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Yohan
Champion of Deep&Nu-disco



Registered: Jan 2004
Location: Kitchener, Ont, Soviet Canuckistan

Will be voting conservative because frankly, Dion is a retard, Layton is still crazy and May just plain scares me.

I think Harper did OK considering a minority govt, but Dion is really screwing Libs over.

I don't think status quo will change after this election, unless something really changes in next few weeks. (With end result with Con-servatives in power for another 3 yrs because Libs won't be able to call another election so soon afterwards)


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quote:
Originally posted by chinamon
not true. i say "ugh"
but i am a tranny.
quote:
Originally posted by kotsy
lol colour me retarded

Old Post Sep-13-2008 21:53  Canada
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Yohan
Champion of Deep&Nu-disco



Registered: Jan 2004
Location: Kitchener, Ont, Soviet Canuckistan

Well, isn't this interesting

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/serv...y/politics/home

quote:
Tories in the lead

A Harris/Decima poll of 1,393 Canadians taken Thursday to Saturday found the Tories have a lead over the Liberals sufficient for a majority government. Here's how the four national parties rated:

Conservatives 40%

Liberals 26%

NDP 15%

Greens 9%


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quote:
Originally posted by chinamon
not true. i say "ugh"
but i am a tranny.
quote:
Originally posted by kotsy
lol colour me retarded

Old Post Sep-15-2008 15:42  Canada
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Wurm
In the moment.



Registered: Dec 2001
Location: Magic, if only for a while...
Worm Popper

Gotta love first past the post!

Old Post Sep-15-2008 16:09 
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Skipper
Supreme tranceaddict



Registered: May 2002
Location:

Every Monday from now til Election day, the globe is running a special report on one issue and clarifying where each party stands on it. Today was the economy - quite timely considering what is going on south of the border today.

quote:

Where they stand
Issues tend to get lost in campaign rhetoric. But each party does have a position on most issues. Each Monday through the election, The Globe will explore a single issue and examine each party's stand. Today, the competing economic visions of the five major parties
HEATHER SCOFFIELD

From Monday's Globe and Mail

September 15, 2008 at 4:18 AM EDT

When Conservative Leader Stephen Harper vowed, in the early days of the campaign, that he would cut the federal diesel fuel tax in half, the Liberals saw it as a gift.

Posing in front of the celery and carrots at a fresh-produce store in Winnipeg, Mr. Harper told a crowd of partisans that the tax cut highlights the Tory approach to economic management.

The federal election, he said, "is a choice between two very different plans. We want to reduce the tax on diesel a bit. Others plan to increase the tax on diesel significantly. In fact, they plan to increase the price of everything."

The Liberals disagree vehemently with that interpretation, of course, but they do agree with part of Mr. Harper's message: The choice between the Tory and Liberal approaches to fiscal and economic policy is stark.

Just as Mr. Harper was announcing the diesel fuel measure, Liberal MP and economist John McCallum was in the midst of an interview. He could hardly restrain a chortle. The tax cut, he said, is Tory policy at its worst - a targeted measure, aimed wrongly at consumption, that will only exacerbate pollution.

"I think that sums up Stephen Harper pretty well," Mr. McCallum said. "There's not an economist in the country who would support it. It's like reducing the GST and not caring about environmental policy at the same time."

Tory cuts to the goods and services tax aside, in recent election campaigns the two parties have differed in the economic bells and whistles, but their general approaches to fiscal policy have been similar. Governments of the past decade have enjoyed healthy surpluses, and could promise new spending, tax cuts and improved transfers to the provinces without worrying much about where the money would come from.

Now, the global economy is on the brink of recession, Canada's economy has stalled and the surplus is slim. Some economists believe a further slide in the price of oil will push Ottawa into deficit for the first time since 1997. Politicians can no longer promise the world - especially if, like both the Tories and the Liberals, they also promise to stay out of the red.

As the economy zooms to the top of the list of public concerns, voters can pick, for the first time in over a decade, between two contrasting visions of how the government should interact with the economy. Well aware of the contrast, the parties intend to make as much political hay as they can.

The sub-headline on the press release accompanying Mr. Harper's diesel tax announcement is a case in point. "Modest, affordable, practical plan for lower taxes vs. grandiose, costly, risky plan for higher tax on everything," it reads.

Or, from the Liberals on the same day: "Hard-working Canadians are losing their jobs and what does this government do? Insult them and abandon them with laissez-faire, I-don't-care policies," Leader Stéphane Dion said.

"A Liberal government will invest in partnership with Canadians by cutting taxes for families, investing in the manufacturing sector and building strong jobs."

