quote:

Originally posted by shaolin_Z McCain fucking rules!

That is awesome, and simple.

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quote:

Originally posted by ******** Seplling don't demonstrate intelligence and educatoin - knowing does.

quote:

Originally posted by shaolin_Z McCain fucking rules!

That is fuckin scary,and whats sad is that you dont hear much media coverage on this at all or barely.

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quote:

Originally posted by hardcore trancer That is fuckin scary,and whats sad is that you dont hear much media coverage on this at all or barely.

don't worry, once Obama disposes of Clinton you will certainly see all the democratic money going into commercials exposing this.

quote:

Originally posted by jerZ07002 don't worry, once Obama disposes of Clinton you will certainly see all the democratic money going into commercials exposing this.

And I'm sure it will go right back on Obama for all the stuff the media gives HIM a pass for... for the record, I can't stand McCain either, and I think that video is awesome. I'm just offering up the other side's points because Obama seriously has everyone make excuses for him when he makes mistakes, flip flops, or lies.
Obama the perpetual gaffe machine:

Last May, he claimed that tornadoes in Kansas killed a whopping 10,000 people: “In case you missed it, this week, there was a tragedy in Kansas. Ten thousand people died — an entire town destroyed.” The actual death toll: 12.

Earlier this month in Oregon, he redrew the map of the United States: “Over the last 15 months, we’ve traveled to every corner of the United States. I’ve now been in 57 states? I think one left to go.”

Last week, in front of a roaring Sioux Falls, S.D., audience, Obama exulted: “Thank you, Sioux City. ... I said it wrong. I’ve been in Iowa for too long. I’m sorry.”

Explaining last week why he was trailing Hillary Clinton in Kentucky, Obama again botched basic geography: “Sen. Clinton, I think, is much better known, coming from a nearby state of Arkansas. So it’s not surprising that she would have an advantage in some of those states in the middle.” On what map is Arkansas closer to Kentucky than Illinois?

Obama has as much trouble with numbers as he has with maps. Last March, on the anniversary of the Bloody Sunday march in Selma, Ala., he claimed his parents united as a direct result of the civil rights movement: “There was something stirring across the country because of what happened in Selma, Ala., because some folks are willing to march across a bridge. So they got together and Barack Obama Jr. was born.” Obama was born in 1961. The Selma march took place in 1965. His spokesman, Bill Burton, later explained that Obama was “speaking metaphorically about the civil-rights movement as a whole.”

Earlier this month in Cape Girardeau, Mo., Obama showed off his knowledge of the war in Afghanistan by homing in on a lack of translators: “We only have a certain number of them, and if they are all in Iraq, then it’s harder for us to use them in Afghanistan.” The real reason it’s “harder for us to use them” in Afghanistan: Iraqis speak Arabic or Kurdish. The Afghanis speak Pashto, Farsi, or other non-Arabic languages.

Over the weekend in Oregon, Obama pleaded ignorance of the decades-old, multibillion-dollar massive Hanford nuclear-waste cleanup: “Here’s something that you will rarely hear from a politician, and that is that I’m not familiar with the Hanford, uuuuhh, site, so I don’t know exactly what’s going on there. (Applause.) Now, having said that, I promise you I’ll learn about it by the time I leave here on the ride back to the airport.” I assume on that ride, a staffer reminded him that he’s voted on at least one defense-authorization bill that addressed the “costs, schedules, and technical issues” dealing with the nation’s most contaminated nuclear-waste site.

Last March, the Chicago Tribune reported this little-noticed nugget about a fake autobiographical detail in Obama’s Dreams from My Father: “Then, there’s the copy of Life magazine that Obama presents as his racial awakening at age 9. In it, he wrote, was an article and two accompanying photographs of an African-American man physically and mentally scarred by his efforts to lighten his skin. In fact, the Life article and the photographs don’t exist, say the magazine’s own historians.”

And in perhaps the most seriously troubling set of gaffes of them all, Obama told a Portland crowd over the weekend that Iran doesn’t “pose a serious threat to us” — cluelessly arguing that “tiny countries” with small defense budgets can’t do us harm — and then promptly flip-flopped the next day, claiming, “I’ve made it clear for years that the threat from Iran is grave.” All this after he said he wouldn't meet with Iran without preconditions, but was shown in the July Youtube debate clearly stating he would meet with Iran, Castro, Chavez, etc. without preconditions.

