quote:

Originally posted by Zombie0915 yikes, this was a fun thread look, I'm not saying that this music can't exist without drugs, I'm just saying that it doesn't happen today aside from within some obscure circles. I've had plenty of real experience that causes me to think this way. One only needs to go out and observe the people around them to realize that most people are in on this drug using underworld. Go to a party, walk in the bathroom, at alot of parties you will find a guy in the bathroom sitting behind a desk with a huge wad of cash in front of him. What the hell do you think that guy is doing? Why do you think he can just sit right there in front of the door like that? Everyone is in on it! Have you ever had drugs confiscated by a bouncer? Wanna know what he does with them? I can guarentee he isn't flushing them, and if you offer to flush them right then and there he wont let you and instead will take them from you. Guess what, the bouncers, and indeed the entire club enterprise is involved in drug peddling in some fashion. The DJ's, standing in front of the crowd, would have to be retarded not to notice the looks on al the peoples rolling faces. If they didn't aprove of the drugs surely they would discorage them somehow when they see such a sight night after night, but they dont! They don't because those drug users are their meal ticket. Todays clubbing environment is deeply conected with drugs. Everyone in the crowd who has even a tiny bit of observation skill can see it all hapening right in front of them. Even those kids who talk like they dont do them often are the ones doing them, or even seling them. People act all ritchous on these message board sites but you meet them in person and you quickly notice that look in their eye, that trembling motion they have and the drug lingo that they speak in. The drugs are everywhere and the people involved in the music realize this, but they continue to do nothing about it because they don't have a problem with it. I'm not saying you need to to drugs when you go out, I'm not saying that anyone should be condemned for letting this happening, I'm just saying that you better realize what you are getting into when you go out, because that is what's out there.

The fundamental problem with this post is the poster has already made up his mind that Clubs = EDM and EDM = Trance and hence Trance = Drugs.

In US, most dance clubs play hip-hop - genuine EDM clubs are very few and far off and genuine Trance-clubs even less. And, in my observation, drug use/abuse is much more rampant in the ghetto-ish hip-hop clubs than anywhere else.

Also, the fundamental premise that Trance originated from rave-parties is also debatable and so are the claims that it has its origins in the drug-parties.

Lastly, music was never meant for drugs. Anyone who even remotely tries to claim so is not worth arguing with.

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Dance like no one is watching

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Originally posted by DJ Indus Creed The fundamental problem with this post is the poster has already made up his mind that Clubs = EDM and EDM = Trance and hence Trance = Drugs. In US, most dance clubs play hip-hop - genuine EDM clubs are very few and far off and genuine Trance-clubs even less. And, in my observation, drug use/abuse is much more rampant in the ghetto-ish hip-hop clubs than anywhere else. Also, the fundamental premise that Trance originated from rave-parties is also debatable and so are the claims that it has its origins in the drug-parties. Lastly, music was never meant for drugs. Anyone who even remotely tries to claim so is not worth arguing with.

Music is for pure relaxation and enjoyment purposes; but we have exceptions like emo--which is simply here to annoy us

crikey, within the context of tranceaddict I feel that those assumtions are accurate, we are talking about trance parties here right?

Just because they do it more in hip hop clubs doesnt meant it is not rampant at dance events as well. I am quite familiar with the rarity of trance club events, I live in the south, trance parties for me are a 5 hour drive to Washington DC, or a 6 hour drive to Atlanta, or 9 hours driving to New York, or 14 hours driving to south florida. I have gone on all of these road trips because of the rarity of trance in my home state. Once a year PvD or Oakey or something will make it into a city which is 3 hours of driving from me, that is the closest a decent trance party has ever been to my home.

And at every single one of those parties the crowd was rolling their faces off, openly selling and using drugs right on the club floor in front of everyone, nobody even seemed to care.

If this music was not being made for the enjoyment of drug users, then it has been hijacked by them to the point where they outnumber the original intended audience. No, I have a feeling that people are working in their studios fully aware that the customers of their music will be high, they take that into consideration and make music which is specifically pleasurable to kids on exstacy. This music is made for drug users, it might sadden you but it is reality, just because you don't do drugs and also enjoy the music doesnt make this any less true, because you are grossly outnumbered. A musician will not admit this in an interview because it would kill their career, if they were foreigners and said something like that they probably wouldn't be let inside this country. Instead they maintain a false image when they are in public situations and are questioned about drugs, they will say they dont do them or that they dont make music for drug users, but if that were true then there wouldn't be so many of them showing up to hear their music. Alot of this music is just being used as an excuse to get together and take drugs, if that is not what you are about then you need to put extra effort into finding specific events where that stuff doesn't happen, and you have to look really hard because they are rare compared to typical trance nights. If you dont have a problem with people all around you taking and selling drugs then you learn to deal with it and accept the fact that the sounds you are hearing are made for their pleasure, and that you are an abberation at that party.