At the heart of the Conservatives' economic thrust is tax reduction. The Tories are campaigning on the GST cut already implemented, as well as their more recent cuts to income and corporate taxes. By kicking off their campaign with the diesel tax announcement, they're suggesting that the plethora of small but targeted tax cuts that worked well for them in the last election will likely figure prominently again.

Tax cuts, they say, have protected the Canadian economy from the U.S. downturn. Some troubled sectors may require direct measures on a short-term basis, but the preference is for permanent tax cuts, explained Jim Flaherty, the Finance Minister and MP running for re-election in Whitby, Ont.

"If we talk about fiscal and tax policy, we approach things in a fundamental, permanent way," he said in an interview. One-time subsidies "thrown at" troubled parts of the economy are often a waste of money, he argued.

"I'm not interested in that sort of ad hoc activity," he said, adding that the millions handed to the auto sector in the days before the election call came from a previously announced fund to spur innovation and does not constitute a subsidy.

The Conservatives want controlled spending and a minimalist fiscal framework that will lead to a stronger economy, Mr. Flaherty said, while the Liberals are eyeing higher taxes, higher spending, intrusive government and irresponsible economic management.

Needless to say, the Liberals don't see things that way - but they're equally anxious to win political points by exploiting their differences.

At the centre of the Liberals' fiscal proposals is a $15-billion shuffle of taxes and spending in the hopes of tackling global warming, cutting income tax and alleviating poverty at the same time.

Their Green Shift proposal would thrust the federal government's fiscal power into the centre of business operations, by imposing a carbon tax on greenhouse-gas emitters. The plan fully expects corporations to pass along the costs of the tax to consumers. And to help consumers and companies cover the cost, the Liberals would use their carbon-tax revenue to cut personal and corporate income tax.

The plan would likely be the biggest tax reform seen in decades in Canada, economists say.

In the short term, the Liberals also see an activist role for themselves in alleviating the pain of the slowdown - dramatically speeding up infrastructure spending so that building projects will put people back to work just when they most need jobs. They'd also inject more money into the manufacturing sector. Mr. McCallum describes his party's approach as "fiscally prudent but active."

Both parties promise to balance the books, encourage innovation and clean technology. But both also have a history of spending a lot - especially right before an election - and accomplishing little in giving Canada an edge, said Jayson Myers, an economist and head of Canadian Manufacturers and Exporters.

"What are we doing," he asked, "to actually create wealth in this country rather than just redistribute it?"

***

THE LIBERAL PARTY

THE ECONOMY TAX ON, TAX OFF

ON GOVERNMENT'S ROLE: "Fiscally prudent but active," according to finance critic John McCallum. Ottawa needs to recharge social programs and reform the tax system to help the poor, fight greenhouse gases, reward good behaviour and punish bad behaviour.

ON THE SLOWDOWN: Government money should be made available for manufacturing; infrastructure funding should be dramatically sped up to flow quickly to cities and create jobs.

NATIONAL CHAMPIONS: Liberals want to rekindle Canada's relationship with China, lead high-profile trade missions and promote key Canadian businesses abroad. Liberals would likely bring in a national security review of foreign takeovers.

ON REGIONAL DEVELOPMENT: They have been sympathetic to creating regional funds in the past, and hint they will have new campaign initiatives to announce about employment insurance and regional employment incentives.

ON DEFICIT FINANCING: "Liberals have it in their DNA not to go into deficit," Mr. McCallum says. Liberals would reinstate the $3-billion contingency fund to keep government out of deficit, and if they were to inherit a deficit from the Tories, would immediately cut spending to make ends meet.

ON TAXATION: The so-called Green Shift slaps a carbon tax on industrial emitters, rising gradually over four years. The tax is being marketed as revenue neutral, however, because the Liberals would also cut corporate taxes and personal income taxes, with an emphasis on low-income groups.

ON SPENDING: Poverty reduction, families and seniors would receive more income supplements, funded by new revenue flowing through carbon taxes. The Liberals' record shows the party eliminated the $42-billion deficit in the late 1990s, but allowed spending to gradually creep up as a share of GDP.

ON EMISSIONS CONTROL: The carbon tax is meant to deter emissions and steer industry into green technology. The Liberals say they would also move towards a cap-and-trade system over the long run.

Winners and losers

Who benefits: Lower-income Canadians, through cuts to income tax and enhanced income supplements.

Who pays: The 700 large polluters who would pay the carbon tax.

***

THE CONSERVATIVE PARTY

THE ECONOMY FREE-MARKET FAITH

ON GOVERNMENT'S ROLE: "We approach things in a fundamental, permanent way," says Jim Flaherty, the Finance Minister. A federal government should do what it can to not impede business: cut red tape, cut taxes, offer incentives for innovation.

