is it just me or was the whole political heirarchy of Zion incredibly similar to that of Star Wars?

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quote:

Originally posted by Teknoscaper. is it just me or was the whole political heirarchy of Zion incredibly similar to that of Star Wars?

hehe .. yeah I thought that too

I just love the way the whole idea of the Matrix is entirely turned on its head in that Architect scene! I'm also fairly sure that -- don't read here if you haven't seen it -- Neo is no longer a human, but a program inside the Matrix, like the Architect, like the Oracle, Seraph, the new Agent Smith etc. This transition probably occured at the end of the first film when Neo was killed by Agent Smith, changing him from nerdy I-don't-really-believe-in-myself Neo, to fuck-this-blow-some-shit-up-manipulate-the-Matrix-at-will Neo. Notice how Agent Smith can use Morpheus as a source from which to clone himself, but can't use Neo. Neo is plugged in to the Matrix code in some way, as there are numerous references to him being able to see things in Matrix code.

Another cool point - remember all the screens in the Architect's lair? Think back to Matrix 1 - you've seen those screens before. The part early in the movie where Neo is interrogated by the Agents in some windowless room - the scene starts by looking at a whole bank of computer monitors. You assume they're just security cameras or something, but now we know they're not

Also about the end part, I'm not exactly sure what happens when Neo faces off the Sentinels - whether he actually stops them himself, or whether the ship that turns up a minute later had EMP-ed them. Gotta watch it again to make sure

And also, stick around after the credits as there is apparently a 30 second trailer for Matrix Revolutions

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ok, what a pile of shit.

i just saw it, and yer, was not to happy about it.,

firstly, a jew wrote this film.

what the hell is with all the cross references to jewish beliefs and stuff, thats just stupid. no beyond stupid.

the architect? isnt that a mormon idea?

morpheous speech he gave to the people was absolutely gay, all that shit about not fearing anything.

that dance scence did not compliment the film in anyway, it made it rather dirty looking and detracted from the "slick" look of the rest of the film.

"some things change and some things don't" or whatever it was, about the most fucking stupid thing ive ever heard.

special effects didnt blow me away at all, i felt like was watching a computer game for some parts of it.

it did have a few good bits though, but yer, i was expecting a bit more, it wasnt even that deep, just borrowed ideas.

ill prlly get flamed for this, but oh well.

oh and one more thing, how come most ppl still alive in the real world or whatever are black? and the ones in power especially, haha, im not really racist, but still, no plur for this film from me.

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finally got around to seeing it last night and i loved it...can't wait for revolutions so it can answer many unanswered questions.

Webbie, interesting ideas about Neo being software now... for that to be true of course, there would have to be multiple cascading matricies because software cannot take human form outside of a matrix. I noticed the monitors being from the first film too, I'm not sure if there's any depth to that note though, do you think? Regarding the ending, I'm almost convinced that this means there are cascading matricies. The only thing I have heard or considered to be a seperate possibilty was that the sentinals were stopped by an EMP blast, resulting in Neo's coma thereafter. But Trinity was standing very close to Neo and she didn't end up in a coma... I'm almost convinced Neo stopped the sentinals himself, and also that what they considered the real world in this film is actually another matrix; giving way to your idea about Neo now being in the form of a program.

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Originally posted by escee: quote: Shit slade said in his first post about todays cinema I totally agree with that. The last movie that did it well was fight club i think. Which was entertaining enough, had lots of punches, and also challenged peoples views on consumerism, capitalism and self worth. Then some movies just try too hard to be intellectual, Mullholland Drive is a perfect example, besides the lesbian scenes i didnt get much entertainment out of that. quote: Rems shit here I think the fact that neo and trinity were holding hands for the first half of the movie and making goo goo eyes at each other was obvious enough that they had a relationship. As well neos dreams and how much they affected him. The Line "Ive never letting go of this blah blah blah" sounded like it came out of a trashy danielle steel book or something.

Definitely agree with you and slade about that issue, and loved fight club; must see it again soon. Regarding the love issue in Reloaded between Neo and Trinity, after seeing it a second time I'm leaning towards your point of view on that one. Partially because I am not sure how the it's going to be explained how/why love plays such a major role in the endings of both films (when Neo is brought back in the first film, and Trinity in the second)... bit foggy to me at the moment. I think that these resurections are an example of choice, which itself (choice) creates the anomolies that make Neo the one. Perhaps with each successful and fate changing choice, these anomolies are refined again and again, allowing Neo to eventually discover an exit to the real world?

By the way slade (Teknoscaper), great posts about your view on the 'rave scene' and it's significance, I concur. As I've said above, werd @ your paragraph about today's cinema.

