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Originally posted by Demoted I'm an idiot because I don't agree with you? Usually, the dimmer of two parties in a debate is the one who first slings insults in an attempt to prove some convoluted point. I'd prefer no vocals in my dance moozak to be honest unless they're implemented well, but there really is no stipulation on how to not make vocals cheesy. Just like there's no guideline to writing a "good" song. It's all subjective. I think all those vocals you listed as liking are cheesy or earfuckingly annoying. Your point I have yet to ascertain.

if its subjective stop making it sound like fact. and just cos u dont like the vocals doesnt make them "cheesy"....there is a difference between just plain shit vocals and "cheesy" vocals.

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Originally posted by distant electro is a sub genre of house, if its not house wat genre is it then genius?

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Originally posted by trancepunkk if its subjective stop making it sound like fact. and just cos u dont like the vocals doesnt make them "cheesy"....there is a difference between just plain shit vocals and "cheesy" vocals.

I'm going to have to take Demoted's side on this one. The vocal tracks you're mentioning are, without a doubt, cheesy. Now you need to keep in mind that cheesy isn't necessarily bad. It is indeed all subjective and you're free to touch yourself to those cheesy tunes all night long if you so please. Now honestly:

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I tremble through the night But it's hard not knowing where you are. Shall I call the angels Or just drink, myself sober again. I'm serious in love. I'm serious in pain. When I try to reach the velvet morning.

You can possibly tell me those lyrics don't absolutely REEK of cheese. Shall I call the angels? tra la la...

c'mon now...

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Originally posted by D-res You can possibly tell me those lyrics don't absolutely REEK of cheese. Shall I call the angels? tra la la... c'mon now...

Not to mention they make no sense whatsoever. Still, the MdG remix is great.

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Originally posted by Mr.Mystery Not to mention they make no sense whatsoever. Still, the MdG remix is great.

I've heard samples but I don't think I've heard the whole thing. I don't listen to trance ever anymore, which is a shame considering what a captivating genre it used to be for me. Never the less, in my hay day of trance fanboyisms, I was a fan of MdG. In fact, regardless of the cheese factor emanating from your run-of-the-mill Kyau vs Albert production, I used to think it was catchy.

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Originally posted by D-res I'm going to have to take Demoted's side on this one. The vocal tracks you're mentioning are, without a doubt, cheesy. Now you need to keep in mind that cheesy isn't necessarily bad. It is indeed all subjective and you're free to touch yourself to those cheesy tunes all night long if you so please. Now honestly: You can possibly tell me those lyrics don't absolutely REEK of cheese. Shall I call the angels? tra la la... c'mon now...

haha true, those lyrics are quite "cheesy" but if u read me correctly i was comparing it to the tracks made by kva this year and i said that u cant call the ones this year cheesy and then call the other ones good. which is wat alot of other people did. but fuck oceanlab productions are 29083781902319027 times better than any kva track.

i hate kva tracks anyway lol, i never said i liked them it just seems liek this guy calls everything cheese.

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Originally posted by distant electro is a sub genre of house, if its not house wat genre is it then genius?

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Originally posted by trancepunkk haha true, those lyrics are quite "cheesy" but if u read me correctly i was comparing it to the tracks made by kva this year and i said that u cant call the ones this year cheesy and then call the other ones good. which is wat alot of other people did. but fuck oceanlab productions are 29083781902319027 times better than any kva track. i hate kva tracks anyway lol, i never said i liked them it just seems liek this guy calls everything cheese.

well in all honesty, a solid chunk of vocal productions are cheesy. you bring up Oceanlab. Admittedly, I have "satellite" on vinyl, although it was the first one I bought, among a tiesto 4 pack and "burned with desire" which is also cheesy crap. Keep in mind I bought them in my less 'elitist' days when I didn't know much about the genre and bought them simply because i recognized them and, at the time, thought they were good.

Still, there isnt much one can do to produce a vocal track without it being cheesy, and once again cheesy does not equal bad, because bad is subjective and entirely opinion, where as cheesy is just that and there's nothing anyone can do to make it otherwise.

What what!!
Why do you think there is "vocal trance"?

what else would you exspect as vocals in trance anyways!?
30 unique sang lines of lyrics in a track? erhm.. impossibele.

just doesnt fit, repeat and stuff.. look at poems, vocal trance is nothing different but a short cut of poems.

and the best vocal trance tracks might for some users be those, who have lots of different vocals, and not just "hey hey hey hey hey" repeatings and alike.

that is what makes "vocal trance" good and not cheesy, at least to me.

for those who do not like vocals, they do not like vocals, so what is it all about saying velvet morning, oceanlab, and maybe motorcycle are cheesy? they indeed are not, they are upper class vocal trance tracks with massive sounds. accept it!

and do not blame vocal trance, its not cheesy.

