quote:

Originally posted by srussell0018 Trayvon started the fight and Zimmerman had every right to be carrying a gun. Next.

Yawn

At least try to read the admissions by the defendant. He went after him; trayvon was not out searching for a fat latin block cop to spar with.

Otherwise this woudld have ended with the DA's office shortly after arrest.

He was talking to his friend on the phone when he said the word, not Zimmerman.

There. Happy.

quote:

Originally posted by DJ RANN Yawn At least try to read the admissions by the defendant. He went after him; trayvon was not out searching for a fat latin block cop to spar with. Otherwise this woudld have ended with the DA's office shortly after arrest.

Eye witnesses put Trayvon on top of Zimmerman punching him. He legally was carrying a gun. Fearing for his life he had every right to shoot Trayvon. Case closed.

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quote:

Originally posted by OrangestO This isn't about physics, this is about waves.

quote:

Originally posted by OrangestO He was talking to his friend on the phone when he said the word, not Zimmerman. There. Happy.

Okay, so I'm sure it would go over well if I was standing with my friend near a black fellow a few yards away and loudly said "hey look at that nigger over there" so that he could hear me. That definitely wouldn't cause problems at all.

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quote:

Originally posted by OrangestO This isn't about physics, this is about waves.

Geez dude.

Have you even been paying attention to this case?

Like any of it?

Fuck.

quote:

Originally posted by OrangestO BTW, that "cracker" slur was directed toward his friend on the phone, not directly at Zimmerman. Keep reaching, folks. You obviously know what you're talking about.

What?

It was in reference to Zimmerman at the time lil' tray tray was talking to that sheboon hambeast on the phone.

Let’s face it, none of us would want to be Trayvon Martin’s friend Rachel Jeantel in the last couple of days. Much of the country is laughing at the “ghetto” black girl who keeps getting tripped up in her story. But Jeantel has made a lot more sense than it may have seemed.

Yes, she was dissimulating in pretending that Trayvon Martin’s referring to Zimmerman as a “creepy-ass cracker” wasn’t “racial”—of course it was. Cracker is today’s “honkey,” a word now about as antique as The Jeffersons in which George used it so much. It is both descriptive and pejorative, although it’s important to note that according to Jeantel, Martin was not calling Zimmerman a cracker to his face but when trying to give his friend on the phone an update on the situation.

The origins of the word in reference to persons as opposed to snacks is obscure, but most likely started when cracking could mean bragging in Elizabethan English. Upper-crust colonial Americans had a way of referring to lower-class British immigrants to the South as loud-mouthed “crackers,” as in boastful beyond their proper station.

Pretty soon the word just referred to the people, period, with elegant Central Park architect Frederick Law Olmsted even casually writing in 1850 after a Florida jaunt that “some crackers owned a good many Negroes.”

Jeantel may well have heard some whites in Florida using the word for themselves with a kind of in-group pride – just as black people use the N-word that way. But surely she knows that’s a different meaning, just as anyone who claims it’s okay for Paula Deen to have used the N-word because Jay-Z does is faking it.

The important thing is that it made perfect sense for Martin to use that word to describe a white man chasing him for no reason. Few fully understand that the tension between young black men and the police (and by extension, security guards, traffic cops and just about any sort of watchman) is the main thing keeping America from getting past race. If ten years went by without a story like the Martin case we’d be in a very different country.

There are several possible reasons why Jeantel feigned on whether calling someone a cracker was racially-motivated. It could be because she wants to protect her dead friend. It could be because she’s extremely uncomfortable. Much of her irritable reticence is predictable of someone of modest education reacting to an unfamiliar type of interrogation on the witness stand. As natural as many educated people find direct questions, they are culturally rather unusual worldwide, an artifice of educational procedure. In oral cultures – i.e. most cultures— direct questions are processed as abrupt and confrontational. In that, Jeantel is operating at a clear disadvantage.

Yet one problem Jeantel is not having is with English itself. Many are seeing her as speaking under some kind of influence from the Haitian Creole that is her mother’s tongue, but that language has played the same role in her life that Yiddish did in George Gershwin’s – her English is perfect.

It’s just that it’s Black English, which has rules as complex as the mainstream English of William F. Buckley. They’re just different rules. If she says to the defense lawyer interrogating her “I had told you” instead of “I told you” it’s not because it’s Haitian—black people around the country use what is called the preterite “had,” which I always heard my Philadelphia cousins using when I was a kid.

