also from the article It should be consumer choice; and if that's the way they vote, that's something we'll have to consider," said Penello. This would be in line with Microsoft's stated goal of letting consumers decide where their entertainment needs lie.

here is the article for those that havent read it...

quote:

Microsoft backpedals on Blu-ray for Xbox 360 comments ®[P] 23 comments By James Sherwood [More by this author] 10th January 2008 14:58 GMT Microsoft today stressed that it believes HD DVD is the best optical disc for consumers and that it has no plans to support Blu-ray Disc on the Xbox 360, despite recent comments from company staffers that it might. The company reaffirmed its love for HD DVD following a news story in which Microsoft suggested it might back Blu-ray if that's what its customers wanted. After Reuters asked Microsoft’s group marketing manager for Xbox hardware, Albert Penello, if Microsoft would support a Blu-ray Disc drive accessory in the event that HD DVD failed, he said: "It should be consumer choice, and if that's the way they vote, that's something we'll have to consider." However, Microsoft today said that HD DVD remains the only format to deliver quality experiences at affordable prices. It won't need to support Blu-ray, because HD DVD isn't going to fail, is it? Glad we got that one cleared up.

source

what if microsoft only says they support hddvd because thats how the system is configured at the moment? so they tell people that they think its the better format so they dont have to make any changes in the future? i agree that it is the cheaper format but that doesnt necessarily make it better. with blu-ray the capacity is a lot higher which leaves room for many more things. as for price, it will always drop.

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ugh, you bought into the biggest marketing hype bluray is using (their sole).

Bigger capacity means better quality movies.

completly false.

Since HDDVD capacity is more than enough to hold a 1080p hi def movie, even a tradionnal DVD is good enough to hold the same movie with proper codecs (mp4) at great quality.

You forget that bluray has regions codes while hddvd has no regions, a reason why greedy studios prefer bluray because they can screw their customers even more.

blu ray specs aren't even ready and no one knows if the promised 2.0 specs can be applied to older blu ray drives.

And why would Microsoft pay liscencing fees to Sony for each game disc they would use in their next gen video game. They would prefer to keep the HDDVD alive.

And HDDVD is the only format that can make possible the same disk to be played in both regular dvd drives and hddvd.

And the worst is that Sony has done so many wrong move toward their customers... root kits anyone?

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Blu-ray has 75 per cent of upcoming high-definition releases. 5 of the 7 big studios are backing blu ray. And the other two are getting presured to back blu ray as well. HD-DVD is not dead buy looks like it will be. Also another big sale for blu ray is some porn companies are making movies for it. Back in day porn being released on VHS(JVC) helped VHS beat BETA(Sony). This time it Sony Vs. JVC,Toshiba and others. Only bad thing with bluray is it has 3 different version of players out in the market, 1.0. 1.1 and 2.0(should be final) And at the moment none of the player allow firmware updates except the PS3. Also because 1.1 added picture in picture and 2.0 add internet older players do not have the require components.

Also if Microsoft decided to use Bluray they would only have to license the add on player. Because the XBox 360 systems its self would not use blu only the add on would which does not play games. So they would have to pay money to sony for each add on sold not game. Unless in the future they use bluray in their next system.


source
http://technology.timesonline.co.uk...penComment=true
http://crave.cnet.com/8301-1_105-9808376-1.html

Last edited by nigel2k on Jan-11-2008 at 03:12

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Originally posted by NuERA But Jay, why buy now? What if your BluRay ends up like Beta?

That won't happen. Beta and VHS were physically incompatible. That's not the case here.

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Disco and classical had sex while watching a sci-fi movie. Their child: trance.

I have a 1080p 52" LCD and I'm just waiting for some price drops + who will have a sure footing. It looks like Blu-Ray is going to finally come out on top though with the recent companies backing it now.

For now SEPTiC ftw.

11th time's the charm right Sony?

quote:

Originally posted by malek ugh, you bought into the biggest marketing hype bluray is using (their sole). Bigger capacity means better quality movies. completly false. Since HDDVD capacity is more than enough to hold a 1080p hi def movie, even a tradionnal DVD is good enough to hold the same movie with proper codecs (mp4) at great quality.

Yes, they both produce 1080p pictures using mp4's, but the max bit rate is much higher on BD. People thought 'Superbit' DVD's were useless, but nobody realised that even though the resolution and codec was the same, the encoded bit rates were much higher. Higher bit rates do make a difference for video, just as they do with audio. So, BD has the potential to artifact less than HD-DVD, which imo makes a diff when you are displaying at 1920x1080.

Our eventual move for movie playback will be full uncompressed AVI's. PCM video, just as we now finally have PCM audio.

quote:

And why would Microsoft pay liscencing fees to Sony for each game disc they would use in their next gen video game. They would prefer to keep the HDDVD alive. And HDDVD is the only format that can make possible the same disk to be played in both regular dvd drives and hddvd.