Haha, copying and pasting from an email forward, eh?

quote:

Originally posted by The17sss And I'm sure it will go right back on Obama for all the stuff the media gives HIM a pass for... for the record, I can't stand McCain either, and I think that video is awesome. I'm just offering up the other side's points because Obama seriously has everyone make excuses for him when he makes mistakes, flip flops, or lies. Obama the perpetual gaffe machine: Last May, he claimed that tornadoes in Kansas killed a whopping 10,000 people: “In case you missed it, this week, there was a tragedy in Kansas. Ten thousand people died — an entire town destroyed.” The actual death toll: 12.

Damn, a hyperbole. He's sure not fit to run for President.

quote:

Earlier this month in Oregon, he redrew the map of the United States: “Over the last 15 months, we’ve traveled to every corner of the United States. I’ve now been in 57 states? I think one left to go.”

Met by polite laughter I assure you - after all, it was a joke.

quote:

Last week, in front of a roaring Sioux Falls, S.D., audience, Obama exulted: “Thank you, Sioux City. ... I said it wrong. I’ve been in Iowa for too long. I’m sorry.”

Considering the fact that he actually DID campaign repeatedly in Sioux City, Iowa, it's awfully hard to give him a pass for comparing the two cities that are, oh, thirty miles apart.

quote:

Explaining last week why he was trailing Hillary Clinton in Kentucky, Obama again botched basic geography: “Sen. Clinton, I think, is much better known, coming from a nearby state of Arkansas. So it’s not surprising that she would have an advantage in some of those states in the middle.” On what map is Arkansas closer to Kentucky than Illinois?

Pretty much any map you take a look at, actually. A simple Mapquest shows that Little Rock, Arkansas to the nearest town in Kentucky (Mayfield) is 280 miles. Chicago to the closest town (Owensboro) is 397 miles. Crucify him!

quote:

Obama has as much trouble with numbers as he has with maps. Last March, on the anniversary of the Bloody Sunday march in Selma, Ala., he claimed his parents united as a direct result of the civil rights movement: “There was something stirring across the country because of what happened in Selma, Ala., because some folks are willing to march across a bridge. So they got together and Barack Obama Jr. was born.” Obama was born in 1961. The Selma march took place in 1965. His spokesman, Bill Burton, later explained that Obama was “speaking metaphorically about the civil-rights movement as a whole.”

Actually, that one was pretty obviously about the civil-rights movement in general. These are the best you can come up with to slam the guy?

quote:

Earlier this month in Cape Girardeau, Mo., Obama showed off his knowledge of the war in Afghanistan by homing in on a lack of translators: “We only have a certain number of them, and if they are all in Iraq, then it’s harder for us to use them in Afghanistan.” The real reason it’s “harder for us to use them” in Afghanistan: Iraqis speak Arabic or Kurdish. The Afghanis speak Pashto, Farsi, or other non-Arabic languages.

Forget the fact that most career translators know multiple languages from a single region... and then it looks like Obama's a moron! Yeah!

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Over the weekend in Oregon, Obama pleaded ignorance of the decades-old, multibillion-dollar massive Hanford nuclear-waste cleanup: “Here’s something that you will rarely hear from a politician, and that is that I’m not familiar with the Hanford, uuuuhh, site, so I don’t know exactly what’s going on there. (Applause.) Now, having said that, I promise you I’ll learn about it by the time I leave here on the ride back to the airport.” I assume on that ride, a staffer reminded him that he’s voted on at least one defense-authorization bill that addressed the “costs, schedules, and technical issues” dealing with the nation’s most contaminated nuclear-waste site.

Glad you could pull up that legislation for us to see rather than insinuating that he's probably voted on it before.

quote:

Last March, the Chicago Tribune reported this little-noticed nugget about a fake autobiographical detail in Obama’s Dreams from My Father: “Then, there’s the copy of Life magazine that Obama presents as his racial awakening at age 9. In it, he wrote, was an article and two accompanying photographs of an African-American man physically and mentally scarred by his efforts to lighten his skin. In fact, the Life article and the photographs don’t exist, say the magazine’s own historians.”