ON THE SLOWDOWN: Stimulus took place last fall with a series of tax cuts that meant tax refunds to Canadians this spring were on average $200 higher than the year before, up 14 per cent.

NATIONAL CHAMPIONS: Governments should not pick winners, but create the conditions for winners to emerge on their own. Conservatives would encourage more foreign investment in Canada by removing some restrictions in the uranium and airline sectors, and raising the threshold for review of foreign takeovers. But they would also bring in a national-security review of potential takeovers.

ON REGIONAL DEVELOPMENT: Tories have a general distaste for making allowances for struggling regions, but introduced a $1-billion "community trust fund" to help hard-hit areas try to move on.

ON DEFICIT FINANCING: "I can say without hesitation that we will run a surplus this year," Mr. Flaherty says. Even if the economy turns from bad to worse in 2009, when the budgeted surplus is expected to be slimmer, he says a Conservative government would make up the difference, if necessary, by speeding up its expenditure review process.

ON TAXATION: Lower business taxes help give Canada a global edge; all taxes should drop relentlessly; cuts should be small and targeted, with specific policy aims.

ON SPENDING: Mr. Flaherty argues it should be tightly controlled, though his own budgets have contained spending increases at least as large as those in many Liberal budgets. Spending is budgeted to be above 13 per cent of GDP, a higher ratio than in most years of Liberal government. The Canadian Taxpayers Federation estimates the Tories' pre-election spending promises total $19.2-billion, announced between June 2 and Sept. 6.

ON EMISSIONS CONTROL: Conservatives want it accomplished mainly through regulation, not tax policy. But any attempt to control emissions puts government in the middle of the energy industry, despite Tory ideology that dictates minimalist intervention.

Winners and losers

WHO BENEFITS: The middle class, because of cuts to consumption taxes and income taxes.

WHO PAYS: People who have lost their jobs at factories that have closed, because funding is for struggling firms that remain open.

***

THE OTHER PARTIES

A MIX OF MESSAGES

BLOC QUÉBÉCOIS: It wants financial support, loan guarantees and better tax treatment for the manufacturing sector; wants a law to force government to buy Canadian; wants better income support for seniors; hopes for enriched transfers to Quebec and more provincial freedom to spend the money.

NEW DEMOCRATIC PARTY: The NDP would halt corporate tax cuts and instead create a $2-billion-a-year fund to offer subsidies and create 40,000 factory jobs; the fund would offer subsidies to encourage companies to innovate, produce low-emission cars and train unemployed workers for green jobs. The NDP wants a made-in-Canada procurement policy and trade policies that protect manufacturing.

GREEN PARTY: It would overhaul taxation so that polluters paid a carbon tax; would use the proceeds to cut payroll taxes, allow income splitting and boost transfers to seniors and low-income people.

Old Post Sep-15-2008 16:16  Canada
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Yohan
Champion of Deep&Nu-disco



Registered: Jan 2004
Location: Kitchener, Ont, Soviet Canuckistan

I'm still amused at what seems to be 3 parties (Fiberals, New Dummycrats and Groan) running on essentially enviro platform and the Con-servatives remaining the visible alternative to all.


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quote:
Originally posted by chinamon
not true. i say "ugh"
but i am a tranny.
quote:
Originally posted by kotsy
lol colour me retarded

Old Post Sep-15-2008 17:16  Canada
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Orko
Digital Hippie



Registered: Nov 2002
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada

quote:
Tories to open parental benefits to self-employed
OTTAWA — Stephen Harper has announced a spending promise worth $147-million that would allow self-employed Canadians the opportunity to access maternity and parental benefits enjoyed by other wage earners who pay into the EI system.
...
“Ironically, self-employed Canadians who are successful and who create jobs must pay into the EI system on behalf on their employees, but cannot access those benefits themselves,” Mr. Harper said. “This is not right.”

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/serv...lxnharperEI0915


Pretty interesting. Just as you said Yohan, an actual policy announcement, that goes away from the environment. How do people figure the rest of the economy/government is run after the enviro is all taken care of?

Yup, going after the female vote. Not a bad idea, as even here on TA, some women were lamenting the lack of financial support during a pregnancy.

Old Post Sep-15-2008 17:23  India
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Skipper
Supreme tranceaddict



Registered: May 2002
Location:

quote:
Originally posted by Orko

Yup, going after the female vote. Not a bad idea, as even here on TA, some women were lamenting the lack of financial support during a pregnancy.


