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Originally posted by SYSTEM-J This is also complete nonsense. There are plenty of threads about tracks from many genres that don't get trolled like that. You just never click on them. And this is the thing - it's always the same group of people who listen to the same type of music who make these complaint threads. Plenty of people (including you) have endlessly trolled about genres they don't like, such as minimal or tech house, but nobody makes these pathetic complaints threads about it. Man the fuck up, son.

Just what I was gonna say. I would say that tech house and mininal house music gets bashed equally as much as trance these days. If not more. But the cry babies are always the trance heads.

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Originally posted by LAdazeNYnights Do you really believe that music discussion shouldn't be a place where people can learn "a thing or two" by engaging in some sort of discussion about music ?

there can be no discussion as long as these simpletons keep spouting their "it's all subjective, maaan" nonsense (as clubamerica demonstrated just a few posts up). the subjective status of music is a red herring. it is used by people who don't know how to argue, to veil their ignorance.

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Originally posted by distant tl;dr: fuck off.

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Originally posted by distant there can be no discussion as long as these simpletons keep spouting their "it's all subjective, maaan" nonsense (as clubamerica demonstrated just a few posts up). the subjective status of music is a red herring. it is used by people who don't know how to argue, to veil their ignorance.

You're wrong there. Musical taste is very subjective.

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Originally posted by distant whoooosh

My bad, you're actually correct.

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like I said, it's completely uninteresting whether it's subjective or not. those comments move us away from discussing actual music (which is unfortunate since that's all Mr. LAdazeNYnights and others want to do), they're defensive in nature and are chiefly aimed at people who objectively know more.

if you want to learn, don't alienate the teacher.

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Originally posted by distant like I said, it's completely uninteresting whether it's subjective or not. those comments move us away from discussing actual music (which is unfortunate since that's all Mr. LAdazeNYnights and others want to do), they're defensive in nature and are chiefly aimed at people who objectively know more. if you want to learn, don't alienate the teacher.

the teacher?
i just don't see how anything i've said is all that unreasonable.
who am i alienating and how?

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Originally posted by Trance-MB But that doesn't happen most of the times. Also just few people tell what they do like about a track, even if they in general don't like it for other reasons. People who don't like e.g. uplifting at all, post that other uplifting tracks suck, but don't mention they don't like uplifting in general. To me it does make a difference: That track sucks. vs. That track sucks, because I don't like any uplifting. vs. That track sucks, even for an uplifting track which I don't like in general. Some people do give their opinion and even can put their personal taste aside.

But if you're a regular here surely you figure out over time where each person's musical taste is at? Do we need to justify every goddamn post by describing our tastes? So in practice what you want us to do is to be all touchy in our answers so you don't get butt-hurt.

The reality is that us folks that have moved from trance to other camps a long time ago don't have much patience or empathy for much trance anymore, it is so far apart in everything. When I meet here someone who likes modern Armin tunes, I simply don't have much respect for that musical taste because I don't consider it credible, it comes off as someone who is yet to discover better stuff or has stagnated at a point of our musical evolution that we passed ages ago. And why should we fake respect just for courtesy?

What you lot fail to understand is that lack of respect for your musical taste doesn't mean lack of respect for yourself - albeit forum nonsense would perhaps lead you to think so. Forum arguments grow, grow and grow, and sometimes people go out of their way to prove their discussion points by attacking others in the heat of debate. The difference is that those who've been here for ages know it works like this, whereas the newbies act all offended and go open threads like this. We're not super serious and don't really want you all to literally die in a massive ball of fire.

There is of course a problem with people going out of their way to attack others in threads they have no need to discuss - but doesn't everyone do this once in a while, some more than others? I've seen tranceheads trolling people in deep/tech house release threads and we didn't act all butt-hurt about it.

And I promise this is the last fucking huge wall of text that I'm writing in any thread like this, goddamnit.

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Originally posted by noikeee What you lot fail to understand is that lack of respect for your musical taste doesn't mean lack of respect for yourself

and conversely, it doesn't mean I or anyone thinks they are a "better person" than anybody else. new people are so quick to come up with explanations laden with connotation for why forum veterans behave the way they do. we simply know more than you do. get over it. if you can do that, maybe you can learn a thing or two.

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Originally posted by distant it is used by people who don't know how to argue, to veil their ignorance.

Saying "This track is an abomination to music" isn't really an argument either. I'm sure people in here who haven't been listening to trance for as long as others haven't been exposed to what you think is "good music." You talk about people "learning a thing or two," but if someone likes a track, and get torched, what exactly are they learning? Yeah, the "this track is horrible, try this" would be ideal, but I think what some of the people in this thread have said, i.e. "the elitist mentality" does hold some weight here.

People are quick to judge (usually harshly) others tastes in music, but I'm sure all of them were in the same boat previously. There must have been loads of people mocking their tastes in music when they first got into "the scene." I think the point people are missing is that it's not people being sensitive or "butt-hurt" by people's flames, but rather the frustration of the lack of actual discussion. If you don't like a song, say so, but don't attack a PERSON for liking it. Music makes different people feel different ways, and that's the beauty of it. Who are you to judge the listener for enjoying a track, simply because you do not?

Essentially it all boils down to the forum title. It's Music Discussion, not open musical taste court. People aren't posting a song they like in order to be judged by a jury of their peers as much as they're posting something to TRY and "learn a thing or two." If you think you have better taste in music, or the artists/songs you listen to are of better quality, maybe you should suggest some of it to them.

I just think the Music Discussion forum should be more about people discussing the music they like in a more constructive way. Be as brutal as you want in your opinion of the song, but leave the OP out of it. If you really get more pleasure out of bashing someone, than you would about helping to broaden their taste, that's really sad.

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Originally posted by noikeee But if you're a regular here surely you figure out over time where each person's musical taste is at? Do we need to justify every goddamn post by describing our tastes? So in practice what you want us to do is to be all touchy in our answers so you don't get butt-hurt. The reality is that us folks that have moved from trance to other camps a long time ago don't have much patience or empathy for much trance anymore, it is so far apart in everything. When I meet here someone who likes modern Armin tunes, I simply don't have much respect for that musical taste because I don't consider it credible, it comes off as someone who is yet to discover better stuff or has stagnated at a point of our musical evolution that we passed ages ago. And why should we fake respect just for courtesy? And I promise this is the last fucking huge wall of text that I'm writing in any thread like this, goddamnit.

Yeah I would like YOU folks that think you are more than a newbie to add a few words with every post you do and just show some decency and not implying to present a fact.

I always thought that US older ones should try to be a good example to younger ones. I must be really old for thinking this....

What a total lame excuse. Who told you to be the one who knows what actually is better music?
To me it sound like you really earned the title to be an Elite.

Someone mentioned high horses?

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