Last edited by Muhcow on Nov-16-2006 at 15:52

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Originally posted by Muhcow What what!! Why do you think there is "vocal trance"? what else would you exspect as vocals in trance anyways!? 30 unique sang lines of lyrics in a track? erhm.. impossibele. just doesnt fit, repeat and stuff.. look at poems, vocal trance is nothing different but a short cut of poems. and the best vocal trance tracks might for some users be those, who have lots of different vocals, and not just "hey hey hey hey hey" repeatings and alike. that is what makes "vocal trance" good and not cheesy, at least to me. for those who do not like vocals, they do not like vocals, so what is it all about saying velvet morning, oceanlab, and maybe motorcycle are cheesy? they indeed are not, they are upper class vocal trance tracks with massive sounds. accept it! and do not blame vocal trance, its not cheesy.

No, those are cheesy

Not cheesy vocals (imo):

Mercury & Solace, Beautiful Things, WoW - Stealth, Sarah M - Stupid, Lustral - Broken.

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Originally posted by trancepunkk if its subjective stop making it sound like fact. and just cos u dont like the vocals doesnt make them "cheesy"....there is a difference between just plain shit vocals and "cheesy" vocals.

"you're haaaalf a worrrrld awayyyyyyy...."

"cleaaaaaaaaaaaaar blueeee waaaaaaterrrr..."

that shit sounds cheesy to me. I recite them as fact because they are factual to me. If you tend to take other people spouting their opinion in a factual manner as fact then it sounds like a personal issue to me of your inability to discern. I shouldn't have to start or end any of my opinions by stating that it's my opinion.

you dont write poems i bet :-)

if you ever write one.. eh..
ah! good idea,

go watch "dead poets society".

i mean, falling in love and beeing totally overwhelmed by that crazy feeling you might really miss someone THAT much, that you even think like they sing.

and that is how such songs are made.

i think you might not like romantics. but who cares?! its really up to anyone what he likes and dislkes.

though it is worth a discussion, what "cheese" is and what not.

for me cheese it is something, you can not listen to 3 times in a row without going mad.

taking an example for really not cheese:

"the killers - mr. brightside (jacques lu cont's thin white duke remix)"

absolutelyy brilliant, long lyrics, perfect way to treat a sound and vocal.

cheese: groove coverage - god is a girl .. that is cheese, very public music you can catch easily.

tahts whats cheese for me.

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Originally posted by Muhcow you dont write poems i bet :-) if you ever write one.. eh.. ah! good idea, go watch "dead poets society". i mean, falling in love and beeing totally overwhelmed by that crazy feeling you might really miss someone THAT much, that you even think like they sing. and that is how such songs are made. i think you might not like romantics. but who cares?! its really up to anyone what he likes and dislkes. though it is worth a discussion, what "cheese" is and what not. for me cheese it is something, you can not listen to 3 times in a row without going mad. taking an example for really not cheese: "the killers - mr. brightside (jacques lu cont's thin white duke remix)" absolutelyy brilliant, long lyrics, perfect way to treat a sound and vocal. cheese: groove coverage - god is a girl .. that is cheese, very public music you can catch easily. tahts whats cheese for me.

You're a victim of incorrect assumption. Despite the trivialities surrounding whether or not I'm an artistic/abstract writer, I still deem sappy love clichés as cheese. Those are lyrics that can be found in umpteen many love ballads with large, anthemic breaks. They're disposable, sugary, and require almost no thought to write. Those types of lyrics serve almost no purpose other than to be some sing-songy syrup usually there to hide the poor production work behind the actual song.

There's only so many times I wish to digest archetypal lovey trance tracks before I tend to gouge my ears out of place. Just like there's only so many romantic comedies I can handle with a predictable story line and a sappy overtone.

This is one of my definitions of cheese, and Oceanlab tracks fit the bill perfectly. It's entirely in your right to disagree, and it's completely up to debate as it is all subjective, but I doubt either side will convince the other of the contrary. But I'm certainly not incorrect in my estimation of cheese.

*reaches out my hand* you are good someone to discuss with :-)

/edit: mind me, but those who like to predict the end of a movie or a sound, that takes all the miracle of it.

you live faster if you think like that, its like when you drive through unknown terrain, the 1st time you drive through it seems to feel longer, than the 2nd. so its with movies! you watch many, recognize parallels, and then you guess and are right about the end.. fine.. but everything is just a repeat of something before, most times at least.

unless you invent. and not everybody can invent every day!

learn to wonder again :-) even about things you seem to "know".

(i study physics, maybe that is why i think like that, you dont have to agree with me, indeed, but life is less interesting if you think you know it all!)

/edit 2: poor poor cow :°(