What? You're using a possible forgotten detail in a memory from when he was 9? You're really scraping the bottom of the barrel for swift-boating topics, eh?

quote:

And in perhaps the most seriously troubling set of gaffes of them all, Obama told a Portland crowd over the weekend that Iran doesn’t “pose a serious threat to us” — cluelessly arguing that “tiny countries” with small defense budgets can’t do us harm — and then promptly flip-flopped the next day, claiming, “I’ve made it clear for years that the threat from Iran is grave.” All this after he said he wouldn't meet with Iran without preconditions, but was shown in the July Youtube debate clearly stating he would meet with Iran, Castro, Chavez, etc. without preconditions.

Iran is sliiiiiiiiiiightly larger than Iraq, has a sliiiiiiiiiightly larger defense budget, and um, yeah, has a nuclear weapons program. And way to compare apples to oranges with that last sentence - considering he said he'd meet a representative of the Iranian regime without preconditions, but would not meet Ahmedinejad without preconditions. Congratulations, you've successfully made your side look ridiculous and Obama look pretty good by comparison.

On the other hand, McCain can't tell the difference between Sunni and Shi'a, STILL doesn't know his own position on HIV/AIDS prevention/treatment (he refers everyone to Tom "condoms are evil" Coburn on that question, says he doesn't care if we're in Iraq for 100 years or 1000 years, and then flip-flops on whether or not we're already in World War III!!

quote:

John McCain said last night during a campaign tele-conference that he would bring back a military draft in the United States only in the case of a 'World War III' scenario. Reuters reported: Many Americans are fearful the U.S. government will be forced to reinstitute the draft given the prolonged Iraq and Afghanistan wars. Asked about that possibility by a potential voter in Florida during a telephone "town hall meeting," McCain said: "I don't know what would make a draft happen unless we were in an all-out World War III." ... McCain, a Vietnam veteran, said the draft during that conflict weighed most heavily on lower-income Americans, and that this should not be repeated. But McCain may be more open to the draft than it seems. During a July 2006 interview on CNN, McCain was asked about the following statement by Newt Gingrich: "We're in the early stages of what I would describes as the Third World War and, frankly, our bureaucracies aren't responding fast enough." Asked whether he agreed, McCain said: "I do to some extent. I think it's important to recognize that we have terrorist organizations which -- who are dangerous by themselves, are now being supported by radical Islamic governments, i.e., the Iranians, which makes them incredibly more dangerous because they are trained, equipped, motivated and assisted in every way by the Iranians." Also, as ThinkProgress noted, "Last October, President Bush himself warned of a coming 'World War III' with Iran. 'I've told people that if you're interested in avoiding World War III,' said the President. 'It seems like you ought to be interested in preventing them from have the knowledge necessary to make a nuclear weapon.'"

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/...l_n_109121.html

So congratulations, you're in favor of a candidate who would most likely reinstate the draft after starting (or continuing?) World War III. I hope you're comfortable with that.

Oh, he also doesn't seem to like voting very much:

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Republican presidential hopeful John McCain hasn’t voted in the Senate since April 8.

http://www.cqpolitics.com/wmspage.c...ws-000002904602

The stuff real Presidents are made of. But go ahead, keep using Obama's Illinois State Senate record - where it was normal to vote "present" - against the man.

