quote:

Originally posted by Endlesswave I see what you're saying in some sense, but the thing is they are creating a new sound, creating something different. Isn't editing changing something to make something completely new? Leaving in shitty parts of a movie completely changes the feel for the overall movie, it's the same with dj'ing. They are creating something new, by manipulation.

sure, manipulation can constitute some sort of qualification to be labeled as a musician. but all the big dj's today who have big followings, earned their respect and reputation from their productions. even dj's like armin, tiestocle... had to first earn their stripes with their productions b4 they started getting gigs.

being able to 'manipulate' the flow of tracks is somewhat of a skill, but there are alot of bedroom dj's who claim to be musicians who will be forgotten in time b/c they never produced anything. whereas, now, even though pvd and tiestocle have been producing crappy 'dj' manipulated sets, they will still garner fan support b/c of their past productions, ppl still want to hear urban train and songs from OTAB.

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Originally posted by slingshot not so much. someone playing a keyboard or any instrument for that matter has to adhere to theoretical musical structure to produce anything that may resemble a melody or a song. while a keyboard does have certain programming that does not really resemble any sort of instrument at all and is just basically a collage of sound, for the most part keyboards are programmed to mimic instruments. while playing any of these instruments theory still needs to be a adhered to. comparing this to what a dj does is sort of a pointless argument because there is nothing that the dj can do through turntables that can be explained by theoretical music structure. like, you can't hit the decks and start going through your scales.... in the technical sense of the word, i don't think you can call a dj a musician. while dj's are very much musicians in the broad sense of the word....technically speaking, it just does not work. i also think it is pointless to debate about this because you can just as easily say that dj's are artists. in terms of respect and recognition no one is more important than the other....musician or artist.

So what about percussionists?

There isn't much of music theory or music structure involved when you're hitting a triangle or cymbals.

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quote:

Originally posted by chinamon not true. i say "ugh" but i am a tranny.

quote:

Originally posted by kotsy lol colour me retarded

quote:

Originally posted by Porky sure, manipulation can constitute some sort of qualification to be labeled as a musician. but all the big dj's today who have big followings, earned their respect and reputation from their productions. even dj's like armin, tiestocle... had to first earn their stripes with their productions b4 they started getting gigs. being able to 'manipulate' the flow of tracks is somewhat of a skill, but there are alot of bedroom dj's who claim to be musicians who will be forgotten in time b/c they never produced anything. whereas, now, even though pvd and tiestocle have been producing crappy 'dj' manipulated sets, they will still garner fan support b/c of their past productions, ppl still want to hear urban train and songs from OTAB.

I agree with this 100%. Tiesto didn't really need huge production cred to get gigs earlier, now it's a MUST for an up and coming newb to produce to get somehwere/famous etc. At least consistently. They're musicians just not to the same extent that say a composer or producer is one.

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Originally posted by EvilTree So what about percussionists? There isn't much of music theory or music structure involved when you're hitting a triangle or cymbals.

Tell that to a 14 piece percussion section of an orchestra each of which have dedicated their life to learning and performing music.

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quote:

Originally posted by Chris Allen Tell that to a 14 piece percussion section of an orchestra each of which have dedicated their life to learning and performing music.

I was actually trying to support the argument that DJs are musicians

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quote:

Originally posted by chinamon not true. i say "ugh" but i am a tranny.

quote:

Originally posted by kotsy lol colour me retarded

quote:

Originally posted by EvilTree So what about percussionists? There isn't much of music theory or music structure involved when you're hitting a triangle or cymbals.

Yes there is. Very much so.



Edumacate yourself Yohan.

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quote:

Originally posted by slingshot Yes there is. Very much so. Edumacate yourself Yohan.

Bah. I've been pwned.

But only slightly!

My point still stands.

What about triangle, castanets, tambourine, etc?

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quote:

Originally posted by chinamon not true. i say "ugh" but i am a tranny.

quote:

Originally posted by kotsy lol colour me retarded

quote:

Originally posted by EvilTree What about triangle, castanets, tambourine, etc?

Although the types of percussion instruments that you are suggesting resonate an indefinate pitch and more or less only serve a rhythmic purpose, they still adhere to the timing structure of musical theory.

It's not just like tap here, tap there, shake here, shake there. The rhythm for these instruments can still be written in a score of music.

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quote:

Originally posted by Endlesswave Tiesto didn't really need huge production cred to get gigs earlier,

this is actually false. i read in a tiestocle interview that he didn't start getting gigs until he started producing.. ala kamaya painters, gouryella, magik's... etc


cmon man! endless waveeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!!!!!!!11

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quote:

Originally posted by EvilTree Bah. I've been pwned.

cmon man, where are you ninja-reflex counter moves? don't dissapoint!

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quote:

Originally posted by slingshot Although the types of percussion instruments that you are suggesting resonate an indefinate pitch and more or less only serve a rhythmic purpose, they still adhere to the timing structure of musical theory.

Same as a DJ playing an effect on a mixer?

quote:

It's not just like tap here, tap there, shake here, shake there. The rhythm for these instruments can still be written in a score of music.

I don't see this as relevant to whether percussionist should be considered a musician.

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quote:

Originally posted by chinamon not true. i say "ugh" but i am a tranny.

quote:

Originally posted by kotsy lol colour me retarded

quote:

Originally posted by Porky cmon man, where are you ninja-reflex counter moves? don't dissapoint!

School broke my spirit this semester and my ninja chi fled

I lose

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quote:

Originally posted by chinamon not true. i say "ugh" but i am a tranny.

quote:

Originally posted by kotsy lol colour me retarded