Hi all, it's your "CDj" again... although I'm not exactly the topic of discussion, I was the reason this thread got started. Everyone's got a different point of view on this, and it's doubtful any amount of debating will really change what things people believe are morally sound.
laborate on my point before, I began to love this scene because it was underground in the sense that it was not commercially fueled. From it's inception until the mid to late 90's the whole scene was still relatively pure in the respect that people who attended and performed at events were there for the love of the subculture. Which is why I dislike Oakenfold now for his intentions to try and commercialize this music and cheapen it by making it trendy.

Someone quoted Max Graham in the beginning of this thread, and Graham cited Sander Kleinenberg when saying that fellow artists don't condone or appreciate online distribution of their sets. On the contrary, Sander is by far my favorite DJ, and I never miss a chance to support him by attending his events whenever he comes down to spin, shaking his hand, and maybe having a few words with him. Which is why it pleases me that he was the one speaking in this interview and said what he said on his feelings of Internet distribution. Heres a link to a new thread that contains a link to the interview. And let's try to keep the conversation civil and relevant. Even if we have extremely different opinions on such a controversial topic, I'd enjoy discussing it.

new thread:
http://www.tranceaddict.com/forums/...&threadid=95650

hey adam...

do you still have your tracklist written down from that day? There was this one song you played and i forgot to ask you the title of it. anyway... if you do.. contact me on aim. My SN is wushuboy111

there is no feeling with cdj'ing plus the sound qaulity is bogus unless you have a 320k stream+
vinyl is where its at. The good thing about vinyl is that its sampled at real time analog complete reproduction of the actual airwave :O

I would only use cd's if its a rare item... a single thats unreleased or extremely hard to get.

Vinyl is just plain keen

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Markus Schulz...

http://www.myspace.com/dougarcuri

Okay, about the no feeling, I don't even think that's a justifiable statement. Although I mainly spin CD's, I do also spin vinyls that were hard to find tracks. There is no difference in "feeling". If you want to talk technically, if you learn to spin on either, mechanics are still the same, push, drag, cue, adjust pitch. And then learning to use those skills and beatmatch... then you learn how to effectively use the mixer... after you got all that down, it comes down to song selection and how well you put together sets. So unless you're being literal and talking about touching a vinyl disc as opposed to a rubber platter or jog wheel, the ability to take a group of tracks and put them together in a way where the total is greater than merely the sum of it's parts is the most integral part in creating feeling.
I use at least 192kbps, anything less and yes, the spectrum is noticeably lacking but at 192, especially HQ 192, the quality difference is negligible (most removed frequencies are sub or supersonic), if not a recurring trade-off of vinyl quality: static, dull needles, worn vinyls, etc... and pumping it through a PA pretty much dissolves most of the audible differences. I mix back and forth from vinyl to 192 on B&W Matrix 803 Speakers through a McIntosh amp, sound is clean and full.
And there's a caveat to the idea that the sound quality of an analog airwave sampled in realtime is ideal... that is: it's true when the recorded source itself is also analog (i.e. live instruments or voice recorded via condenser mics) But most electronica tracks are only partially analog at most. In fact many analog signals are digitalized and then effected with digital processors. Keeping this in mind, the rest of the instrumental elements are also digital giving rise to a digital source. It follows in this case, that converting a digital source to an analog signal, which is passed to the lathe that etches the wave vibrations onto the vinyl analog medium, produces an analog interpretation of a digital source. The best idea is to obtain a sound, place and work with it in a medium that will most faithfully represent the signal type, and optimally keep it in that form until the last possible moment before output to speakers. Plus CD's don't wear out from play like vinyls.
Since so many DJ's incorporate CD's into their sets now, it's a wonder why labels don't just sell LP's as single CD's too, they're cheaper, easier to manufacture, at 2-3 bucks a single, they'd still make a profit in the ballpark of 5-10 times manufacturing costs and materials. I would definitely buy those, thats a reasonable price I'd be willing to pay.

Belated response, sorry was away for a week or so lost track of this post,

OK wushu, i dont think it was you spinning the CDs im talking about, the tracks dropped that i heard on CD i have both of em on vinyl at least when i was wandering past the booth, Someone played lustral broken pitch and sulfur mix and also dropped IIO - at the end made edit, i have both these records on vinyl and they arent super hard to get atm that is the kind of shit im talking about, And my only thoughts on burning shitloads of music is this, how can you say you like the music so much if you arent purchasing the vinyls all this does is bankrupt record companies so vinyls become unavailible, wushu it appears to me you buy a shit load of vinyls so this isnt dirrected at you, I saw the record crates, hell i was trainspotting and rumaging through a few of em :P, but i also saw your 240 disc case logic filled to the fucking brim with burned CDs im not sure who it was but he better have just been backing his vinyl collection up so he could fool around with the CDJs ahha.

