quote:

Originally posted by Cosmic Fur Oh come on! Look at the past history of America's involvement in the Middle East. 9 times out of 10 they have been on the side of Israel. You think all this happens by chance? That in every conflict Israel has been involved in, they are the ones who are wronged? Ever since the end of WWII and the massive amounts of Jewish people who immigrated to America as the safehouse, the Jewish influence on America has been very strong.

So because a country has a lot of successful Jews living in it, suddenly we 'run the country'?? I bet that's what the Germans were afraid of too b4 WWII. Guess what dumbass, Jews are successful where ever they go, and its dumbasses like you that seem to have a problem with it, stirring propaganda like this. I can GUARANTEE you that there are FAR more non-Jews in power running the USA....

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"When I die, I want to be buried under the dancefloor"- Frankie Madgenta

Hezbollah are to blame for the condition of the Lebanese people. They are responsible for launching a military offensive against the Israeli people by the kidnapping of the Jewish soldiers and later by the rocket attacks on Haifa. Ultimately, they are fighting a proxy war against the Jewish state on behalf of the more nefarious powers in the Middle East, specifically Iran and Syria. Unfortunately while these two countries sit back and arm groups like Hezbollah on their state sponsored terrorism budget, it is the Lebanese people who have to pay the real costs of War. At some point you have to wonder why it is that the Lebanese people continue to support these terrorists when all get in return is bloodshed and the destruction of their homeland.

Yet Hezbollah are seen as the hero's, and this conflict serves as a recruiting campaign for their fruitless cause. When will the stupid people who support this group learn that violence will not achieve sustainable peace? How many years will it take before it dawns on them at the Jewish state will never capitulate, that those people will never back down to aggression ? Furthermore, when will innocent people finally question the methods of these 'resistance fighters' before they come out into the streets and say, enough! – “There must be another way. We’ve tried fighting for 20 years, all we’ve got in return is despair…it’s time to renounce violence starting with the widespread support of groups like Hezbollah, and seek another solution. If we’re going to keep dying like we have, let’s go out onto the street, and stand before the world without any weapons and see if Israel has the stomach to bomb a ‘truly’ passive enemy, and if the world will continue to watch as we are slaughtered. ”

Passive resistance has lead to the emancipation of states much larger then Lebanon and Palestine, but in order for it to work; you need leaders who desire peace…not the blood of the enemy.

It's sad to watch tensions escalate again in the Middle East. It seems the cyclical pattern of conflict is never ending in that region. While the blame can not be one sided, the approach of reacting to oppression by violence and aggression seems to be a standard of extremists. I don't want to point to the religion as the chief cause, but when you have certain fanatical states like Iran denying the existence of Israel, and organizations like Hezbollah who have made it a mandate to exterminate Zionist presence in the region then you have to wonder whether religion is being perverted to serve a military objective.

The Israeli’s have pinned themselves into a no win situation. If they stop the offensive, they will be perceived as weak. It will undoubtedly bolster the resolve of extremists groups in the region and there will be a new wave of attacks on the state. Continuing to wage a military campaign against a city where Hezbollah is entrenched deeply on the other hand results in civilian collateral damage, and reduces their support within the International community. Israel are faced with a state within a state. Lebanon has an army, but within the country Hezbollah operates with impunity, and with widespread public and government support. Israel has called upon the Lebanese forces to form a buffer between their border to ensure no future reprisals and abductions of their soliders. The truth on the ground however is that the Lebanese army has been reluctant to act, and instead of a state presence, you have Hezbollah fighters launching shells against garrison towns in Israel. Instead of neutralizing the threat of war, Hezbollah has brought the war to their front doorstep. Instead of turning over the abducted soliders, Hezbollah has demanded a release of prisoners, a demand that NO government in the world would/should accept.

Israel have made their own share of mistakes...instead of a proportionate reponse they have targetted civilian infrastructure. I can't imagine that Israel wasn't aware that bombing civilian targets wouldn't result in the loss of innocent lives, but given the political implications of a weak response within a newly formed government, I guess the Israeli feel justified because the see it as a counter offensive launched against the rocket attacks by Hezbollah. Personally, I think Israel have to scale back their destruction of Bierut via airstrikes, but given the other option is a land incursion, it seems both sides have reached a stalemate with neither looking towards declaring a cease fire. Israels objective is clear: the complete disarmament of Hezbollah. That can now only be achieved via land based missions, which seem imminent.

As the world questions the proportionaily of Israels response, it is the suffering people of Lebanon who have the power to call upon Hezbollah to lay down their arms and declare a truce to avoid a full scale war. Their voices will better reach the ears of their own fighters...their voice is louder then the collective plee of a million man peace march held in Toronto, because theirs is the voice of anguish and suffering. They are feeling the tanglible losses of war...we (the rest of the world) are only watching and hearing about it on the news.

