Amsterdam also has a population of 740k. Toronto has a population of 2.5 million, and that's just the core; factor in the GTA and it's over 5 million.

So there's a slight difference in planning required. The 5 million people who need to be in Toronto for whatever reason cannot all live downtown. Winter and long distances make bikes impractical for anybody living outside the downtown hot spot, and the comical obsolescence of our transit system necessitates driving.

Toronto is not New York. Toronto is not Amsterdam. The city does not have the infrastructure to support the regular influx of people without them supplying their own transportation. Sacrificing *any* of the city's road space for the tiny minority of cyclists who can already get where they need using the transit infrastructure we do have can only serve to hurt the city - politically, economically, and environmentally.

___________________
My party schedule:
2009-02-21 - DJ Attention @ I'm So Popular
2009-06-18 - DJ Annoying @ People Need To Know Where I'll Be
2012-11-32 - DJ Insufferable ɸ Or At Least the Stalkers I Complain About
2048-06-66 - Spastic & Whocares ¶ Although I'm Actually Flattered
9999-45-81 - Tweaker Gimp ☼ I Probably Won't Even Go To This But I Have To Make Sure I Fill Up All The Available Space Here

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 Any plan to reduce capacity gets a FAIL in my books.

you're FAIL

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 Lets do one way streets if we really badly and truly want to copy everything new york does. One way streets increase capacity AND allow room for a bike lane. And you only need one bike lane! Also there are fewer chances for left turn accidents. Pretty well any city worth living in has a grid of one way streets because its the next logical step to becoming a large city. And a step that our provincial way of thinking has largely ignored (along with getting rid of street cars which most cities did in the 50s and 60s)

While I agree a grid of one way streets would be great (I think it works really well in NYC), the actual implimentation of such a grid would be a gong show. Lots of money, and lots of frustration. These matters require pragmatism, not idealism.

quote:

Originally posted by DeleteFromUsers While I agree a grid of one way streets would be great (I think it works really well in NYC), the actual implimentation of such a grid would be a gong show. Lots of money, and lots of frustration. These matters require pragmatism, not idealism.

Please tell me that you don't consider bike boxes to be more pragmatic than one-way streets. Pragmatism would be telling cyclists to take the bus. Don't get me wrong, it's not the right thing to do, and it would be political suicide, but it's definitely the pragmatic solution to the car-bicycle turf war.

___________________
My party schedule:
2009-02-21 - DJ Attention @ I'm So Popular
2009-06-18 - DJ Annoying @ People Need To Know Where I'll Be
2012-11-32 - DJ Insufferable ɸ Or At Least the Stalkers I Complain About
2048-06-66 - Spastic & Whocares ¶ Although I'm Actually Flattered
9999-45-81 - Tweaker Gimp ☼ I Probably Won't Even Go To This But I Have To Make Sure I Fill Up All The Available Space Here

quote:

Originally posted by DeleteFromUsers While I agree a grid of one way streets would be great (I think it works really well in NYC), the actual implimentation of such a grid would be a gong show. Lots of money, and lots of frustration. These matters require pragmatism, not idealism.

if this city can waste millions on speed bumps, chicanes etc, surely we can convert some roads to one way.

i agree we need pragmatism, not idealism. And pragmatism calls for a balanced solution, not an anti car solution (especially in a northern climate)

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quote:

Originally posted by jester Everything in this country is illegal.

"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery…" Winston Churchill

‎"If you have ten thousand regulations you destroy all respect for the law" - Winston Churchill