmower as much as a car.

It's clearly a stupid manipulation of statistics to push a needless ban.

If you're going to go tree-hugger crazy, make catalytic converters for lawnmowers FFS.

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Originally posted by Jayx1 So digital rights are more important than individual rights and freedoms? While i agree its also an issue to be dealt with, the daily lives of citizens and the place in which they live and work are a tad more important. Even the little things in this regard as they are all symptoms of the big picture. That is, the government trying to bleed us into their control by manipulation. I didnt say it, councillor Moscoe did!

ah...digital rights are about individual rights and freedoms, they are enforced and exploited on a different frontier. Don't be so old.

my neighbor has a push mower, it just has a rotary blade.

Jay, I think I heard that the other option being debated when considering whether to ban lawnmowers was to just put up condos on all of the remaining green space in Toronto.

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Originally posted by Orko ah...digital rights are about individual rights and freedoms, they are enforced and exploited on a different frontier. Don't be so old.

LOL! i didnt say it wasnt important. But i find it interesting that someone can dismiss or even accept losses of personal freedom on one side of the coin and then be actively involved in trying to do the reverse on the other.

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Originally posted by Skipper my neighbor has a push mower, it just has a rotary blade. Jay, I think I heard that the other option being debated when considering whether to ban lawnmowers was to just put up condos on all of the remaining green space in Toronto.

LOL!

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Originally posted by Skipper my neighbor has a push mower, it just has a rotary blade. Jay, I think I heard that the other option being debated when considering whether to ban lawnmowers was to just put up condos on all of the remaining green space in Toronto.

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Originally posted by Jayx1 LOL! i didnt say it wasnt important. But i find it interesting that someone can dismiss or even accept losses of personal freedom on one side of the coin and then be actively involved in trying to do the reverse on the other.

part of living in a social system is knowing when to go with the flow and when to stand up for your rights.

lawnmowers? Trivial.

Governments and research organizations being in bed with lobbyists? Not so trivial.

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