quote:

Originally posted by Zombie0915 crikey, within the context of tranceaddict I feel that those assumtions are accurate, we are talking about trance parties here right? Just because they do it more in hip hop clubs doesnt meant it is not rampant at dance events as well. I am quite familiar with the rarity of trance club events, I live in the south, trance parties for me are a 5 hour drive to Washington DC, or a 6 hour drive to Atlanta, or 9 hours driving to New York, or 14 hours driving to south florida. I have gone on all of these road trips because of the rarity of trance in my home state. Once a year PvD or Oakey or something will make it into a city which is 3 hours of driving from me, that is the closest a decent trance party has ever been to my home. And at every single one of those parties the crowd was rolling their faces off, openly selling and using drugs right on the club floor in front of everyone, nobody even seemed to care. If this music was not being made for the enjoyment of drug users, then it has been hijacked by them to the point where they outnumber the original intended audience. No, I have a feeling that people are working in their studios fully aware that the customers of their music will be high, they take that into consideration and make music which is specifically pleasurable to kids on exstacy. This music is made for drug users, it might sadden you but it is reality, just because you don't do drugs and also enjoy the music doesnt make this any less true, because you are grossly outnumbered. A musician will not admit this in an interview because it would kill their career, if they were foreigners and said something like that they probably wouldn't be let inside this country. Instead they maintain a false image when they are in public situations and are questioned about drugs, they will say they dont do them or that they dont make music for drug users, but if that were true then there wouldn't be so many of them showing up to hear their music. Alot of this music is just being used as an excuse to get together and take drugs, if that is not what you are about then you need to put extra effort into finding specific events where that stuff doesn't happen, and you have to look really hard because they are rare compared to typical trance nights. If you dont have a problem with people all around you taking and selling drugs then you learn to deal with it and accept the fact that the sounds you are hearing are made for their pleasure, and that you are an abberation at that party.

You can advocate all you want; but my opinion stands. To me trance is considered the top music genre of the world...and I don't like the fact that its reputation can be blundered by this whole "trance is made for drugs" bull-crap.

Unworldly,

TOTY Poll had 32 tracks in 4 groups.

How many and which of them can you identify as the ones intended for drug-users and that the DJ had to take drug-use "into consideration and make music which is specifically pleasurable to kids on exstacy"?

___________________
Dance like no one is watching

Just enjoy yourself and know your limits no reason to look at this in dark way.


Unworldy, 6 hours to the nearest Tranceparty yikes! I can't even imagine more than 45min lol!

___________________
"Be the change you wish to see in the world"

The traveling is kinda why I can't take drugs when I go out, because I always have to drive home afterwards and I have to have enough strength left to stay awake at the wheel!

I can't read the minds of producers, but I find that certain gimmicks make kids who roll scream more compared to sober kids. Just watch the faces while you are going out, pay close attention to eyes and jaws, that is where it is most obvious. In recent years I have noticed alot more meth symptoms out there in clubland, even noticed quite a few meth loving clubbers who are missing some teeth. I can't name tracks because it is subective, you have to look at the crowd when the track plays, and the places I go don't necessarily play the TOTY tracks so I haven't seen crowd reactions for very many of them. It is cultural, you have to hang out with these kids to find out which aspects of the music are drug stimulators because it is constantly changing in order to stay one step ahead of the law, new slang comes out, new symbolic noises, as soon as the public discovers that something is a drug related gimmick it is replaced with something new.

Anyone can go out to a trance party and see that the vast majority of the crowd gets high, it is obvious. Trance has a bad reputation because of the amount of people who listen to it that take drugs, to the point that playing it in public is restricted because people consider it a "drug influence". The stuff I say is not ruining trance's reputation, the stuff that everyone sees when they go out for trance is what ruins the reputation.

I agree that this is changing, trance is increasingy making it into pop venues where it is enjoyed in a completely different way by kids whore are not connected to drugs. People are treating trance as some sort of sit on the couch listening music instead of taking pills. I know alot of people who grew to love trance through their computers before ever going out to a party. They are still outnumbered though, you hear a good trance song, you wonder what it sounds like on the big speakers, and you meet kids at the performance who go to get high. I understand that alot of people think there is something special about this music that exists regardless of the drug connections, but I argue that the music would never have made it into record stores if it were only being sold to the kids who are sober.

