My guess is it's the multi-band compressor at the end.

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Put an end to the loudness war. Don't limit or compress your mixdown until mastering; leave the master channel alone.

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quote:

Originally posted by Atlantis-AR My guess is it's the multi-band compressor at the end.

Except...there's nothing on the master channel...in the example track now =|. (so probably the native compressors or maximus mucking things up, as Track2 was mixed in FL)

If you'd like an example of recent mixes, have a listen to yob or trundle on moi soundcloud...I've mixed both tracks the way I've described. For now...I guess I'll be busy for the next week on track2 trying to figure out what the hell happened.

Again, I'm still adjusting to my monitors so the mixes are still developing. Patience is a virtue...

I know I keep repeating myself but I do appreciate your time and the feedback...it helps me hone in on these problem areas much faster, and I can avoid them after having identified and fixed the problem.

Oh and I quite enjoy programming in sylenth :P Might need to get my hands on VirusTI next.

(Ended up getting quite the progressive synth on my first go around, threw on some basic prog. kick/percs for giggles)
SynthTest by TheTA

Last edited by theterran on Oct-25-2010 at 00:06

i dont how you do it but the levels are out of control in this last sample too. either you are pushing the volume too high so that FL reduces it on the render to prevent clipping, or you are doing it intentionally with a sidechain compressor on your synth, triggered by your whole drummachine. it does not work. sorry.

quote:

Originally posted by Kenny Rogers i dont how you do it but the levels are out of control in this last sample too. either you are pushing the volume too high so that FL reduces it on the render to prevent clipping, or you are doing it intentionally with a sidechain compressor on your synth, triggered by your whole drummachine. it does not work. sorry.

Absolutely doesn't make sense. *frustrated* I updated the sample above to reflect the larger room settings on my Yamaha HS80m's. (no sub and see below for details)

This feels like something that I have to fix before I move on...because what's the point if I can't even level properly?

I'm monitoring max levels using my headphones (Beyer DT770pro) and amps set to 100%. If it was too loud it would clip AND hurt my ears right?...

And on the last sample it's in Cubase...

But all of my at home spl monitoring says it's ok...So I'm stumped.

I've made more adjustments to the monitors and reposted the synthtest track above to see if it made any difference. (it's nearly an 800-1000 sq. foot room I'm in.

Here's some pics of my sequencer, should clarify some things (hopefully)

I've shown my left monitor + sequencer, so you can see the levels.

I've shown the right monitor + Mixers and opened up both the sidechain compressor for the lead synth and the compressor for the kick. I wanted a bassier kick, so I cut the snap about -3db and boosted the bass/sub-bass about 3db

At max volume, you can see the master channel peaking at -2.9. (roughly -3db)

The only thing on the master channel is an unmodded-physics-based limiter to control the peaks as was suggested.

SO I am fucking clueless...Arf. I know most people use it as an excuse...but I really have only started since January of this year...EDM production seems very overwhelming overall but I'm just gonna keep on it...the faster I can work out my mixing disorder...the faster I can get back to making the music I lurv.

Last edited by theterran on Oct-25-2010 at 06:47

quote:

Originally posted by theterran Absolutely doesn't make sense. *frustrated* I updated the sample above to reflect the larger room settings on my Yamaha HS80m's. (no sub and see below for details) This feels like something that I have to fix before I move on...because what's the point if I can't even level properly? I'm monitoring max levels using my headphones (Beyer DT770pro) and amps set to 100%. If it was too loud it would clip AND hurt my ears right?... And on the last sample it's in Cubase... But all of my at home spl monitoring says it's ok...So I'm stumped. I've made more adjustments to the monitors and reposted the synthtest track above to see if it made any difference. (it's nearly an 800-1000 sq. foot room I'm in. Here's some pics of my sequencer, should clarify some things (hopefully) I've shown my left monitor + sequencer, so you can see the levels. I've shown the right monitor + Mixers and opened up both the sidechain compressor for the lead synth and the compressor for the kick. I wanted a bassier kick, so I cut the snap about -3db and boosted the bass/sub-bass about 3db At max volume, you can see the master channel peaking at -2.9. (roughly -3db) The only thing on the master channel is an unmodded-physics-based limiter to control the peaks as was suggested. SO I am fucking clueless...Arf. I know most people use it as an excuse...but I really have only started since January of this year...EDM production seems very overwhelming overall but I'm just gonna keep on it...the faster I can work out my mixing disorder...the faster I can get back to making the music I lurv.

