great topic...i'll make my post short...a couple of yrs back i woulda defended my religion...said 'hey...there is a god...'...well not anymore...so many things in religion are all bout the 'mysteries' of things...man...seriously...after havin the most depressin 2 yrs of my life...i lost it...gave up on goin to church...i used to go every single week...but not anymore...its rare...hmmm...but i do believe in him...or her ...i guess its jus there for reassurence...

I do beleave in God (although I don't go to church). It is nice to beleave in something...

I see this thread got revived lol. *packs away defribulators*

I firmly believe that there is no god

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mner

Oh... and most religions end up in wars !

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mner

quote:

Originally posted by D_G I firmly believe that there is no god

and why do you believe that? come on, give us some meat to get this discussion -since it actually appears to be one- going again

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get font

I see your 4 Crushs and raise you 3 As The Rush Comes. - Yan from PvD's first summerstage event in '03

quote:

Originally posted by D_G Oh... and most religions end up in wars !

Congratulations. You win the most ignorant statement of the thread award. EVERYTHING ends up in wars. Religion is just a facet of man. MAN ends up in wars and so every facet of his being is brought into wars with him. Wars are fought over oil, gas, diamonds, drugs, and every other thing on this earth. And if you had a grave that you believed to be your fathers and you found a man defecating on it would you not be angry? This is a rhetorical question because I dont want any rebel teenagers saying " I hate my dad". So in response to that pointless little tidbit you decided to leave us...

I agree with Drizzt. Although we have opposing viewpoints we both have brought opinions and REASONS for the opinions to the table. Flat out statements just piss people off. The only reason for claiming something in that way is to say "I believe in something that you dont" back it up and give insight into your decision or you are just going to look like a contentious person whos only goal is to proclaim your difference.

ok...i'll get this argument started up again....

Who believes in Creation? like the good ol' Bible says...

Is the Bible just a book, or is it the word of God, and creation is true?

Remember, that means God planted the fossils of evolutionary links and made them look aged, and made aged light shine on the earth, and make an entire, huge universe in which the Earth is a speck upon a speck in size, and made the Universe start and end with the Earth's beginning and end, even though the Earth appears to be in a very small timeframe compared to the Universe.

All of this as a puzzle to trick nonbelievers. Who believes the Creation rubbish? If not, are you still a Christian? What parts of the Bible do you believe and what parts don't you believe? How do you know what's true and what's not....

FACE IT YOU DON'T KNOW. Don't assume you know there is a God or not, don't assume you know our Creation! Religion is hogwash.

ready to flame any ridiculous retaliations.

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The father made fetuses with flesh licking ladies / While you and your mother were asleep in the trailer park / Thunderous sparks from the dark of the stadiums / The music and medicine you needed for comforting / So make all your fat, fleshy fingers fingers to moving / And pluck all your silly strings and / Bend all your notes for me and / Soft silly music is meaningful, magical / The movements were beautiful / All in your ovaries / All of them milking with green fleshy flowers / While powerful pistons were sugary sweet machines, / Smelling of semen all under the garden / Was all you were needing when you still believed in me.

I was raised Catholic, but dont practice any religion anymore. I took Biology in school, and am convinced that Evolution is the correct theory. At the same time, in high School, I had the fortunate benefit of being taught by an excellent Theology teacher. He had a PHD in Theology, and really opened my mind up to religion as a whole (I went to a catholic HS, and this teacher helped me shape my own beleifs, which are somewhat different than what the Catholic religion preaches).

He also stated something which made complete sense to me. You dont have to choose either Creation, or Evolution. You can believe them both, depending on how strict, or liberally you want to interpret the bible. Im no expert on the scripture, so perhaps Orbax would be better to comment, but I know that in Genesis, it was said that it wasnt until a few days after God created the universe, that he created night and day. So before that happened, there was no way to determine what a day was. So the first few 'Days' of creation, could have lasted an indefinite amount of time. Also, saying 'Days' of creation could just be metaphor for the time it took for God to create the universe. Also, making 'Man' in the image of God, could be a metaphor for saying that God is life, and life comes from Nucleic Acids, Cells, proteins and enzymes.

Despite what I have said, I still believe Darwins theory, because to me, it makes absolute sense. I can visualise Evolution, and appreciate the beauty of natural selection, survival of the fittest, sexual selection, specialist vs generalist, environmental niches, phenotypic plasticity etc. etc... But just because I have strong beliefs in Evolution, doesnt mean that I believe Creation Theory is BS, because as I mentioned earlier, I still fits with my beliefs.

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I am enough of an artist to draw freely upon my imagination. Imagination is more important than knowledge. Knowledge is limited. Imagination encircles the world.
Albert Einstein

The smithsonian has over 45 million fossils and not a single one is a transitional fossil. Evolution has so many holes in it that its painful. This day of the year 2002 the question of how did we go from asexual to sexual reproduction, from single cell to multi-cell, and things how how when a fetus has about 100 IDENTICAL cells do some start turning into a brain and some into intestines. You can search all you want, but in my research I study atheistic and evolutionary stuff too if nothing other than to find answers to the sometimes difficult questions they pose. I also have talked to professors of the UW and read books by PHDs in the fields of evolutionary biology that were recently published and they aways say "...still dont have an answer" The main thing is this. Micro evolution is a fact. We have observed it and tested it, it works. Macro evolution breaks down when you get to the cellular level. Besides all of the animals that defy evolution (type in Creatures that defy evolution in a search and then go and try to find an answer on how they could have evolved) the cells in our bodies are so inexplicably complex that they defy evolution themselves. It is a thing called irreducible complexity. If you were missing just ONE part it would be useless and surely maladaptive and not get passed on. A mouse trap is an example of an irreducibly complex object. Our bodies are full of them. A PHD biologist says that people will ultimately judge neo-darwinism as "a minor twentieth-century religious sect within the sprawling religious persuasion of anglo-saxon biology". Also evolution has yet to answer the Cambrian explosion which is a mathematical impossibility. This is when insane amounts of animals just appeared out of the blue. Evolution has no answer because it is honestly just impossible in evolutionary terms. The only reason as I see it that people still believe in evolution is ignorance. They dont have a deep working knowledge of it. One book you should all read is "Darwins Black Box: The Biochemical Challenge to Evolution" Then try to tell me that you still believe. That one book isnt all though and dont think im trying ot limit you to that. But if you are trying to be a true knowledge seeker read the best of both sides and see which leaves the biggest gaps. It isnt even close. Ive done so much research on this it makes my head spin and I have never had anyone be able to answer these questions. And I doubt anyone ever will.


and yes part of the argument is that "day" just meant "a period of time" and new age/old age earth is a debate among christians, either way God is still possible.

I believe all of the Bible. It states that it is infalliable and any part false makes it all false.

and the Bible specifically says that God created the species distinct and different from eachother it leaves no evolutionary interpretation,

im going to go watch SCRUBS now.

By the way...im hearing a lot of gross generalization...

quote:

I still believe Darwins theory, because to me, it makes absolute sense. I can visualise Evolution, and appreciate the beauty of natural selection, survival of the fittest, sexual selection, specialist vs generalist, environmental niches, phenotypic plasticity etc. etc... But just because I have strong beliefs in Evolution...

This has no proof attached to it. So far it is just opinion. Now, if you are stating evolution as your religion, your faith in it is admirable because I can tell you that I will never have that level of faith in anything. But if you are putting into scientific terms we need a little more in the way of facts and stuff. So if you are putting it in faith thats cool I guess, but dont lay faith in scienctific "facts" and then not show any of them