The Music industry isn't stupid, they identify their target demographic and they work to appeal to them, there are plenty of fans outside of that demographic, but the target is drug users, simply because they outnumber everyone else.

Then I find that really sad...

Then I find that really sad...

Then I find that really sad...

It dissapointed me alot at first. I started going out regularly around 2002 or so once college started. Before that I only had a few random outings. It took me a while to realize what was going on because the kids didn't immediately trust me. Then one day I was in a little crowd of people who were having a drunken conversation and they let some things slip.

I used to be one of these "music is the drug" types, I really used to think that the drug users were the abnormality rather then the opposite. It wasn't until I learned what the signals were that I began to understand the magnitude of this issue. It made me really sad when I figured it out, that all the people who I became friends with were hiding from me the fact that they all took and sold drugs. But I'm not stupid, I noticed it from watching stuff happen, then I called them out and they told me the truth. I just wanted them to be honest with me, I wasn't trying to fault them for doing drugs.

I can hardly blame anyone for lying to a stranger about drugs, but it really made me question if I should continue listening to this music and going to these parties. Eventually I came to the conclusion that I enjoy this music even if it is full of druggies. When I go out I can now sense what portion of the crowd is high, and it's always more then half. I find that I enjoy this music but I dislike the party scene where it is performed. I hate the fads, the guidos(or ginos depending on your country of origin), the status symbols. I appreciate the tolerance, the loving feeling, the come-as-you-are mentality.

I don't think taking drugs is really a big deal honestly. I don't have a problem with people enjoying themselves responsibly, which is what mostly happens at trance parties. I don't think trance deserves a bad reputation for being connected with drugs, but the general population feels differently about drugs than I do so it has that bad reputation despite how I feel about it. I feel that this music is a rejection of the general population, that it shouldn't matter what the public thinks about it because the whole partying experience is a giant statement of "FUCK YOU" to those people who are against drugs. This is definately a rebelious drug using hedonist group of people, the kind of people who like this music enough to get on the internet and chat about it tend to not be mindless hedonist drug types, but the type of people who make up the bulk of a crowd at any given trance party are definately drug lovers. I think it is sad that us music fans are outnumbered by those drug fans, but fads are a much more powerful force than the musical passion of a few kids scattered accross the Internet.

quote:

Originally posted by Zombie0915 It dissapointed me alot at first. I started going out regularly around 2002 or so once college started. Before that I only had a few random outings. It took me a while to realize what was going on because the kids didn't immediately trust me. Then one day I was in a little crowd of people who were having a drunken conversation and they let some things slip. I used to be one of these "music is the drug" types, I really used to think that the drug users were the abnormality rather then the opposite. It wasn't until I learned what the signals were that I began to understand the magnitude of this issue. It made me really sad when I figured it out, that all the people who I became friends with were hiding from me the fact that they all took and sold drugs. But I'm not stupid, I noticed it from watching stuff happen, then I called them out and they told me the truth. I just wanted them to be honest with me, I wasn't trying to fault them for doing drugs. I can hardly blame anyone for lying to a stranger about drugs, but it really made me question if I should continue listening to this music and going to these parties. Eventually I came to the conclusion that I enjoy this music even if it is full of druggies. When I go out I can now sense what portion of the crowd is high, and it's always more then half. I find that I enjoy this music but I dislike the party scene where it is performed. I hate the fads, the guidos(or ginos depending on your country of origin), the status symbols. I appreciate the tolerance, the loving feeling, the come-as-you-are mentality. I don't think taking drugs is really a big deal honestly. I don't have a problem with people enjoying themselves responsibly, which is what mostly happens at trance parties. I don't think trance deserves a bad reputation for being connected with drugs, but the general population feels differently about drugs than I do so it has that bad reputation despite how I feel about it. I feel that this music is a rejection of the general population, that it shouldn't matter what the public thinks about it because the whole partying experience is a giant statement of "FUCK YOU" to those people who are against drugs. This is definately a rebelious drug using hedonist group of people, the kind of people who like this music enough to get on the internet and chat about it tend to not be mindless hedonist drug types, but the type of people who make up the bulk of a crowd at any given trance party are definately drug lovers. I think it is sad that us music fans are outnumbered by those drug fans, but fads are a much more powerful force than the musical passion of a few kids scattered accross the Internet.

But like all fads, they die...true music lovers always remain.