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quote:

Originally posted by Rememberence_ Webbie, interesting ideas about Neo being software now... for that to be true of course, there would have to be multiple cascading matricies because software cannot take human form outside of a matrix. I noticed the monitors being from the first film too, I'm not sure if there's any depth to that note though, do you think? Regarding the ending, I'm almost convinced that this means there are cascading matricies. The only thing I have heard or considered to be a seperate possibilty was that the sentinals were stopped by an EMP blast, resulting in Neo's coma thereafter. But Trinity was standing very close to Neo and she didn't end up in a coma... I'm almost convinced Neo stopped the sentinals himself, and also that what they considered the real world in this film is actually another matrix; giving way to your idea about Neo now being in the form of a program.

Yeah but done forget, rem that agent smith also got out into a human form which give me the idea that perhaps neo was born into the matrix like most people were, but he was created specifically by the architect for the purpose to be "the one" as each matrix had to be created with the one inside it. so maybe perhaps neo was started as a program in the matrix and was then copied agent smith-style into a baby, so that once he was grown up with the ability to leave the matrix as planned into a human body.

Another idea is that perhaps being some form of messiah, neo is really another form of christ, both in the matrix and out of the matrix, as we saw when he destroyed the sentinals heading his way toward the end of the film. i for one havent worked out how that may have happened from an outside source, considering that he fainted after it happened, so that gives the possibility of being "the one" outside of the matrix or the possibility of cascading matrixes, which is far more likely imo, i mean what otherwise would the robots have as a backup in case "the one" DID shut down the matrix while everyone was in it. because the machines wouldnt otherwise be able to have full control of the world.

just a few points for you to think about from my wild imagination

quote:

Originally posted by -=M=- Yeah but done forget, rem that agent smith also got out into a human form which give me the idea that perhaps neo was born into the matrix like most people were, but he was created specifically by the architect for the purpose to be "the one" as each matrix had to be created with the one inside it. so maybe perhaps neo was started as a program in the matrix and was then copied agent smith-style into a baby, so that once he was grown up with the ability to leave the matrix as planned into a human body.

I think you're drawing conclusions from false evidence. My post was speculation on the assumption that cascading matricies do in fact exist. Therefore Agent Smith did not take on human form in the real world because the world that Zion existed in would have just been another matrix. As for your other ideas, food for thought indeed.

Cheers

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"I played 12.30 til close at 3am at the club (Antro), following on from an Australian dj,
which seemed unusual in deepest Texas." - Judge Jules

quote:

Originally posted by webmeister Neo is no longer a human, but a program inside the Matrix, like the Architect, like the Oracle, Seraph, the new Agent Smith etc. This transition probably occured at the end of the first film when Neo was killed by Agent Smith

The scene after the oracle where Neo and Smith are talking to each other and smith explains how he became free. He said something along the lines of

"When you jumped into me a part of you rubbed off into a part off me, and vice versa"

Or something very similar, so yes thats possibly what happened.

Edit: I still think he is mostly human as agent smith is still mostly program.

i saw it last night... Awesome.. I loved it.

I know a lot of people were let down by this film, but in my opinion, as with any trilogy - the second part is often the one that is least favoured as it is basically a connecting chapter and nothing too new, only more information is provided for the audience in anticipation for the final outcome. However, keeping that in mind, more of the story was unfolded and left me more to play with in my mind when trying to figure out what number 3 may hold about each character, and the notion of the matrix as a whole. I was very happy to see it, and besides the visual relief that the directors provided, it stuck very well to the matrix theme and that is what we all love (well I do anyways)... Revolution should be f**in wicked!!

i cant beleive some of you are writing things about the unoriginality of this movie.. i dont know about you but i aint seen another movie that explains the world is meerly a computer program and that we arent really here doign what we're doing.. oh wait, rugrats in paris had the same storyline??

this is probably one of the best series movies ive ever seen, part 1 and 2 perfectly fit the bill as the matrix 1 gave us a breif introduction to the world of the matrix, and then in part 2 we already knew what we were in for, and moving along in the time line with the characters are thrown into the beginning of this war between the machines.

ive read soem funny comments about how its a 'typical sequel' and you could 'expect things happening'.. uhmm.. yeah i could really expect that the architect (aka a software programmer), found in loop holes and back doors (reference to programming again), would explain the creation of the world, and of neo, and of all the other things about who was actually software put into the matrix and who wasnt.. it even went even more in depth about the actual matrix than the first one

but yeah you guys are right.. its totally unoriginal and predictable.

pfft.
id like to see someone from here come up with a better storyline, let alone cinematic effects and fight scenes.

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quote:

Originally posted by Rememberence_ I think you're drawing conclusions from false evidence. My post was speculation on the assumption that cascading matricies do in fact exist. Therefore Agent Smith did not take on human form in the real world because the world that Zion existed in would have just been another matrix. As for your other ideas, food for thought indeed. Cheers

ahhhhhhhhhhh now i seee.... youre right, youre right

MY IMAGINATION IS GOING NUTS NOW

good point tho

Cheers, Big Ears