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Originally posted by Capitalizt Ah, but you foreigners don't understand how the term liberalism is used in America. Us stupid Americans have almost completely reversed the dicionary definition and the so called "liberals" over here stand for many things that are contrary to classical liberalism. Liberalism in America = Socialism-lite. Most of the "liberals" in America today stand for centralized power. They love social engineering programs and they support higher taxation/regulation in general along with a massive welfare state...basically the opposite of classical liberalism, which stands for limiting the power of government and maximizing individual freedom.

I don’t give a shit that america has bastardised an entire school of thought with their ignorance. They use the word incorrectly and i shall keep pointing it out to them

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Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN I don’t give a shit that america has bastardised an entire school of thought with their ignorance. They use the word incorrectly and i shall keep pointing it out to them

Relax, I was fucking with you.

quote:

Originally posted by Capitalizt Ah, but you foreigners don't understand how the term liberalism is used in America. Us stupid Americans have almost completely reversed the dicionary definition and the so called "liberals" over here stand for many things that are contrary to classical liberalism. Liberalism in America = Socialism-lite. Most of the "liberals" in America today stand for centralized power. They love social engineering programs and they support higher taxation/regulation in general along with a massive welfare state. They follow the dicitonary definition when it comes to protecting civil liberties, but are on the far opposite end of the spectrum when it comes to economic liberty. Traditional liberalism stressed economic freedom and individual liberty, while modern liberalism in America stresses equality (of outcome). Modern liberals are willing to sacrifice economic liberty in the name of "progress", "fairness", or the "greater good".

It really pisses me off to be a classic liberal.

I registered as a Republican in 1998 when I became eligible. I liked McCain before he sold his soul for the nomination - and hated Bush on sight. I ended up going Nader because NY was locked and I just wanted to add numbers to a 3rd party since the other were failing.

I wholeheartedly think McCain will do anything to win. His loss in 2000 cemented his resolve and he's got less to lose now since he's closer to death. His passion for the office is doing horrors to his "Maverick" label.

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"Go back to bed america your government is in control
Here's American Gladiators, here is 56 channels of it,
Watch these picturary retards bang their fuckin' skulls together and congratulate you on living in the land of freedom,
Here you go America you are free to do as we tell you
We want your soul
Your cash, your house, your phone, your cash, your house, your life" -Adam Freeland - We Want Your Soul

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Originally posted by Shakka Relax, I was fucking with you.

oh yeah, my tirade certainly wasn't directed towards you!

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Originally posted by Clovis Rush Limbaugh is a hypocrite, an asshole, and one of the most extreme sources of propaganda this country has ever seen. That is fact, and if you once again don't want to acknowledge that, fine. But the overwhelming majority of educated and intellectual people in this country understand who Rush Limbaugh is and the agenda he pushes.

Haha.. the only fact in that statement is that it's you're opinion. Most extreme sources of propoganda in this country's history? LOL! If the agenda of pushing back against policy that creates a nanny state is wrong, I don't wanna be right! What exactly do you know about the overwhelming majority of educated and intellecual people in this country anyway? Have you sat down with them and picked their brains? Or are you just parroting what you hear on MSNBC?

quote:

Originally posted by Capitalizt Ah, but you foreigners don't understand how the term liberalism is used in America.

Exactly. When i speak against "liberalism" I'm doing so in regards to a different way than foreigners understand the term.

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Originally posted by The17sss Exactly. When i speak against "liberalism" I'm doing so in regards to a different way than foreigners understand the term.

in other words you are using it incorrectly, especially considering it was these "foreigners" that fucking created the word ffs.

there's no such thing as liberalism as a school of thought in the way that you use it. so cut it the fuck out.

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Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN in other words you are using it incorrectly, especially considering it was these "foreigners" that fucking created the word ffs. there's no such thing as liberalism as a school of thought in the way that you use it. so cut it the fuck out.

I understand what you are saying but no, I'm using it correctly in the context of how the term applies to politics here in the U.S.

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Originally posted by The17sss Haha.. the only fact in that statement is that it's you're opinion. Most extreme sources of propoganda in this country's history? LOL! If the agenda of pushing back against policy that creates a nanny state is wrong, I don't wanna be right! What exactly do you know about the overwhelming majority of educated and intellecual people in this country anyway? Have you sat down with them and picked their brains? Or are you just parroting what you hear on MSNBC?

