I just listened to the blue album samples again just to be sure.

No... I was right the first time... your all focked in the head. no offence.

I just cant understand a comparison between something thats almost perfect with good drums and good synths (airdrawndagger) to something that is absolutely retarded and has short synths with no echoes or reverbs on them and the same dodgy drums that Orbital have been using for years.

what the fucking fuck?

quote:

Originally posted by SYSTEM-J It's from 2004. It's two years younger than Airdrawndagger. You're probably associating it with the other coloured Orbital albums - Green (from 1991) and Brown (1993).

So I am

And meneedit: I'm not saying (based on the samples) that I'd like it as much as Airdrawndagger, based on what I hear I'm not agreeing so much with the idea that it fixes what Airdrawndagger does wrong (which IMO is nothing) but I do hear some similarities in style. To each their own, I will be checking this album out though, thank you for the recommendation again. Still would be nice to hear a followup or something of the sort to Airdrawndagger -- but that's for another time

quote:

Originally posted by meneedit I just cant understand a comparison between something thats almost perfect with good drums and good synths (airdrawndagger) to something that is absolutely retarded and has short synths with no echoes or reverbs on them and the same dodgy drums that Orbital have been using for years.

Yeah, because "good synths" and "dodgy drums" aren't totally subjective, are they? And perhaps we're associating them because they have the same shiny, austere textures and atmosphere, where as you seem to want an Airdrawndagger clone with new melodies.

Airdrawndagger is not a masterpiece. It's a slick, icy work of synths that lacks real standouts, direction and inventiveness. Sasha took the safe option with it, and while the result is strong, it is never brilliant. So give it a rest, because if it wasn't made by a certain arrogant wanker then you wouldn't lather half as much praise on it.

___________________
Mixes:
> Maximum Elevation [Progressive House]
> DI.FM 26th Anniversary Guest Mix [Progressive House]
> Live @ Dance:Love:Hub London, 11.10.2025
> Higher Peaks [Progressive House]
> Dance:Love:Hub Afterparty (The Return) 23.11.24

Like these sets? Come see me play live at Kibosh in Manchester: https://www.instagram.com/kibosh.mcr/

quote:

Originally posted by SYSTEM-J Yeah, because "good synths" and "dodgy drums" aren't totally subjective, are they? And perhaps we're associating them because they have the same shiny, austere textures and atmosphere, where as you seem to want an Airdrawndagger clone with new melodies. Airdrawndagger is not a masterpiece. It's a slick, icy work of synths that lacks real standouts, direction and inventiveness. Sasha took the safe option with it, and while the result is strong, it is never brilliant. So give it a rest, because if it wasn't made by a certain arrogant wanker then you wouldn't lather half as much praise on it.

While I don't think the statements were directed at me, I think I stop agreeing with you here. When I first got the album I hadn't heard much of Sasha, and had never really cared for names in the first place anyways. In fact until a year or two ago I was oblivious to the existence of DJ Mag and all of those things, though I still listened to trance and other EDM genres. I think his album is VERY well made, and it does show brilliance. Perhaps it wasn't made with direction, I'll agree with that, but I think that adds to the final result. I hear Airdrawndagger (I realize you don't agree) as more of an experimental album from him, and I think it was more than a little of a success in my ears Just my $0.02, not out to start an argument of any sort here as it IS all subjective in this case.

I didn't base it on Sasha's other work. I had only heard the Xpander EP prior to Airdrawndagger, and I knew not to expect the same. I do enjoy the album, but Meneedit is elevating it to a pedestal of brilliance that I really don't think it deserves. He's also slating the Blue Album, which may be less-than-perfect, but has as strong a case for perfection as Airdrawndagger.

So I'm not slating it, I'm just getting irritated by Meneedit, who seems to think we're insane for not automatically agreeing with his perception.

Also: it's good to see you defend your tastes and stand up for yourself. A lot of people would have replied to that post with "you're just an elitist/hater/jealous twat". Respect for that.

___________________
Mixes:
> Maximum Elevation [Progressive House]
> DI.FM 26th Anniversary Guest Mix [Progressive House]
> Live @ Dance:Love:Hub London, 11.10.2025
> Higher Peaks [Progressive House]
> Dance:Love:Hub Afterparty (The Return) 23.11.24

Like these sets? Come see me play live at Kibosh in Manchester: https://www.instagram.com/kibosh.mcr/

quote:

Originally posted by SYSTEM-J I didn't base it on Sasha's other work. I had only heard the Xpander EP prior to Airdrawndagger, and I knew not to expect the same. I do enjoy the album, but Meneedit is elevating it to a pedestal of brilliance that I really don't think it deserves. He's also slating the Blue Album, which may be less-than-perfect, but has as strong a case for perfection as Airdrawndagger. So I'm not slating it, I'm just getting irritated by Meneedit, who seems to think we're insane for not automatically agreeing with his perception. Also: it's good to see you defend your tastes and stand up for yourself. A lot of people would have replied to that post with "you're just an elitist/hater/jealous twat". Respect for that.

Ah.. what I said earlier wasn't completely true -- I had heard Xpander off of Clubber's Guide Mixed by ATB for the first time -- completely forgot about that.

And I understand where you're coming from with the defense of the album, I misunderstood your comments on Airdrawndagger. I myself can't really comment on more than the samples I've heard of "Blue" -- I'll say that from what I've heard there are some things I definitely can understand where you're coming from with the relationship between the two, and I think I'd enjoy the album overall -- though there was a sample (I can't recall which) that wasn't to my liking.

