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TranceAddict Forums > Other > Political Discussion / Debate > fREEDOM oF sPEECH 01/25/08
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Krypton
83.798 g/6.022x10^23



Registered: Nov 2003
Location: Texas

quote:
Originally posted by Trancer-X
Logic itself tells me that "9/11 Truther" is just another epithet or label that people have been using in order to discredit an otherwise positive and accountability seeking movement in order to not have to use their own rational thinking abilities to delve any further than our own governments' whitewash of an official report.

If I was going to allow myself to be labeled at all, I guess I'd be okay with "existence truther" because I yearn to fully understand the world as it is, not as it's been (and continues to be) falsely portrayed by an entire network of disinformation agents. We're not just being deceived on one level, anyway. We're being manipulated deeply and all-encompassingly and it's not just socially or economically but also psychologically, intellectually, physically, politically and even spiritually.


By definition, the name of the movement which subscribes the views you espouse about 911 being an inside job is called The 9/11 Truth Movement. You are a 911 truther. It's not a negative term. It is the generally accepted term. Sorry if that offends you but there has to be a label to people who belong to that specific movement. If I was to say "existance truther", no one would know what I meant.

quote:
Anyway, I've been actively searching for the truth for a few years now and it seems that the closer I get, the more resistance I encounter from people like yourself. It's funny how that works,isn't it?


The resistance you encounter is because people are not seeing the truth as you see it. Your standard of truth is not THE standard. Which is why we all come here to debate each one of our standards of truth. As you yourself know, there are truth standards which say the 911 conspiracy theories are bullocks, so I don't get why you get all in a uproar when people want to debate you over issue.

quote:
So how about you, how have grown to be so blindly trusting of a lying, deceiving, crony-capitalistic bureaucracy? That's something that I would like to know.


First of all I'm not. Niether do I trust conspiracy theories which rely on inductive reasoning. Sorry, but the only reasoning I trust when it comes to this issue is deductive reasoning. Just because I don't believe in the 99% of CTs does not mean I give the government the benefit of the doubt.

Old Post Feb-02-2008 23:31  Korea-Democratic Peoples Republic
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Trancer-X
mutatis mutandis



Registered: Jul 2001
Location: Shambhala

quote:
Originally posted by Krypton
By definition, the name of the movement which subscribes the views you espouse about 911 being an inside job is called The 9/11 Truth Movement. You are a 911 truther. It's not a negative term. It is the generally accepted term. Sorry if that offends you but there has to be a label to people who belong to that specific movement. If I was to say "existance truther", no one would know what I meant.



So what views are you claiming that I espouse? As far as I know, I've really only been outspoken in regards to wanting to know the truth and not just the truth that has been concealed from us about 9/11 but the truth of everything.

Do all truthseekers and reality investigators like myself get lumped into the 9/11 movement by default? I had never heard of that one before.

So yeah, before you throw me into some movement which I have never personally joined, I'd definitely like to know the reason why you think that I'm supposed to be joining them.


quote:

The resistance you encounter is because people are not seeing the truth as you see it. Your standard of truth is not THE standard. Which is why we all come here to debate each one of our standards of truth. As you yourself know, there are truth standards which say the 911 conspiracy theories are bullocks, so I don't get why you get all in a uproar when people want to debate you over issue.


First of all I'm not. Niether do I trust conspiracy theories which rely on inductive reasoning. Sorry, but the only reasoning I trust when it comes to this issue is deductive reasoning. Just because I don't believe in the 99% of CTs does not mean I give the government the benefit of the doubt.


I think that much of the resistance that I've encountered has been from people who have been so thoroughly brainwashed by our complicit mass media that they have no freaking clue about what's really been going on.

Quite a few of those people (many of the ones who initially acted veritably clueless, like yourself) have since taken a greater interest in those issues, have researched it more in depth and have come back to me, thanking me for waking them up. If you'd like some testimonials, I'm sure i could pull some off of my MySpace page if I needed to.

I understand that you somehow still have complete faith in the 9/11 Commission's finding but not everyone sees them as having the right answers. By not everyone, I mean that even it's commissioners said that it was a flawed inquiry which was set up to fail.

So how do you deduce that you even have a clue as to what's going on if all that you're really making your decision on is our government's "official" (flawed) report?


quote:
Solomon: You write.. the first chapter of the book is 'the Commission was set up to fail.' - my goodness, for the critics - who suggest that it was indeed set up to fail as some kind of obfuscation - you certainly dangled a juicy piece of bait out there in the river. Why do you think you were set up to fail?

Hamilton: Well, for a number of reasons: Tom Kean and I were substitutes - Henry Kissinger and George Mitchell were the first choices; we got started late; we had a very short time frame - indeed, we had to get it extended; we did not have enough money - 3 million dollars to conduct an extensive investigation. We needed more, we got more, but it took us a while to get it.

We had a lot of skeptics out there, who really did not want the Commission formed. Politicians don’t like somebody looking back to see if they made a mistake.

The Commission had to report right, just a few days before the Democratic National Convention met, in other words, right in the middle of a political campaign. We had a lot of people strongly opposed to what we did. We had a lot of trouble getting access to documents and to people. We knew the history of commissions; the history of commissions were they.. nobody paid much attention to 'em.

So there were all kinds of reasons we thought we were set up to fail. We decided that if we were going to have any success, we had to have a unanimous report, otherwise the Commission report would simply be filed.


http://www.cbc.ca/sunday/911hamilton.html


___________________
quote:
"Learn, child, to catch a hint through whatever agency it may be given. 'Sermons may be preached through stones."

- Helena Petrovna Blavatsky, Letters from the Masters of Wisdom, first series, p. 74, letter 31

Old Post Feb-03-2008 18:16  United States
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Krypton
83.798 g/6.022x10^23



Registered: Nov 2003
Location: Texas

quote:
Originally posted by Trancer-X
So what views are you claiming that I espouse? As far as I know, I've really only been outspoken in regards to wanting to know the truth and not just the truth that has been concealed from us about 9/11 but the truth of everything.

Do all truthseekers and reality investigators like myself get lumped into the 9/11 movement by default? I had never heard of that one before.

So yeah, before you throw me into some movement which I have never personally joined, I'd definitely like to know the reason why you think that I'm supposed to be joining them.


Someone who believes the government is complicit in 911 = Truth Movement - You may not be a card holding member, but you believe in their ideology. If I believed in Jesus, but never went to church, wouldn't you still call me a Christian?

I'm not going to call you an "existence truther"...:P


quote:
I think that much of the resistance that I've encountered has been from people who have been so thoroughly brainwashed by our complicit mass media that they have no freaking clue about what's really been going on.


Maybe so, but calling them brainwashed in a debate will not win you any converts. It'll just piss people off. If your argument is that spot-on, then it should stand up for itself.

quote:
I understand that you somehow still have complete faith in the 9/11 Commission's finding but not everyone sees them as having the right answers. By not everyone, I mean that even it's commissioners said that it was a flawed inquiry which was set up to fail.

So how do you deduce that you even have a clue as to what's going on if all that you're really making your decision on is our government's "official" (flawed) report?


I'de like to see an independent commission to investigate everything about 911 so this Truth Movement can be over with. Then again, I'm worried that anything which contradicts the Movement will never be accepted, no matter what.

Old Post Feb-03-2008 20:47  Korea-Democratic Peoples Republic
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