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Ishkur
Supreme tranceaddict



Registered: Jul 2001
Location: Vancouver, BC

YaleTrance: yes, duelly noted. But how is any of that my problem?

Above all else, I urge you to accept the contradictions instead of ask for clarity. But I'll explain: I look not really to the root, origin, or particular aesthete of a form of music. I never once said I hated 3-key melodies. That's not the way I judge music, and I would think anyone that accepts or disregards entire cultural movements because of such stringent anal-retentive personal guidelines is a bore to be around anyway.

Instead, I take a holistic (and very very unscientific) view and judge a form of music by its INTENT. Eurodance is silly, stupid fun because it knows that it is silly, stupid fun. It doesn't try to be anything but. You can't help but have respect for something that fosters absolutely no illusions about what it is.

This is something that--I'm hoping you'll agree although it IS arguable--the bombastic trance tunes doesn't share. The music is blown way out of proportion, the people who play it are blown way out of proportion (Gods? Please....they are jukeboxes, that's all), and the people who listen to it are simply blown away. A 3 minute breakdown is not uplifting. It is boring.

But probably the most insulting thing about it is the fact that each track is exactly the same, yet they pretend that they're different. Like we're not going to notice Transa used the same preset samplebanks and sequence engine for 6 of his singles? It reminds me a lot of how in 1984 because previous records are continuously destroyed no one can remember anything, so when the chocolate ration is at 25 grams a week and then they announce that they're RAISING it to 20 grams a week, no one bats an eye.....since they can't remember what the previous ration was, they accept the change in policy, and even celebrate it, remarking how the standard of living is getting better.

Do you people even have a concept of history? Do you know what sounds like trance, and what doesn't? I'm willing to wager that those who think Airwave is the pinnacle of trance probably didn't start listening to trance until 3 years ago anyway, so that's their only frame of reference.

Seriously, after 6 years of the same template, don't you think it's time we put the anthems to rest for once? For the record, I'm listening to a lot of Icon of Coil these days. I'm hoping more people do stuff like that, and more DJs spin it. It's something new and energizing that I think the trance scene needs. Something a little bit more darker and brooding, but not total EBM, so it's not entirely alienating.

Oh, and yes: I'm currently working on a Jungle version of NOT TRANCE that spawned off of Jump Up that I'm calling (with this many letters to) "SUUUUUUUUPER Jump Up!"....because the bassline are just as bad as the trance anthems: over-the-top, domineering, and absolutely silly.

Old Post Sep-26-2003 08:35  Canada
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joeh
NIAT



Registered: Jul 2002
Location: London, UK

quote:
Originally posted by Cobalt
And regarding the Not Trance category, you're totally missing the point of why he even put it there, which was to criticize the ridiculously overinflated breakdowns that some trance 'anthems' contain these days. Compare to classic or progressive trance, which instead build on subtle progression to create a musical journey. The type of trance he's typifying under that label totally defeats the purpose by throwing these massive, uber-uplifting melodies in your face rather than slowly crafting them.



Yes, alot of people don't like trance.
Yes, alot of people think trance is cookie cutter.

But how can anyone believe that Fragma, ATB & Ian Van Dahl are prime examples of trance, and that Rank 1 & Ferry Corsten don't make trance?

Old Post Sep-26-2003 13:09 
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Clyde77
junior tranceaddict



Registered: Jul 2001
Location: Guam

lol @ this guy..

it must have taken him a long ass time to finishs the site. and all he got was negative feedbacks... lol

thanks for putting rank 1 on your cheese list.

and castles in the sky? epic? wtf..? i know you're kidding. how much did ian van dahl pay you?


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Old Post Sep-26-2003 13:27  Philippines
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sly
Supreme tranceaddict



Registered: Jun 2001
Location: Boston, US

OMG! Finally a revamped Ishur guide!

Old Post Sep-26-2003 13:30  United States
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Haak
analog evading shark



Registered: Jun 2001
Location: Oslo, Norway

quote:
Originally posted by Clyde77
and castles in the sky? epic? wtf..? i know you're kidding. how much did ian van dahl pay you?


notice how he doesn't say anything positive about epic trance, so i don't think anyone would pay to get in there

anyway, the guide is cool even if there's a lot of bias there, he seems to blaim the british for everything bad hehe. and he's got a point about the anthemic trance.


