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| quote: | Originally posted by optik
I love this place sometimes, such a seething pot of bitterness  why can't we all be happy?
all the stuff on Bonzai like claim, object etc, all the stuff on discover like ibiza, hold me down and helios etc were all produced, mastered and written using the same bluesky and sub system, all by me. so if I know nothing about acoustics, it hasn't had a huge effect on my production. And I know the tracks sound good in clubs..
(edit - the vinyl version of claim was obviously mastered for vinyl, but the digital and cd releases were my masters)
maybe I'm just lucky - or maybe it's because I have bass traps and did a proper setup of my system with a decent spl meter (as suggested in the instructions you get with the bluesky system..) but you guys with small monitors are at best guessing what the sub bass is doing or at worst blindly cutting based upon what you see in voxengo span - and what's worrying is that those guys are the ones that are talking with the most force here (or at least apparent force). A sub won't tell you what your track will sound like on a consumer hi fi, but a well integrated and carefully set-up sub will give you a better indication about how your track will sound in a club than having no bass whatsoever - unless you can afford genelecs with 8 inch drivers, in which case, go for it.
This topic started with me trying to give a few tips that I thought might help some producers.. one piece of advice I gave was to do a low cut, the other was to test your stuff on a crappy system.
Don't take advice about monitoring from a guy that has 5 inch monitors and thinks they have their bass under control - they can't hear or feel it, their only option is to cut. |
Fucking hippy 
/jk. This place has always been "passionate"
I don't really know how to say it again, but I think you're getting a little carried away with what some are saying. I'll recap. I like the Bluesky systems. They make good monitors and I really like their digital management system. You can make a mix just fine on them.
And as L4C said, cutting below 50 just removes some of the non musical stuff. You're not making boom drops for the next Micheal Bay film remember.
As a general rule (and this comes from 15+ years experience as an audio engineer, 5 of which has been in both stereo and 5.1 or greater) 2.1 systems never perform as well as a pair of good stereo monitors designed for stereo mixing. This is a fact, not subjective.
Any pro engineer you ever speak to will tell you this, and several users on here (even two who respected TA's have posted in this thread) will tell you a sub creates more problems that it solves.
Want more info? Read here (and yes, GS is for the most part a cluster, but there's some great posts in this)
http://www.gearslutz.com/board/so-m...ng-systems.html
However, you obviously have found a way to make it work as any decent producer or engineer could (as I could myself), and that's great.
But his is like Storyteller's Frasier quote: if less is more, just imagine how much more more will be.
Now you're making some great tracks on what is essentially (and please don't take offense) a lesser system than you could have or at leats a compromised one. I will make a bet right now, that if you switched to some very serious monitors, like focals or barefoots or PMC's or B&W's, you'd see what I'm talking about and notice (once you've learned them properly) a marked performance increase.
The again, this is all personal preference, and you're making it work, so if it 'aint broke...
I have smaller JBL monitors at my home studio. But I reference my mixes on 1970's Tannoy Concentric Cone Speakers which have a 15" main driver in a handbuilt custom cabinet. Tannoy discontinued these in the 1980's because the cobalt ore they made the giant coil magnets from become depleted and incredibly scarce.
I can put out more bass than my house can physically handle (literally shit starts falling off shelves), that is if the police don't show up first thinking a rave is taking place.
I also have access to B&W 802's and Dynaudio BM12's so if I need I have all the LF references I want. This isn't a case of people with lesser setups trying to have a jab.
I've always believed having a sub as a secondary reference for club music isn't a bad idea, but I wouldn't want to produce or mix with one as part of my primary setup. The other thing again, is that when you have accurate monitors that translate well, the need for secondary sources (such as a hifi system, car system, crap pair etc) become less and less. Some guys I know can mix on one set and never second guess how it will sound on other systems.
One guy I've worked with, when needed can do a stereo mix (2ch) on a full surround setup, as he knows how to "hear in stereo" when using a 5.1 speaker setup.
It about who you're able to produce on them. For me at home, I'm not in a treated space so there no point in investing more in to speakers, especially when I have other references at my disposal.
True dat. Can't argue with that.
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