Yes we were, but I think we all have jobs and already have access to EI.
Personally I'd prefer to see the upper end of the salary range increased instead of given to people who have removed themselves from the workforce voluntarily.

I am confused by the Liberal Carbon scheme. Will they not end up implementing a tax on the manufacturing sector, the same sector that they also promise to help out financially? I agree the world is moving towards greener business and we all have to get on board eventually, but with the economy the way it is now, I think it's the wrong strategy to be basing a big part of your platform on increased corporate taxes.

Old Post Sep-16-2008 00:38  Canada
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Moral Hazard
Oppressing the 99%



Registered: Mar 2005
Location: with the 1%

quote:
Originally posted by Skipper
Personally I'd prefer to see the upper end of the salary range increased instead of given to people who have removed themselves from the workforce voluntarily.


Self-employed is hardly the same as being out of the workforce. That said, I don't believe it's acceptable for people who have not paid into the system to collect from it... this is an insurance plan; if you don't pay your premiums you don't have coverage. Note: this is the position of man with a self-employed wife and an eight week old (Mrs. Hazard is back to work).


___________________
quote:
Originally posted by RickyM
you're just a shit version of Moral Hazard. At least he knows what he's talking about.

quote:
Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
lol, i love it when moral feels the need to lay the smack down

Old Post Sep-16-2008 11:51  Canada
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ChemEnhanced
ƒ¶ƒåƒÓƒÛƒnƒéƒßƒåƒnƒÚƒÕƒÞƒ



Registered: Mar 2005
Location: Milton, ON Canada

quote:
Originally posted by Moral Hazard
Note: this is the position of man with a self-employed wife and an eight week old (Mrs. Hazard is back to work).


You are such a slave driver....does Mrs. Hazard at least get bread and water?


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quote:
Scott has been introduced to the rave scene, and Ecstasy, by Craig. The two of them go out on the weekends, with some of Craigs friends, and stay up all night, dancing in a drug-fueled trance.


Last edited by Moral Hazard on Apr-26-2011 at 07:48

Old Post Sep-16-2008 12:41  Canada
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Moral Hazard
Oppressing the 99%



Registered: Mar 2005
Location: with the 1%

My post, copied from the PDD...

Honestly, I believe a Conservative majority is the worst possible outcome for the Conservative party. Remember; this is a party built on grassroots, hard right/fundimentalist ideology. This base is what allowed the former Reform party to maintain the level of support it did. Since rebranding as the Conservatives, Harper has led the party more and more toward the centre, turning it into a brokerage centre party rather then a grassroots far right party. This has won him new support east of Manitoba; however, it has alienated many in their base. The only thing that has really kept the base tolerant of this new softer conservatism is the belief (and I have no idea if the party is encouraging this belief or not) that this move to the centre is just being done to win them enough seats to form a majority afterwhich they will govern based on their Reform roots rather then their new outward image. So Harper's in a rough place... if he gets a majority then he'll have to choose... govern from the soft right and he'll alienate his base, which is likely to result in a resurgance of Reform or a new party akin to it; or, he can govern from the hard right, which will apiese his base but send his new converts from east of the Lake of Bays running like hell back to the Liberals... worse yet, it will kill the Conservative Party because all those who feared Reform will have their fears vindicated and will likely never return to support the Conservatives.


___________________
quote:
Originally posted by RickyM
you're just a shit version of Moral Hazard. At least he knows what he's talking about.

quote:
Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
lol, i love it when moral feels the need to lay the smack down

Old Post Sep-16-2008 12:53  Canada
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Moral Hazard
Oppressing the 99%



Registered: Mar 2005
Location: with the 1%

quote:
Originally posted by ChemEnhanced
You are such a slave driver....does Mrs. Hazard at least get bread and water?


It's the nature of her business... you spend years building a client base but if you're unavailable for an extended time they all find new therapists.


___________________
quote:
Originally posted by RickyM
you're just a shit version of Moral Hazard. At least he knows what he's talking about.

quote:
Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
lol, i love it when moral feels the need to lay the smack down

Old Post Sep-16-2008 12:54  Canada
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Orko
Digital Hippie



Registered: Nov 2002
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada

quote:
Originally posted by Moral Hazard
Self-employed is hardly the same as being out of the workforce. That said, I don't believe it's acceptable for people who have not paid into the system to collect from it... this is an insurance plan; if you don't pay your premiums you don't have coverage.


Agreed, it is basically an insurance plan. The question is, are there private insurance plans which cover pregnancy? If not, this is a great option for the self-employed. And it is pretty fair, pay and get a benefit.

Old Post Sep-16-2008 15:17  India
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