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Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles Switzerland has fully automatic assault rifles in over 10% of homes, yet its murder rate is nowhere near that of the U.S. Gun control is not the issue.

The number of assult rifles in Switzerland is due to their policies regarding mandatory military service and the subsequent period of reserve service. The weapons belong to the military, not the individual and those individuals are trained in their use. Moreover, it's not like in some US states where any person can just toddle off and purchase a fire arm. Those who are provided weapons have undergone background checks and psychological evaluations prior to being trained, spending several years in the military and ultimately being added to the reserves.

Now, all the above aside, lack of gun control is not the cause of these problems that seem to be disporportionately present in the US, rather it is a compounding factor. What is the cause... I'm not sure, likelihood is there is a number of factors that contribute to the psychosis that seems to be prevelent amongst young men (primarally) in the US. What cannot be debated, however, is that if these young men did not have ready access to fire arms it is probable that the severity and frequency of mass murders would be dramatically decreased.

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Originally posted by RickyM you're just a shit version of Moral Hazard. At least he knows what he's talking about.

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Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN lol, i love it when moral feels the need to lay the smack down

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Those who are provided weapons have undergone background checks...

Exactly what I think should happen with people who want to buy guns.

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Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles Exactly what I think should happen with people who want to buy guns.

Indeed... unfortunately that is not the case in all US states.... VA being one of them.

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Originally posted by RickyM you're just a shit version of Moral Hazard. At least he knows what he's talking about.

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Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN lol, i love it when moral feels the need to lay the smack down

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Originally posted by Moral Hazard The number of assult rifles in Switzerland is due to their policies regarding mandatory military service and the subsequent period of reserve service. The weapons belong to the military, not the individual and those individuals are trained in their use. Moreover, it's not like in some US states where any person can just toddle off and purchase a fire arm. Those who are provided weapons have undergone background checks and psychological evaluations prior to being trained, spending several years in the military and ultimately being added to the reserves.

But in Switzerland they still have lots of problems with shootings in family dramas as I wrote above with 300 killings each year - that is still a lot...

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Originally posted by Ojay But in Switzerland they still have lots of problems with shootings in family dramas as I wrote above with 300 killings each year - that is still a lot...

In the year 2000.... US homocide rate = 5.64/100,000; Swtizerland = 0.96/100,000. Doesn't look like the Swiss have a problem.

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Originally posted by RickyM you're just a shit version of Moral Hazard. At least he knows what he's talking about.

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Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN lol, i love it when moral feels the need to lay the smack down

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Originally posted by Demoted You honestly think that if it had been harder to legally obtain a firearm, the guy wouldn't have gone through illegal means to find one? You can't truly be that ignorant.

It depends on the number of weapons floating around. Firearms are not implemented in german culture (or western European culture). Here in Germany almost nobody has one so it is also very difficult to get one illegally as nobody offers them. Also nobody even gets the idea (!) to ask for firearms so the illegal market is very small. It is really very difficult to get one. But sure, it IS possible and one of the very few school shootings here in Germany happened because the guy got his weapons illegally.

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Originally posted by UWM No disrespect, and I truly am sorry for your loss, but initiating your post with a blanket insult really isn't going to earn you much sympathy.

srsly.

Spartan that was completely unnecessary.

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Originally posted by Halcyon+On+On I'm honestly not sure, but I don't think that, being in the US on a student visa (right?) he could legally buy a gun at his local Wal-Mart anyways. So if he didn't even obtain the weapons legally in the first place, what would stricter gun laws really do to affect situations like this?

Assuming the reports are correct, he did infact obtain the gun legally, he had a place of residence in the US (his parents place) and thus could purchase a gun legally. They even found his reciept for one of the guns. However he could only buy one a month, so he waited till the next month roll around for the second one. Clearly he was determined to follow through with his plan, it wasent a spur of the moment decision.

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Originally posted by Import Assuming the reports are correct, he did infact obtain the gun legally, he had a place of residence in the US (his parents place) and thus could purchase a gun legally. They even found his reciept for one of the guns. However he could only buy one a month, so he waited till the next month roll around for the second one. Clearly he was determined to follow through with his plan, it wasent a spur of the moment decision.

Bingo. This was incredibly methodical, and the kid (regardless of his abilities as a playwright) is proving to have been at least moderately clever.

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that's seriously fucked about the gun transaction.
They said he'd spent time in a psych facility and still passed the background check for his gun purchase.


In California, anyone who spends at least 24 hours in a psych hospital must sign a legal document barring them from any firearm handling/purchasing for 5 years, and +5 for any returning visits. Once someone starts getting to the end of the ban (~a year), they have the choice to appeal.

The idea that the psych hospital stay wouldn't show up on a background check that was "squeeky clean" boggles my mind

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quote:

Originally posted by Import Assuming the reports are correct, he did infact obtain the gun legally, he had a place of residence in the US (his parents place) and thus could purchase a gun legally. They even found his reciept for one of the guns. However he could only buy one a month, so he waited till the next month roll around for the second one. Clearly he was determined to follow through with his plan, it wasent a spur of the moment decision.

Though I feel that it's too easy to get a gun, there is a process, and it's obvious that the process fails sometimes from screening out the wrong people. That's the way of processes. However, I can think of many, many "wrong" people that have taken advantage of the process and shouldn't be allowed to own guns. They just don't get caught.

In any case, he was certainly determined. Determination and money will get you pretty much whatever you want, regardless of whatever laws are installed.

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Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.