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Originally posted by Lebezniatnikov Considering the fact that he actually DID campaign repeatedly in Sioux City, Iowa, it's awfully hard to give him a pass for comparing the two cities that are, oh, thirty miles apart. IS IT TOO MUCH TO ASK TO KNOW THE NAME OF THE CITY YOU'RE SPEAKING IN? HE DID THE SAME THING IN SUNRISE, FL WHEN HE CALLED IT "SUNSHINE" Pretty much any map you take a look at, actually. A simple Mapquest shows that Little Rock, Arkansas to the nearest town in Kentucky (Mayfield) is 280 miles. Chicago to the closest town (Owensboro) is 397 miles. Crucify him! HILARIOUSLY WEAK... WILL YOU STOP AT NOTHING TO MAKE EXCUSES FOR THIS MAN? ILLINIOS BORDERS KENTUCKY, ARKANSAS DOES NOT. THEREFORE, IT'S CLOSER. SIMPLE. Actually, that one was pretty obviously about the civil-rights movement in general. These are the best you can come up with to slam the guy? YOU'RE MISSING THE POINT... HE'S TRYING TO EMOTIONALLY CONNECT WITH THE PEOPLE ABOUT HIS BIRTH BEING DIRECTLY TIED TO AN IMPORTANT PIECE OF THEIR SHARED CULTURAL HISTORY. THAT EVENT HAPPENED IN 1965, AND HE WAS BORN IN 1961. Forget the fact that most career translators know multiple languages from a single region... and then it looks like Obama's a moron! Yeah! FOR THE FOREIGN POLICY SAVANT HE THINKS HE IS, YEAH, MAKING UP A LANGUAGE DOES MAKE HIM APPEAR TO BE A MORON IN THIS CASE. What? You're using a possible forgotten detail in a memory from when he was 9? You're really scraping the bottom of the barrel for swift-boating topics, eh? HAD McCAIN DONE THIS, THEY'D BE SAYING HE'S APPROACHING THE ONSET OF ALZHEIMERS. JUST ILLUSTRATING THE DOUBLE STANDARD AT WORK. Iran is sliiiiiiiiiiightly larger than Iraq, has a sliiiiiiiiiightly larger defense budget, and um, yeah, has a nuclear weapons program. And way to compare apples to oranges with that last sentence - considering he said he'd meet a representative of the Iranian regime without preconditions, but would not meet Ahmedinejad without preconditions. Congratulations, you've successfully made your side look ridiculous and Obama look pretty good by comparison. THE POINT IS THE FLIP FLOP, NOT DEFENSE BUDGETS! CUBA IS A TINY COUNTRY AND WAS PRETTY CLOSE TO SENDING NUKES OUR WAY IN THE 60's AS A PROXY FOR THE SOVIETS... WHAT'S TO THINK IRAN COULDN'T DO THE SAME BY WAY OF IRAQ? "AND, UM, YEAH"... HERE'S THE LINK TO OBAMA DIRECTLY SAYING HE WOULD MEET WITHOUT PRECONDITIONS WITH THE LEADERS OF IRAN, ETC. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oSFSUbMWenU AND HERE IS, FROM HIS OWN WEBSITE, SAYING THE SAME THING: "Diplomacy: Obama is the only major candidate who supports tough, direct presidential diplomacy with Iran without preconditions." On the other hand, McCain can't tell the difference between Sunni and Shi'a, STILL doesn't know his own position on HIV/AIDS prevention/treatment (he refers everyone to Tom "condoms are evil" Coburn on that question, says he doesn't care if we're in Iraq for 100 years or 1000 years, and then flip-flops on whether or not we're already in World War III!! LETS NOT GET INTO A FLIP FLOP COMPARISON... THEY ARE BOTH FLIP FLOPPING MACHINES, WITH WAY TOO MANY EXAMPLES TO CITE. NO NEED TO CONGRATUALTE ME, SMART GUY... I NEVER SAID I WAS A McCAIN SUPPORTER. I'M POINTING OUT THE BLATANT DOUBLE STANDARD AT WORK, AS OBAMA GETS A FREE PASS FOR EVERY MISTAKE HE MAKES. "OH HE WAS TIRED... HE'S BEEN ON THE CAMPAIGN TRAIL FOR 15 MONTHS, CUT HIM SOME SLACK... HE WAS REALLY JUST TRYING TO SAY THIS, BUT IT CAME OUT WRONG. HAPPENS TO ME ALL THE TIME." AND OTHER SHIT LIKE THAT. Oh, he also doesn't seem to like voting very much OBAMA VOTED "PRESENT" 130 TIMES I BELIEVE, AND 55% OF THE TIME HE VOTED "NOT VOTING." SWEET. NOW THAT'S WHAT PRESIDENTS ARE MADE OF

Sorry for not chopping up the quotes properly... I'm kinda new at this. My responses are mixed in above in the green box

Last edited by The17sss on Jul-02-2008 at 06:44

clearly both candidates don't know everything about everything, that's why they have a cabinet when elected.

haha I love how Lieberman is next to him and has to correct him

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soulful/latin/deep house + jazz

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Originally posted by mndeg clearly both candidates don't know everything about everything, that's why they have a cabinet when elected.