MS currently does not, and has stated that it has no plans on putting games on HD-DVD because that would completely alienate the majority of their customers, who have not bought the HD-DVD add on. This would be a HUGE PR nightmare.

quote:

And the worst is that Sony has done so many wrong move toward their customers... root kits anyone?

Bah, poisoning the well! Just because they tried to spy on customers, does not mean this is a less capable standard. I hate Sorny as a company more than anybody, but BD provides for higher quality picture playback.

chinamon,

So, when are you going to throw a hi-def documentary party?

I would love to watch more Planet earth in hi-def. The forest one was my fav, with the mushrooms growing out of the insect's heads.

quote:

Originally posted by nigel2k Also if Microsoft decided to use Bluray they would only have to license the add on player. Because the XBox 360 systems its self would not use blu only the add on would which does not play games. So they would have to pay money to sony for each add on sold not game. Unless in the future they use bluray in their next system.

I clearly said that for next gen consoles (not the current xbox 360 gen), a high capacity disk will be needed and I can't imagine Microsoft paying Sony for every game sold on a bluray. HDDVD will survive for a while even if its not as movie platform of choice by the greedy studios.

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quote:

Originally posted by Orko Yes, they both produce 1080p pictures using mp4's, but the max bit rate is much higher on BD. People thought 'Superbit' DVD's were useless, but nobody realised that even though the resolution and codec was the same, the encoded bit rates were much higher. Higher bit rates do make a difference for video, just as they do with audio. So, BD has the potential to artifact less than HD-DVD, which imo makes a diff when you are displaying at 1920x1080.

thats where you are again wrong, theoricaly its possible to have higer bitrates for blurays, reality is different since BOTH are using the same bitrates and codecs at this moment called VC-1. Check it out, you'll be surprised, both are identical... but the bluray will have more space left for gimmicks... that are yet to be implemented

edit: bitrates are variable for every movie, but never a bluray has used its full potential bitrate. And movies released on both formats use the same bitrate most of the time.

quote:

Originally posted by Orko Our eventual move for movie playback will be full uncompressed AVI's. PCM video, just as we now finally have PCM audio. MS currently does not, and has stated that it has no plans on putting games on HD-DVD because that would completely alienate the majority of their customers, who have not bought the HD-DVD add on. This would be a HUGE PR nightmare.

uncompressed AVI? Its so big that a bluray is not enough

The HD-DVD addon was not designed to play games, ever. Microsoft didn't include an HDDVD with their XBOX to keep cost down and release earlier than Sony which has paid off big time.

quote:

Originally posted by Orko Just because they tried to spy on customers,

geeez, lots of respect for you, but you stink of being a sony fanboy

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Last edited by malek on Jan-11-2008 at 05:49

quote:

Originally posted by malek thats where you are again wrong, theoricaly its possible to have higer bitrates for blurays, reality is different since BOTH are using the same bitrates and codecs at this moment called VC-1. Check it out, you'll be surprised, both are identical... but the bluray will have more space left for gimmicks... that are yet to be implemented uncompressed AVI? Its so big that a bluray is not enough The HD-DVD addon was not designed to play games, ever. Microsoft didn't include an HDDVD with their XBOX to keep cost down and release earlier than Sony which has paid off big time. geeez, lots of respect for you, but you stink of being a sony fanboy

Where are you getting your info from? I am just using the comparison chart from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compar...hnical_details. That clearly says that BD has a theoretical higher bit rate than HD-DVD. If the studios are choosing to encode at a lower bit rate, then that is their fault, but that does not change the fact that BD is a better standard for video quality.

According to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VC-1, VC-1 has the potential to play at both HD-DVD and BD's highest settings. I wonder what level of encoding the studios are actually using? I do not own any of the media, or players to test. That would be the deciding factor.

I know that blu-ray is not capable of handling full uncompressed AVI, bu I am saying that would the holy grail. That will be the end of codecs for home theaters. A long way off, but still the goal.

You will not find any sony products in my house, mainly Samsung, and Creative. I actually do not own a single sony product, and have not for approx 7 years. I hate sony as a company, and this goes back a long time now. I have years of posts on this forum alone of me bashing sony. In this thread, I am merely standing up for the 'better' standard.

I like to see quality win, even if it is being controlled by the tech world's Dr. Claw. I would love to see CD's survive for the quality, even though I know that would benefit sony most of all, because of their strangle hold on the distribution market.

The thing about this next gen hi-def war is that everybody is forgetting about the actual storage. I use DVDs to store stuff, and i would love to be able to use 50GB discs vs 30GB.

have a read here: http://www.projectorcentral.com/ret...DVD_Blu-ray.htm

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