I have absolutely no idea what you are on about with all the above. Room sizes? amp settings? it will hurt your ears if its too loud?

This has nothing to do with setting the individual track levels when producing a tune. You are WAY over thinking all of this. I've listened to that very last soundcloud sample a couple of posts up.

My advice - TAKE OFF ALL COMPRESSORS ON EVERY CHANNEL AND ON THE MASTER. NO LIMITERS EITHER!!

Now start again and don't put any compressor anywhere. You should get a balanced mix in terms of levels just by setting the volume faders correctly for each channel. No compression required.

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When I'm having trouble with a mix I turn all my faders down but my kick then re-mix around the kick. My master is always empty get your mix together before trying to put a donk on it mate

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quote:

Originally posted by G-Con I have absolutely no idea what you are on about with all the above. Room sizes? amp settings? it will hurt your ears if its too loud? This has nothing to do with setting the individual track levels when producing a tune. You are WAY over thinking all of this. I've listened to that very last soundcloud sample a couple of posts up. My advice - TAKE OFF ALL COMPRESSORS ON EVERY CHANNEL AND ON THE MASTER. NO LIMITERS EITHER!! Now start again and don't put any compressor anywhere. You should get a balanced mix in terms of levels just by setting the volume faders correctly for each channel. No compression required.

I actually did start simply by reading almost every fking tutorial known to man on setting levels of drumkits, synths etc...I even picked up a 150 dollar recording technicians manual to help.

Also this thread : http://www.tweakheadz.com/perfect_mix.html

So up until now I've simply been setting everything the way everyone has suggested.

By amp I mean computer amp. Like the windows mixer in the bottom right. I also judiciously set all of the native soundcards EQ'ing to FLAT.
What I meant by hurting my ears...My headphones don't have an amp, thus if I plug them into my soundcard (creative x-fi platinum with Alchemy support) at 100% volume, that should logically be my specified maximum volume, where it's not obliterating my eardrums.

I add content and mix at 20% volume first to avoid ear fatigue...then when I'm happy with the track I'll mix once more at 100%) I also go back and forth between professional tracks to compare and see how I've done...This is probably what is adding to my confusion, because the levels in my recent tracks sound similar (to me) to professionally produced EDM.

Haven't tried mixing with just my ears...but I really don't hear anything wrong with that sample...The kick is the focal point, then underneath is the sidechained synth...clap and hats sit right underneath everything else.

So either communication fail or I am being seriously trolled. (the latter would be quite pathetic considering this is where one is supposed to get technical help)

Last edited by theterran on Oct-25-2010 at 08:58

maybe u use some sort of normalization option when rendering? i know logic has that and you should stay away from it. dont know if cubase has it though. could u just try to lower then master volume with -20dB and do another render? if its still there then theres definitly something weird going on.

i do think it is your sidechaining causing problem though. im actually 90% sure. it seems though that u your not using the kick alone, but the whole drummachine or something, either way you should remove it, only a baseline needs sidechaining.

quote:

Originally posted by theterran So either communication fail

It's this, no one is trolling.

Yes it is a good idea to mix at low levels, as you say to avoid ear fatigue but also, you will mix better at lower levels. If everything sounds clear and comes through at low levels, it will sound good at louder volumes.

Your sidechain needs work. It's compressing the lead too much - try shortening the release and/or lowering the ratio.

And what Kevin shawn says is simple but very good advice.

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Listen to and download all my tracks at www.gregnicot.bandcamp.com

I can't hear anything particulary 'wrong' in terms of levels in the above sample.

It is too loud if there is no master compression - so just turn it all down, end of.

Then once mixed, it's time for mastering / loudening.

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quote:

Originally posted by theterran Except...there's nothing on the master channel...in the example track now =|. (so probably the native compressors or maximus mucking things up, as Track2 was mixed in FL)

If there's nothing on the master channel then you need to make sure the output isn't clipping or compromised in any way, it's as simple as that.

quote:

Originally posted by theterran If you'd like an example of recent mixes, have a listen to yob or trundle on moi soundcloud...I've mixed both tracks the way I've described. For now...I guess I'll be busy for the next week on track2 trying to figure out what the hell happened.

Will try to get back to you on this later.

___________________
Put an end to the loudness war. Don't limit or compress your mixdown until mastering; leave the master channel alone.

Contact me for mastering.