exactly. mccaine's gaffs were particularly brutal though

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Originally posted by The17sss IS IT TOO MUCH TO ASK TO KNOW THE NAME OF THE CITY YOU'RE SPEAKING IN? HE DID THE SAME THING IN SUNRISE, FL WHEN HE CALLED IT "SUNSHINE"

you're kidding right? people on the campaign trail? no sleep, in 10 different places a day? two names really similar? think that kind of expectation from a politician is incredibly naive.

quote:

Originally posted by The17sss FOR THE FOREIGN POLICY SAVANT HE THINKS HE IS, YEAH, MAKING UP A LANGUAGE DOES MAKE HIM APPEAR TO BE A MORON IN THIS CASE.

what are you talking about? he doesn't "make up a language". he refers to interpreters that are being used in iraq that could be used in afghanistan instead- do you think perhaps intelligence/language officers in iraq might be able to speak arabic AND farsi? you know, coz they're the kind of people that these agencies hire?

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Originally posted by The17sss HAD McCAIN DONE THIS, THEY'D BE SAYING HE'S APPROACHING THE ONSET OF ALZHEIMERS. JUST ILLUSTRATING THE DOUBLE STANDARD AT WORK.

wow. how superficial and irrelevant do you want to be? some issues and/or responses are going to get different treatment, and from different people. honestly, australian politicians would be embarrassed if these were the concerns of your people and/or media.

when is america going to grow the fuck up?

quote:

Originally posted by The17sss THE POINT IS THE FLIP FLOP, NOT DEFENSE BUDGETS! CUBA IS A TINY COUNTRY AND WAS PRETTY CLOSE TO SENDING NUKES OUR WAY IN THE 60's AS A PROXY FOR THE SOVIETS... WHAT'S TO THINK IRAN COULDN'T DO THE SAME BY WAY OF IRAQ?

what are you, 7? please explain to me the scenario you are envisaging. how exactly is iraq "useful" for someone that wants to use nukes against the US?

iran already has missiles that could reach US interests in iraq (or elsewhere close to home). they dont possess the technology to fire those missiles to the US mainland.

so in what way is would iraq act as a proxy for nuclear war against the US?

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Originally posted by The17sss LETS NOT GET INTO A FLIP FLOP COMPARISON... THEY ARE BOTH FLIP FLOPPING MACHINES, WITH WAY TOO MANY EXAMPLES TO CITE. NO NEED TO CONGRATUALTE ME, SMART GUY... I NEVER SAID I WAS A McCAIN SUPPORTER. I'M POINTING OUT THE BLATANT DOUBLE STANDARD AT WORK, AS OBAMA GETS A FREE PASS FOR EVERY MISTAKE HE MAKES. "OH HE WAS TIRED... HE'S BEEN ON THE CAMPAIGN TRAIL FOR 15 MONTHS, CUT HIM SOME SLACK... HE WAS REALLY JUST TRYING TO SAY THIS, BUT IT CAME OUT WRONG. HAPPENS TO ME ALL THE TIME." AND OTHER SHIT LIKE THAT.

oh ffs, grow up. this is the lack of political capital he has because he's from the same party as a really unpopular president. that's politics for crying out loud.

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First, what are you, Lebezniatnikov's big brother surrogate? No I'm not kidding. It's about the double standard.. that's what I'm trying to get you people to admit; that there's an obvious double standard at work with how Obama gets coddled by the media and his supporters every time he makes a mistake, shows ignorance, or flip flops, while McCain gets labled as senile, unstable, or whatever. I'm not arguing policy decisions and I'm not supporting McCain. Why is it so hard to admit how blantant and obvious it is? It is definitely not naive to expect a politician to know the name of the town they are speaking in, come on.

Next, yes he did make up a language... at the same speaking engagement he talked of translators speaking "Pashtun" rather than "Pashto." Again, I'm not focusing on the depth of the mistake, I'm making the double standard point, a la McCain getting hammered for confusing Sunni and Shiite in that one news reel.

I'm also embarrassed about how both parties are handling things. Every time something is said by one side, the other gets outrageously offended and demands retractions... they're in the big leagues now, not running for high school class president. If Australia's politicians don't waste so much time crying like little bitches, then my hat's off to Austrailain politics. On this point, I agree with you... politics here is a joke today.