But amidst all this bitching people are forgetting about 1 thing, they are called CD SINGLES! yes those things availible long after the rare vinyl vanishes. CDJs i have loads of respect for, but music pirates you suxors! As for dropping those rare vinyls yeah 100 bux is pretty ridiculous for em, but thats what makes them so rare and 1337 heh. So to wushu and and all the other guys who worked at this show, this aint like a slander on you, unless your exploding cuz you dont own anythign but endless cdr spools :P.

Moral of story is buy music so our record labels dont go under, cuz music doesnt become rare from an artist going under so much as the record label going under. Artists get money from gigs, not record labels.

PS: as always alot of people misstook the point of this thread thinking it says CDJs are thiefs, it says no such thing, i support a CDJ spinning a legit CD as much as a Vinyl DJ, this is not regarding people spinning bought CD singles or CD promos it is merely about burnt CDs, and no not a cd with one or 2 legit songs a whole caselogic full of burnt CDs :P

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Peace DigDug

quote:

Originally posted by byakko Since so many DJ's incorporate CD's into their sets now, it's a wonder why labels don't just sell LP's as single CD's too, they're cheaper, easier to manufacture, at 2-3 bucks a single, they'd still make a profit in the ballpark of 5-10 times manufacturing costs and materials. I would definitely buy those, thats a reasonable price I'd be willing to pay.

Actually when a label is facing hardship its the cd singles/CDM's that are the first things to go off the release schedule. So why do you think that is? If every1 was like you and was willing to pay 2-3 bucks a single then that would be great. Fact is your a minority. Because for the majority of people it doesnt matter how cheap they are, if they can get it for free then thats what they'll do.

Lol byakko my apologies bro, I didnt mean for this to turn on you lolz Are you OK? haha, well aside from your MP3 collection you were mixing good :Þ, forgive me plz heh can we still be friends jolzin. =Þ,
yeah By is right, mechanics are the same with CDs and vinyls plz stop that stupid shit about vinyls are better for performance its a MYTH! heh

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Peace DigDug

quote:

Originally posted by DJDigDug Lol byakko my apologies bro, I didnt mean for this to turn on you lolz Are you OK? haha, well aside from your MP3 collection you were mixing good :Þ, forgive me plz heh can we still be friends jolzin. =Þ, yeah By is right, mechanics are the same with CDs and vinyls plz stop that stupid shit about vinyls are better for performance its a MYTH! heh

hehehe yeah i'm fine... it's ok, it wasn't my impression from your first post that you were just casually talking trash... in fact, i agree with you that ultimately, lack of record sales adversely affects the record company, and consequently the artist to an extent.
But I didn't start spinning with any intentions of making it a career. It was just for the fun of it... and I don't think anyone will argue that spending the bulk of your beer and strip club money on vinyls offsets some of the enjoyment of spinning. But that's justifiable... if you're actually trying to make it your career. Me on the other hand, it's mainly a hobby, albeit a hobby that i love and take seriously. I wouldn't be able to justify spending the limited amount of money i have (poor college student) to support the cost of buying vinyls. If i COULD afford buying vinyls, I can truthfully say I wouldn't have a problem using that as my primary source. I mean theres no way I'd push cd's aside, but downloading tracks has it's own negatives too, in the form of low quality, skips, ones that are just cut out of someones set, changing speeds, etc. I don't remember if I was actually heading toward a point, but i guess, suffice it to say I'm poor and will happily accept donations.... PayPal payments ok.

To DJDigDug... i was the one who dropped Lustral - Broken (pitch and sulfer remix). I know that this is a widely available record butlet me explain why i had it burned. Like byakko, i do this for a hobbie and cant afford to buy every single record out there. The reason i used a downloaded copy of it was because i hadnt heard it till that week and i didnt have time to go find the vinyl since i work fulltime to bout 9pm. Since i couldnt find it i decided that using this would be the next best thing for this event. But you can be rest assured that i liked the song so much that its already on its way in the mail :P Sometimes you just have to take into consideration wat the situation is where people use CDRs. For me it was a time constraint thing where i wanted to play some songs but didnt have the time to go order or buy them. Just keep that in mind before flamming people for using cdrs. Another thing is...i dont think that cd-singles are created for every vinyl release. So you cant just say get the cd single. The older stuff prolly did not have cd releases. And even now, cd singles probably are not created for every vinyl released. Another thing is that some people dont realize that the equipment is just as expensive as buying vinyl. CDJs are there for a purpose and its to supplement the DJ. Now.. if you're blaming the DJs for using burnt CDs.. then you might as well turn your blame to the manufacturers of the equipment as well since they create the technology whereby people can use the cdrs. I acknowledge all your points..but lets not look at it from one point of view. There's many facets to this debate.