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Old Post Sep-26-2003 13:38  Norway
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Lira
Ancient BassAddict



Registered: Nov 2001
Location: Brasilia, Brazil

Although I'm at work and my boss would kill me if he saw me posting here, I just have to post in this thread:

TTA, mate, there are 140 genres in the guide, and you're complaining because he confused tribal techno with tribal house? Don't you think this would be too much perfection in a critic guide? He's not going for the accuracy, but he's saying what each genre is in his opinion - and if you browse his site for just a few minutes, you'll realise that he's got a point. You know I respect your knowledge about electronic music a lot, but let's remember the differences: you're some sort of academic historian who studies the facts. He's a sociologist who analises the consequences. Maybe this is not the best analogy I could come up with, but I'm in a hurry.

I think this is guide is amazing in its purpose and my boss is coming back in any minute, then I'd better go now. Anyway, here are the three last things I'd like to say:

1) Although I like "System F. feat. Armin - Exhale", it fits his "not trance" category perfectly. Oh, and Fragma is epic trance, you like it or not.

2) "Olive - You're not alone" is not trip hop indeed, but as far as I remember, the CD's don't come with stickers saying "This is trance/This is acid house"... although it would be elitists' wet dream, people are bound to make mistakes labelling genres every now and then because of the lack of stickers.

3) OMGF, VGM pwns j00!!!1! lol

*goes back to cave*


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Old Post Sep-26-2003 14:18  Brazil
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joeh
NIAT



Registered: Jul 2002
Location: London, UK

quote:
Originally posted by Maaz
----------------------


come back maaz!

or get on msn & stay on for more than 2 seconds!



Old Post Sep-26-2003 14:58 
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Swamper
Webmonstah



Registered: Jan 2000
Location: Toronto, Canada

While I don't agree with some things in the guide you ALL have to agree that it helps out the absolute clueless newbie in classifying music by genre...

You can NEVER be accurate because a lot of tracks have cross-over... I wouldn't say Castles in the Sky is 'Epic Trance', it is 'Epic-Cheese-Euro-Trance' - but that doesn't matter - it serves its purpose as being catchy and pleasing the cheese/fluff market.


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Old Post Sep-26-2003 16:22  Canada
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Scottaculous
habitual line crosser



Registered: Mar 2001
Location: On a plane

I would help if the descriptions on some genres weren't so subjective. The impression after reading the descriptions was any trance outside traditional trance is dull and uncreative. "Breakdowns are boring" - subjective, even though I personally agree with that statement. While other genres such as trancestep gets very positive descriptions. But all in all, it has fairly accurate descriptions, with a brutally direction approach, of the genres (for most readers). Good job.

Old Post Sep-26-2003 16:30 
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torontotrance
I hath returned



Registered: Apr 2001
Location: Toronto

I think the guide is a good thing...so show the difference between genres....but I think some people will take your genre things seriously....and get misinformed....I know you had a fun time...doing these....true...some songs cross genres.....but some n00bies use this guide and this guide only as a reference...without reading your warning....yes...it's true...there is not many people with the music knowledge as some of us on here and can pick apart the genres. I do have an idea ishkur...since we all have tremendous knowledge...for your version 3.0...let us help you somewhat....i mean i know the history of the detroit techno.....acid junkie..with all the hardcore techno and other "hard genres"...we could perhaps help...if you wished....i read the warning at the beginning...then again...i enjoy complaining...it's a hobby.

Old Post Sep-26-2003 16:44  Canada
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Azz3D
Asobi Seksu'd



Registered: Jul 2002
Location:

quote:
Originally posted by torontotrance
I think the guide is a good thing...so show the difference between genres....but I think some people will take your genre things seriously....and get misinformed....I know you had a fun time...doing these....true...some songs cross genres.....but some n00bies use this guide and this guide only as a reference...without reading your warning....yes...it's true...there is not many people with the music knowledge as some of us on here and can pick apart the genres. I do have an idea ishkur...since we all have tremendous knowledge...for your version 3.0...let us help you somewhat....i mean i know the history of the detroit techno.....acid junkie..with all the hardcore techno and other "hard genres"...we could perhaps help...if you wished....i read the warning at the beginning...then again...i enjoy complaining...it's a hobby.


Nicely said


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Old Post Sep-26-2003 17:51  Yugoslavia
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Revel
Senior tranceaddict



Registered: Oct 2002
Location: Newcastle

lololol

whoever did this HAS to be american.....

Old Post Sep-26-2003 18:31  United Kingdom
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TranceAddict Forums > Main Forums > Music Discussion > FINALLY: Ishkur's Guide v2.0
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