quote:

Originally posted by trancaholic @Yoepus: Ok, now I understand what your list is supposed to say. I definately do not agree with all being examples of the people crying out for help and getting it - benevolent style. But leaving that aside, I think that you managed to give me my concrete example (the Balkans).

Yee I win

Seriously though, what were you thinking? Nobody ever called the USA out for help... come on..

But seriously the Balkans? Out of all the list, the Balkans? Hey, guess whatever floats your boat.

quote:

This debate is either very important or totally irrelevant, depending on what exactly it is that you US-patriots are complaining about when you say that "they want to be able to dictate the terms of the aid they receive. i.e. make the U.S. their personal bitch until they get what they want, then stab the U.S. in the back when all is done and remind the world how much they hated the U.S. in the first place"

Let me make clear by "this debate", you mean the definition of peoples?

quote:

A) Whatever we do *some people* are going to complain, or B) There's people who will ask for help and those *same people*, once helped out, will complain about the US for helping them?

I dunno that it actually matters whether it is A or B or for that matter something else. I listed so many examples they do fall into more categories then just A and B.

For instance what about people complain that the US is going to help them and then when the USA actually does they don't complain (much) like in Afghanistan?

Iraq (Gulf War II) might also fit under the above category, lets call it C.

I think mostly it falls into category A. But there are a wide array of categories.

In cases like Korea and the Arab world is more similar to B. Egypt, Syria, and Jordan, basically cried out for US internvention in 1956, 1963, and 1973, yet complain about that same very intervention till this day.

Really... I dunno where you're trying to go with this...

___________________
SAVE ZIONIST MUSTARD: BUY ZIONIST KETCHUP!


Click here to support the free mustard alliance.

quote:

Originally posted by Fir3start3r Was it wrong? It depends on which end of the time scale we're looking at it from.

No it doesn't. There are certain values and morals which are universal and have been understood for ages, like don't lie, don't cheat, don't steal, don't murder etc. It was pretty obvious what they did was wrong to any outside observer. It doesn't matter what fucking period in history it was.

___________________
"The Greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge." -Stephen Hawking
"First they came for the communists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a communist;
Then they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a socialist;
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a trade unionist;
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out— because I was not a Jew;
Then they came for me— and there was no one left to speak out for me." -Martin Niemöller

American food is shit with the exception of Cajun/Creole food...and even that is French and African!!

quote:

Originally posted by shaolin_Z No it doesn't. There are certain values and morals which are universal and have been understood for ages, like don't lie, don't cheat, don't steal, don't murder etc. It was pretty obvious what they did was wrong to any outside observer. It doesn't matter what fucking period in history it was.

Its not like it was only the Europeans. Look at the Indians, they decimated entire colonies of poor, starving, and confused Europeans.

Neither the Indians nor the Europeans fought according to the laws of war, the only difference is the Indians didn't have good firepower, education, and technology.

Regardless most Indians were decimated by disease, not Europeans. And Indians despite being out-educated and with poor technology were still able to make some great stands.

It wasn't so clear cut, there were tons of different Indian nations, many Indians used the Europeans against other Indians for their own selfish reasons (just as the Europeans used Indians against each other for their own selfish reasons). There are only a couple of cases where a strong Indian leader was able to ally several tribes into a united front against the Europeans.

Also, when Indians were massacared at that time, it was not an accepted by the general populace either. Some were even brought to trial against such crimes.

___________________
SAVE ZIONIST MUSTARD: BUY ZIONIST KETCHUP!


Click here to support the free mustard alliance.

quote:

Originally posted by George Smiley American food is shit with the exception of Cajun/Creole food...and even that is French and African!!

Right

You as a Brit have the least amount of right to critize food!

Would you like some bland to go with your meal?

___________________
SAVE ZIONIST MUSTARD: BUY ZIONIST KETCHUP!


Click here to support the free mustard alliance.

quote:

Originally posted by Yoepus Right You as a Brit have the least amount of right to critize food! Would you like some bland to go with your meal?

I'll have you know I am an excellent chef, and amongst my speciallities are Falafel and honey-mustard baked chicken so even you should appreciate them!

quote:

Originally posted by Yoepus Right You as a Brit have the least amount of right to critize food! Would you like some bland to go with your meal?

Hey.. at least they dont steal arab cultured foods like humus and falafel and call it "israeli" food.

hmm.. stealing seems to be a central theme with israel.. i wonder what else theyve stolen

___________________
"This place isn't big enough for me to blow it up."
-MARCO V

quote:

Originally posted by Cyrus King Hey.. at least they dont steal arab cultured foods like humus and falafel and call it "israeli" food. hmm.. stealing seems to be a central theme with israel.. i wonder what else theyve stolen

Cyrus, old pal. Welcome back! I thought you were killed off in a jihad.

quote:

Originally posted by Cyrus King Hey.. at least they dont steal arab cultured foods like humus and falafel and call it "israeli" food. hmm.. stealing seems to be a central theme with israel.. i wonder what else theyve stolen

I'm sorry, did you just completely ignore Georegy's post above

I mean *snap*

___________________
SAVE ZIONIST MUSTARD: BUY ZIONIST KETCHUP!


Click here to support the free mustard alliance.

quote:

Originally posted by shaolin_Z No it doesn't. There are certain values and morals which are universal and have been understood for ages, like don't lie, don't cheat, don't steal, don't murder etc. It was pretty obvious what they did was wrong to any outside observer. It doesn't matter what fucking period in history it was.

While this is understood by everyone (one would hope) it was the reality of the time; like it or not.
Please understand, I'm not saying I liked it, who the hell would??
Spitting venom at the past is like pissing in the wind; the point is, was anything learned so that it's not repeated?

___________________
"...End? No, the journey doesn't end here. Death is just another path...one that we all must take.
The grey rain-curtain of this world rolls back, and all change to silver glass...and then you see it...
...white shores...and beyond...the far green country under a swift sunrise."

quote:

Originally posted by Fir3start3r While this is understood by everyone (one would hope) it was the reality of the time; like it or not. Please understand, I'm not saying I liked it, who the hell would?? Spitting venom at the past is like pissing in the wind; the point is, was anything learned so that it's not repeated?

I actually pissed in the wind once (not for any scientific experiment or anything, I just wasn't concentrating!) and the theory is true - dont piss in the wind!

quote:

Originally posted by George Smiley I actually pissed in the wind once (not for any scientific experiment or anything, I just wasn't concentrating!) and the theory is true - dont piss in the wind!

"I see," said the blind man pissing in the wind, "It all comes back to me!"