With their promise to keep fighting though, it seems Hezbollah would not be willing to hear them, even if such a call to disarm was made. Afterall, whether they win or lose the fight, extremist groups like Hezbollah continue to gain support by putting their civilian population at risk, and turning Beirut into a battlefield. More men sign up for the 'cause', and the next wave of martyrs prepares to fight to same, pointless fight. So, as the region enters a truly desperate period in which military commanders have put their own objectives above the growing humanitarian crisis, perhaps it is the power of the ordinary defenseless citizens caught in the crossfire, and his/her voice which will prevail over the thunder of the rockets and bombs, in finally bringing an end to the destruction.

I sincerely hope that the innocents on both sides escape with what’s left of their shattered lives and find the strength to question why, the more extreme elements amongst their own people constantly look towards a path of violence…

When history has proved time and again, that violence only begets violence.

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"Hell is full of musical amateurs; music is the brandy of the damned."
~ George Bernard Shaw

Last edited by Kytracid on Jul-20-2006 at 11:41

kytracid, i couldnt have said it better myself.

The agressors are hezbollah and they are to blame for this. Whether Israel's response is excessive or not is a moot point. If Hezbollah/Lebonese didnt want any force, excessive or not, to be used against them then they wouldnt have provoked Israel in the first place.

I take no sides in this issue. And i feel very bad for innocents on both sides of the border. But the power is definately in the hands of the southern lebonese population. If the shiite muslims in Southern Lebonon were to reject Hezbollah and it's actions, it would be very difficult for them to exist. As it is, they support Hezbollah and actually elect them to parliament!! The reason the Lebonese government is forced to let Hezbollah act with impunity is because if they didnt, the country would probably be forced back into civil war.

I feel sorry for the non hezbollah supporting Lebonese. I also feel sorry for the Israelis. But as for the hezbollah supporters I say this... What did you expect? really?

Hezbollah would not be able to exist in the form that it does now if it werent supported by a majority of the civilians in southern lebanon.

Imagine if a province in Canada were to elect al qaeda to parliament and then al qaeda started shelling vermont. You dont think the US would react?

Now replace the word Canada with Lebanon, al qaeda with hezbollah, and US with Israel and i think you might get the picture.

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quote:

Originally posted by jester Everything in this country is illegal.

"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery…" Winston Churchill

‎"If you have ten thousand regulations you destroy all respect for the law" - Winston Churchill

very glad to hear Karim and his dad are ok and my thoughts are with him and the rest of his family there as they go through this.

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They will help rebuild sbout as much as syria, iran and hezbollah are going to rebuild the parts of israel they are bombing id say...

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quote:

Originally posted by jester Everything in this country is illegal.

"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery…" Winston Churchill

‎"If you have ten thousand regulations you destroy all respect for the law" - Winston Churchill

quote:

Originally posted by starsearcher Not to mention that in the current conflict it's of US interest that Israel destroys Hesbullah.

See the funny thing is that Israel is destroying a whole lot more than just the "Hesbullah". They're practically levelling the whole country. Are there any plans to compensate the innocent people of Lebanon who lost EVERYTHING because of Israeli bombs? Is Israel going to rebuild all the roads and bridges they destroyed, and left all those innocent people stranded?

But yea...Israel has the right to defend itself; by taking over a country, and killing more innocent people in one raid than the total number of kills Hezbollah has gotten in a 2-week span.

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 They will help rebuild sbout as much as syria, iran and hezbollah are going to rebuild the parts of israel they are bombing id say...

Well if we're talking about Hezbollah building and property, then fuck it. What about the rest of the country though, that has nothing to do with Hezbollah but is still getting blown up?

So glad to hear Karim and his dad made it out safe! Thank the universe.

What a weight that will be off of Katys mind! I couldnt imagine dealing with worrynig about a loved one being over there!

quote:

Originally posted by StereoPrincess I have been also reading Karim's blog.

Jeez, feel so outta the loop, I didnt even realize he had a blog and was updating it with his sitch over there.

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TECHNO IS THE BEST NOISE ON EARTH.
Save Techno - Stop Minimal / Tech-House

quote:

Originally posted by Kytracid ...

I have always had an immense amount of respect for you and this post is further proof as to why.

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- rabbit.joker [funny¿rabbit] | www.rabbitjoker.com |www.ddtt.org

Dark Dirty Tech Tribal. | Hands in air (trance) and feet on the floor (house).

quote:

Originally posted by Kytracid When history has proved time and again, that violence only begets violence.

If we can only learn from history and try to find a solution to break this cycle of violence...

quote:

Originally posted by infinity HiGH Well if we're talking about Hezbollah building and property, then fuck it. What about the rest of the country though, that has nothing to do with Hezbollah but is still getting blown up?

the people who support hezbollah which include many of the so called innocent civilians should think about that.

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quote:

Originally posted by jester Everything in this country is illegal.

"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery…" Winston Churchill

‎"If you have ten thousand regulations you destroy all respect for the law" - Winston Churchill