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| quote: | Originally posted by Arbiter
It's precisely the fact that it wasn't said for my amusement that makes it so amusing. If it had been intended as a joke it would have been a lackluster one, but the fact that it is "honest expression" makes it far more revealing, and what is revealed is rather droll.
All I am saying is that when you play with fire, you accept the risk that you'll be burned. I'm well aware that they believed that they had a good reason for playing with fire--they had to make a choice, risk versus reward. Now they are getting the bad with the good; excuse me if I'm not teary-eyed for them. The right to life certainly does not entail a right to be free of the consequences of one's decisions. |
Absolutely, but you should apply that same principle with a single standard now.
| quote: | Originally posted by Arbiter
The real victims here are the Palestinians who did not vote for Hamas. They made a prudent choice and yet they still must bear the consequences of the unwise choices of their neighbors. It's a shame--another miserable chapter in the squalid history of majoritarian government. But if they die, that blood is on the hands of those neighbors and the government that has led them to their death. |
Then do not ignore the history and cause of the conflict, and that is not the majority of Jewish people or Palestinians... the list gets much bigger, and militia organizations are a direct byproduct of historical injustices and the current residue. There is no solution to a problem with out addressing the root cause, which is why this nonsense and senseless bloodshed will perpetuate until it's addressed, as it continues till this day.
| quote: | Originally posted by Arbiter
If they are to die, I suggest that they go down fighting against their real enemies--those among them who choose badly.
We are all animals, struggling to survive just as our ancestors have for millenia. It's almost certainly true that there are plenty of Americans who deserve to die. But Americans have an advantage--good decisions in the past have created considerable room for error in the present. But nothing lasts forever. If and when Americans bring destruction upon themselves, then--in the only sense that matters--they will "deserve" those consequences as well... |
That is the same logic employed by terrorist cells who "target civilian populations" or engage in indiscriminate acts of violence, I hope you can see the problem with it.
I agree that in any democratic system, the participants (i.e. voters) are responsible for the leaders they put in to power and the consequences of policy decisions made. And yes, that can have extreme implications like you said. The problem is, there only way your 'punishment system' could be applied is if you have the ballot for each individual person and only those people be held accountable. At the same time, you are conveniently ignoring Israel's numerous act of state sponsored terrorism, aggression and continued expansion. By your logic, terrorist attacks are perfectly justified on the civilian population. And I strongly disagree with that both in the case of Israelis and Palestinians. So far you've only expressed a strong view with respect to the latter. If you express consistency in that view, I would respect that view yet disagree for obvious reasons.
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"The Greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge." -Stephen Hawking
"First they came for the communists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a communist;
Then they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a socialist;
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a trade unionist;
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out— because I was not a Jew;
Then they came for me— and there was no one left to speak out for me." -Martin Niemöller
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