On your Iran/Iraq proxy argument, as I already explained the point was the flip flop by Obama in back to back days, showing that double standard again. But it doesn't have to be nuclear; that's besides the point... I was just using the Soviets as an example, which doesn't change the fact that Obama talked out both sides of his mouth in back to back days. Iran is already using Iraq for gurella (sp) type warfare and supplying a lot of the hardware being used against Americans, so I'm sure they find some use in Iraq vs. the US.

Why do you keep suggesting I need to grow up, or that I think like a toddler? If I point out something, you keep interpreting it as me whining when I'm not; I'm pointing something out, and the people who are supporting Obama can't even acknowledge that there's some truth to what's being said... instead it gets thrown back at me as if I'm a McCain supporter or that I'm just some immature peon who can't look at the big picture. None of this post is about taking sides for McCain

quote:

Originally posted by The17sss First, what are you, Lebezniatnikov's big brother surrogate? No I'm not kidding. It's about the double standard.. that's what I'm trying to get you people to admit; that there's an obvious double standard at work with how Obama gets coddled by the media and his supporters every time he makes a mistake, shows ignorance, or flip flops, while McCain gets labled as senile, unstable, or whatever.

Methinks you need better evidence to make your point. There might well be a double standard, but the specific incidents you point to with Obama were mostly moments taken entirely out of context by yourself. Also, there is a difference between saying that Obama will meet with Ahmedinejad without preconditions and saying that he'll meet with members of the Iranian regime without preconditions. I didn't think I would actually need to point that out to you... but well... I was evidentally wrong.

quote:

I'm not arguing policy decisions and I'm not supporting McCain. Why is it so hard to admit how blantant and obvious it is?

Again, because your examples don't make it blatant or obvious?

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It is definitely not naive to expect a politician to know the name of the town they are speaking in, come on.

You've never misspoke and then caught yourself before finishing the sentence? The17sss for President!

quote:

Next, yes he did make up a language... at the same speaking engagement he talked of translators speaking "Pashtun" rather than "Pashto." Again, I'm not focusing on the depth of the mistake, I'm making the double standard point, a la McCain getting hammered for confusing Sunni and Shiite in that one news reel.

Um. Wow. Comparing apples to Mount Kilimanjaro in my opinion. Using an improper suffix (one used to describe the people that speak a given language) hardly compares to mixing up the two dominent religious groups within the world's second largest religion - moreover, the two defining identities of radical parties blowing each other (and American troops) up in Iraq.

quote:

I'm also embarrassed about how both parties are handling things. Every time something is said by one side, the other gets outrageously offended and demands retractions... they're in the big leagues now, not running for high school class president. If Australia's politicians don't waste so much time crying like little bitches, then my hat's off to Austrailain politics. On this point, I agree with you... politics here is a joke today.

Thank you for contributing to that by dumbing down the discourse.

quote:

On your Iran/Iraq proxy argument, as I already explained the point was the flip flop by Obama in back to back days, showing that double standard again. But it doesn't have to be nuclear; that's besides the point... I was just using the Soviets as an example, which doesn't change the fact that Obama talked out both sides of his mouth in back to back days. Iran is already using Iraq for gurella (sp) type warfare and supplying a lot of the hardware being used against Americans, so I'm sure they find some use in Iraq vs. the US.

Ok, you need to point out how the original comment is a flip flop, because I'm struggling to understand you here. Obama on Day 1: "Iran does not pose a threat to the United States, in large part because of a small military budget and lack of technological infrastructure." Obama on Day 2: "Iran poses a threat to stability." Are those statements mutually exclusive, and if so, how?

quote:

Why do you keep suggesting I need to grow up, or that I think like a toddler? If I point out something, you keep interpreting it as me whining when I'm not; I'm pointing something out, and the people who are supporting Obama can't even acknowledge that there's some truth to what's being said...

Because we have no earthly idea what you're on about. Each of these "gaffes" you have pointed out are anything but. If Obama uses the word "a" instead of the proper "an" before a word starting with a vowel, does that also preclude him from being a respectable candidate for President?

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quote:

Originally posted by Lebezniatnikov Also, there is a difference between saying that Obama will meet with Ahmedinejad without preconditions and saying that he'll meet with members of the Iranian regime without preconditions. I didn't think I would actually need to point that out to you... but well... I was evidentally wrong. The17sss for President!