Thanks for the recognition there btw, I tend to avoid speaking in topics that resort to the whole "elitist" routine which I personally have seen way too much of here (a reason for my not posting so much). Glad to see there are some open minded people here though; I see way too much political-style commentary on trance these days so it's refreshing to have someone speak with an open mind.

In any case, I think it's time to let this topic go back to it's original purpose -- I do second getting Solarstone's chillout compilation as mentioned earlier btw, forgot to say so earlier, definitely good for relaxing and sleeping

quote:

It's a slick, icy work of synths that lacks real standouts, direction and inventiveness.

For someone who just got done chiding someone for subjectiveness, you know how to lay the subjectivity on thick, don't you?

The way I see it, in a world where the disctintion between album and compilation is becoming increasingly blurred, Sasha made an attempt to redistinguish the two with ADG. He attempted what very few artists even think to do: he attempted to make a series of songs that not only stood on their own, but formed a cohesive whole.

I think you only go halfway with your characterization of the album lacking any standouts. Give the album a listen-through, and yes, no one track will stand out; that's the point. However, tracks like Wavy Gravy have still shown up individually in clubs and parties. Many of the tracks can stand alone when considered alone. That's what an album is. In a way, one could call it a "themed compilation." It is a collection of tracks that maintain a single thought or theme. In fact, these are very rare these days.

Orbital's Blue Album is, despite its name, a compilation. Near as I can tell, there's no theme, atmospheric or otherwise. Between tracks that could very well have been part of an album, they insert tracks like Acid Pants (which is a good song, just not in keeping with any theme the album could have had). There is no consideration for flow or cohesiveness. It's just a collection of the best tracks Orbital has made since their last release. It's good stuff, but it's no album.

___________________

www.jexmusic.com - My website

quote:

Originally posted by thoughtlessjex For someone who just got done chiding someone for subjectiveness, you know how to lay the subjectivity on thick, don't you?

I thought that taking an equally strong-voiced tone to demonstrate the percievable flaws in the album would be an effective piece of rhetoric. IE: shout back just as loud to show his opinion isn't as universal as he thinks.

quote:

The way I see it, in a world where the disctintion between album and compilation is becoming increasingly blurred, Sasha made an attempt to redistinguish the two with ADG. He attempted what very few artists even think to do: he attempted to make a series of songs that not only stood on their own, but formed a cohesive whole.

Orbital are no strangers to that. Brown Album is one of the best examples of a journey album I've ever heard, and in terms of critical success and longevity amongst fans it's one of the most famous examples in EDM. However:

quote:

I think you only go halfway with your characterization of the album lacking any standouts. Give the album a listen-through, and yes, no one track will stand out; that's the point. However, tracks like Wavy Gravy have still shown up individually in clubs and parties. Many of the tracks can stand alone when considered alone. That's what an album is. In a way, one could call it a "themed compilation." It is a collection of tracks that maintain a single thought or theme. In fact, these are very rare these days.

Airdrawndagger is indeed a "once through" album rather than a collection of songs. However, even this type of album has peaks and valleys: tracks which stand-out, other tracks which bridge. Keeping with the Brown Album, I'll use the example of Halcyon & On & On. Whether as part of the album or on its own, it's extremely strong- yet it fits perfectly. Airdrawndagger lacks that. I'd almost say that the low-level nature of the tracks means that it's a lazy journey album- rather than developing distinct themes in each track with progress, it's just a mash-up of synth layers which naturally glide into each other. Is there really any emotional theme to any of the tracks on it? The tracks are not particularly evocative, they all seem to be the same, slightly distant flavour of ice-cold synth class. It's great audio confectionary, but that's the principle reason why I don't rate Airdrawndagger that highly. It's style over substance in many cases.

quote:

Orbital's Blue Album is, despite its name, a compilation. Near as I can tell, there's no theme, atmospheric or otherwise. Between tracks that could very well have been part of an album, they insert tracks like Acid Pants (which is a good song, just not in keeping with any theme the album could have had). There is no consideration for flow or cohesiveness. It's just a collection of the best tracks Orbital has made since their last release. It's good stuff, but it's no album.

It's a retrospective album. The tracks sum up Orbital's career. There is structure- we move from melancholy ambience on the opener to high-tempo uplifting warmth by the time we hit One Perfect Sunrise. The album becomes slowly more animated and upbeat. I agree it isn't seamless- but it's not intended to be, as Orbital have shown in the past that they can do solid albums. I mentioned Blue because it reminded me of Airdrawndagger simply in sound- the polished, slightly weightless heady synthness, especially on early tracks.

___________________
Mixes:
> Maximum Elevation [Progressive House]
> DI.FM 26th Anniversary Guest Mix [Progressive House]
> Live @ Dance:Love:Hub London, 11.10.2025
> Higher Peaks [Progressive House]
> Dance:Love:Hub Afterparty (The Return) 23.11.24

Like these sets? Come see me play live at Kibosh in Manchester: https://www.instagram.com/kibosh.mcr/

regardless of all this discussion i've stil yet to hear something as impressive as Magnetic North/Requiem.

that glassy synth in "Magnetic North" is supreme. it ownz u.

I know that they have kicks, but Alucard's Mushroom Therapy from Dec '05 are so great to fall asleep to.

___________________
*can't imagine it feelin' much better...
i wish it would just last forever.
and so, to feel like that?
i'd pay any price just to get that back.*