I know for a fact that the overwhelming majority of intellectuals in this country know exactly who Rush Limbaugh is and the agenda he pushes.

I don't watch MSNBC or Olbermann.

I've already pointed out why Rush is basically a walking hate crime and theres no need for me to say anything further. The educated folks understand who he is, and thats really all there is to say on the matter. The fact that you think so highly of him speaks volumes.

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Originally posted by ******** Seplling don't demonstrate intelligence and educatoin - knowing does.

Liberalism for me means advocating changes in policy which are progressive for society. When dealing with a problem such as racial or class inequality, don't automatically assume all liberals want a Chavez-like socialist government. Saying so just outlines your biased view of liberals. Liberals are overwhelmingly not communists or radical socialists. I don't call Rush Limbaugh a damned fascist do I? How I, as a liberal would deal with inequality is simply by providing an equal opportunity for all to prosper. We have laws against racial discrimination, we have laws protecting unions, etc. etc. It was liberals who lead the civil rights movement against racist conservatives in the south.

Socialism has been turned into a dirty word by the Republicans. All things socialist are not bad. Public schools, social security, state universities can all be called socialist, but that does not mean they are bad!

Cap made the point that liberals tend to be against free market economics. To be honest, I think the vast majority of liberals very much believe in free market economics, but with limits! History has shown time and again that a free market left unchecked will destroy itself. I very much believe in the virtues of a free market, but I also believe in a free market which has regulatory oversight. We live in a free republic, but we still have traffic laws and laws protecting society as a whole against criminals. The same principle should apply to the free market.

It was liberals who founded this country, liberals who brought us out of the Great Depression, liberals who took the fight to fascist Europe, liberals who lead the Civil Right Movement, and it will be liberals who get us out this god-awful mess that is Iraq, and financial crisis.

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Originally posted by The17sss What exactly do you know about the overwhelming majority of educated and intellecual people in this country anyway?

He knows that the majority of these people vote Democrat. Why do you think that Obama's Harvard/Columbia background is a negative? Do you think that the most educated in this country don't know what arugula is? I hate salads, but I know what it is. I guess that makes me a NYC elitist, who came from western PA, born to a homemaker mom and a construction worker dad.

___________________
"Go back to bed america your government is in control
Here's American Gladiators, here is 56 channels of it,
Watch these picturary retards bang their fuckin' skulls together and congratulate you on living in the land of freedom,
Here you go America you are free to do as we tell you
We want your soul
Your cash, your house, your phone, your cash, your house, your life" -Adam Freeland - We Want Your Soul

quote:

Originally posted by Clovis I know for a fact that the overwhelming majority of intellectuals in this country know exactly who Rush Limbaugh is and the agenda he pushes. I don't watch MSNBC or Olbermann. I've already pointed out why Rush is basically a walking hate crime and theres no need for me to say anything further. The educated folks understand who he is, and thats really all there is to say on the matter. The fact that you think so highly of him speaks volumes.

Come on Clovis... it's not all uneducated hicks that give Rush his popularity. You're insinuating that if you're a true intellectual, then you will supposedly see through Rush's nonsense. I could say the same thing about you: the fact that you listen to the other side and believe what you do speaks volumes about who you are. You're responses are always so negative and pessimistic about this country, and I think it's because you've allowed yourself to be conditioned to the main stream media's doom and gloom bullshit. I don't mean to sound like a conspiracy theory, but their reporting is slanted that way and they want us to feel that way because what's bad for America is good for the Democrats right now. It's like when that 7 year old girl asked Obama why he's running for president and he said because America is no longer what it once was and he doesn't want that future for his children. And you think this way too.

Don't you see the hypocracy? He wouldn't want that life for his kids? LOL. Before Obama decided to run for president his wife was pulling down 300 grand working in PR at a hospital. He had written two books that got him out of debt. What is wrong with his life? What is wrong with the opportunities in this country that had been made available to him, and that are available to you, that you wouldn't want for that girl that asked the question? What's so bad about his life that he wouldn't want his kids living it? He's running for president of the United States, and he's got to run down the country to a 7 year old. That's just how you negative leftists think and it's sad. He should have said because he loves the country and that it's the greatest place on earth.... that we've got challenges, but he wants to help the country through it, end of story.