If you think Black English is primitive, here’s a test – is it “I ain’t be listening that much” or “I don’t be listening that much”? It’s don’t, and Jeantel and millions of other black people nationwide could tell immediately that using “ain’t” in that sentence is “off.”

i think she would fair much better if she just acted the part and got mad and all sassy.

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Okay, I feel bad for her, I think the whole situation is fucked, I don't care about the term cracker, but calling her English perfect is a bridge too far.

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quote:

Originally posted by OrangestO Let’s face it, none of us would want to be Trayvon Martin’s friend Rachel Jeantel in the last couple of days. Much of the country is laughing at the “ghetto” black girl who keeps getting tripped up in her story. But Jeantel has made a lot more sense than it may have seemed. Yes, she was dissimulating in pretending that Trayvon Martin’s referring to Zimmerman as a “creepy-ass cracker” wasn’t “racial”—of course it was. Cracker is today’s “honkey,” a word now about as antique as The Jeffersons in which George used it so much. It is both descriptive and pejorative, although it’s important to note that according to Jeantel, Martin was not calling Zimmerman a cracker to his face but when trying to give his friend on the phone an update on the situation. The origins of the word in reference to persons as opposed to snacks is obscure, but most likely started when cracking could mean bragging in Elizabethan English. Upper-crust colonial Americans had a way of referring to lower-class British immigrants to the South as loud-mouthed “crackers,” as in boastful beyond their proper station. Pretty soon the word just referred to the people, period, with elegant Central Park architect Frederick Law Olmsted even casually writing in 1850 after a Florida jaunt that “some crackers owned a good many Negroes.” Jeantel may well have heard some whites in Florida using the word for themselves with a kind of in-group pride – just as black people use the N-word that way. But surely she knows that’s a different meaning, just as anyone who claims it’s okay for Paula Deen to have used the N-word because Jay-Z does is faking it. The important thing is that it made perfect sense for Martin to use that word to describe a white man chasing him for no reason. Few fully understand that the tension between young black men and the police (and by extension, security guards, traffic cops and just about any sort of watchman) is the main thing keeping America from getting past race. If ten years went by without a story like the Martin case we’d be in a very different country. There are several possible reasons why Jeantel feigned on whether calling someone a cracker was racially-motivated. It could be because she wants to protect her dead friend. It could be because she’s extremely uncomfortable. Much of her irritable reticence is predictable of someone of modest education reacting to an unfamiliar type of interrogation on the witness stand. As natural as many educated people find direct questions, they are culturally rather unusual worldwide, an artifice of educational procedure. In oral cultures – i.e. most cultures— direct questions are processed as abrupt and confrontational. In that, Jeantel is operating at a clear disadvantage. Yet one problem Jeantel is not having is with English itself. Many are seeing her as speaking under some kind of influence from the Haitian Creole that is her mother’s tongue, but that language has played the same role in her life that Yiddish did in George Gershwin’s – her English is perfect. It’s just that it’s Black English, which has rules as complex as the mainstream English of William F. Buckley. They’re just different rules. If she says to the defense lawyer interrogating her “I had told you” instead of “I told you” it’s not because it’s Haitian—black people around the country use what is called the preterite “had,” which I always heard my Philadelphia cousins using when I was a kid. If you think Black English is primitive, here’s a test – is it “I ain’t be listening that much” or “I don’t be listening that much”? It’s don’t, and Jeantel and millions of other black people nationwide could tell immediately that using “ain’t” in that sentence is “off.”

A lot of words to say you're plagued by white guilt.

Also "cracker" is in reference to white slave owners who whipped their slaves. i.e. whip "crackers." Also by your logic , it'd be perfectly okay if the situation was reversed for Zimmerman to say on the phone "oh shit, a nigger is following me."

Your white guilt is outrageous. I bet you'd vote for a bill to pay reparations to black people who had absolutely nothing to do with slavery.

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quote:

Originally posted by OrangestO This isn't about physics, this is about waves.

quote:

Originally posted by Lews Okay, I feel bad for her, I think the whole situation is fucked, I don't care about the term cracker, but calling her English perfect is a bridge too far.

B-but dude, it's an ancient rare creole negro dialect! Celebrate diversity!