Zzzzzz.... love the condescending style. It's ok to discuss things without acting like that, even when you disagree. Anyway your original quote said Obama would meet with members of the regime without preconditions, but not with Ahmedinejad without preconditions. You----> "...considering he said he'd meet a representative of the Iranian regime without preconditions, but would not meet Ahmedinejad without preconditions. Congratulations, you've successfully made your side look ridiculous and Obama look pretty good by comparison."

I showed you a video clip of his own words coming right out of his mouth saying he would meet with him without preconditions, and the text strait from his website saying the same thing. Yet, you are trying to spin it like I mixed something up. If I can't even get you to admit you were wrong on that, I'm not going to even try to get into the theoretical portions of your "arguments."

Yes... The17sss for Prez. Will you write me in on the ballot in November? You'd vote for me and you know it!

So much time and so many blunders by McCain have come and gone, but I think this one is worthy of being added to the list:

quote:

Speaking to reporters about the situation in Georgia, Sen. John McCain denounced the aggressive posture of Russia by claiming that: "in the 21st century nations don't invade other nations." It was the type of foreign policy rhetorical blunder that has regularly plagued the McCain campaign and could have diplomatic ripples as well. Certainly the comment was meant in innocence. But for those predisposed to the notion that the U.S. is an increasingly arrogant international actor, the suggestion by a presidential candidate that, in this day and age, countries don't invade one another -- when the U.S. is occupying two foreign nations -- does little to alleviate that negative perception. There is another, less controversial undertone to McCain's remark. Since the Georgia-Russia hostilities have commenced, parallels have been drawn to U.S. intervention in Iraq. The two scenarios are highly different in all intents and purposes, both due to regional significance and the longstanding territorial disputes. But some still would dispute the idea, as McCain seemed to imply, that America's involvement in Iraq is any less an invasion than Russia's involvement in Georgia. Later in his press conference, McCain was asked to address how the Georgian crisis -- which has ceded to a tenuous ceasefire -- was amplified on the campaign trail. The presumptive Republican nominee demurred from attempts to get him to engage with Barack Obama. "This isn't a time for partisanship and sniping between campaigns," he said. "This is about hundreds of thousand of individuals whose lives are being taken... Maybe later on in the campaign let's have a back and forth about whose comments and statements... but now lets devote all our efforts to resolving a situation that is fraught with tragedy." A subsequent questioner asked McCain whether this non-partisan window applied to Sen. Joseph Lieberman as well, who, at a townhall on Tuesday, suggested that Barack Obama had not always "put his country first." McCain's answer was classically evasive. "Let me respond by just saying that I think that whatever we think at the moment that we can all reserve that for a future time. And I think that judgments will be made about how we handled this situation and approached the situation in Iraq and how much experience knowledge and background means in selecting who should be the next commander in chief, all I can say is there will be plenty of time for that and we can move forward."

In addition, lest we forget:

quote:

So where did the Georgians get the silly idea that the U.S. would bail them out? Maybe from John McCain, Republican heir apparent, whose top foreign policy advisor, Randy Scheunemann, also just happens to be a highly paid lobbyist for the Georgian government. Whoops -- correction! Scheunemann usedto be a highly paid lobbyist for Georgia. The McCain campaign says Scheunemann hasn't taken a dime from the Georgians since May 15. (Which is lucky for the Georgians, who are going to need all the spare cash they can get to rebuild all the stuff the Russians just bombed.) According to the Washington Post, the relationship between Scheunemann and Georgia used to be very cozy (not to mention lucrative for Scheunemann). Between Jan. 1, 2007, and May 15, 2008, while Scheunemann was also a paid McCain advisor, "Georgia paid his firm $290,000 in lobbying fees." And what did Georgia get in return? Well, no troops, that's for sure. But they got Scheunemann's (expensive) pledge to garner U.S. support for Georgia's admission to NATO and for its claims to South Ossetia, and his commitment to use his ties to politicians such as McCain to advance Georgia's causes. McCain has sponsored legislation supporting Georgia's claims over South Ossetia, an issue on which he was lobbied by Scheunemann's firm. And as recently as mid-April, Scheunemann was simultaneously taking money from Georgia and actively preparing McCain for supportive calls with Georgian President Mikheil Saakashvili. Is it any wonder that Saakashvili concluded that he had the backing of the U.S. Republican power structure when it came to South Ossetia?

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion...,4988958.column

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