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Originally posted by Magnetonium Without Allies, Soviet Union would have had a stalemate with Nazi Germany. The West just saved its own arse when they realized that Soviets would defeat Nazis so only in 1944 did they finally land in mainland Europe because they didnt want Soviets "liberating" entire Europe. Stalin begged and begged for early Western armies landing in Europe as early as 1942. But I do appreciate ALL Allies contribution in defeating Nazi terror machine. Though I am not very sympathetic with Stalin's terror either.

imo the "stalemate" you speak of was due, in part, to allied pressure.
-all the resources that the germans used in combatting the allies.
-the yanks kept the japanese from turning on siberia.
-the poms took on the brunt of the german airforce.
-hitler had to bail the italians out of africa.
-all the code-breaking the allies did.
-all the divisions hitler kept in western europe for possible allied assaults.

but i agree. i do appreciate ALL allied forces, but as you rightly say, the terror regime of the USSR was despicable. which is why i dont have issues when a former soviet satellite decides to remove a monument in their own country.

edit: metalgear, get a clue.

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Wow... some of you guys are really FUCKING dense.

Think about it this way... in a time when Radical Islam (which isn't exactly a religion btw, it's an ideology and if you want to argue about that... go study before you open your mouths) is a controversial issue. Does it make sense for your precious "scholars" to anoint a man who wrote a book (back in the 80's I believe) based purely out of context against a religion that's 2ND in the world, based on the number of followers? FFS i could use a Bible in the same way... but would I get anointed for that?

I guess hating Islam is a fad nowadays for "intellects". LOL Don't expect any more replies from me. I prefer reading instead. May Allah/God be with you all.

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Music for your Mind

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Originally posted by digitul punk Wow... some of you guys are really FUCKING dense. Think about it this way... in a time when Radical Islam (which isn't exactly a religion btw, it's an ideology

oh, so those that are "radical islamists" have nothing to do with islam? ok.

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Originally posted by digitul punk I guess hating Islam is a fad nowadays for "intellects". LOL Don't expect any more replies from me. I prefer reading instead. May Allah/God be with you all.

Oh and the Hate America isn't???


You keep your false prophet and evil god's well wishes to your self........ I do not need a myth to be with me...... I stopped believing in the tooth fairy a very long time ago

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Originally posted by LazFX Oh and the Hate America isn't??? You keep your false prophet and evil god's well wishes to your self........ I do not need a myth to be with me...... I stopped believing in the tooth fairy a very long time ago

Dude u put urself again in the same trap,
don't depend on propaganda sources.

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"Politics is too serious a matter to be left to the politicians."



Charles de Gaulle

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Originally posted by M.Johan Dude u put urself again in the same trap, don't depend on propaganda sources.

my views on religion are not based on propaganda. Religion is a drug....... and people need to start treating it as such.

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Originally posted by LazFX my views on religion are not based on propaganda. Religion is a drug....... and people need to start treating it as such.

Comeoooon LazFX

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she pointed me to http://www.faithfreedom.org it is ran by ex Muslims and contains many articles on the growing movement of apostates that have left slam due to the radical teachings.... very interesting web site to say the least... but it is blocked by many countries, especially Islamic Ran countries. I will not give her name or any more details out of respect for her since many in her family hate her with such a passion that even her own brother tried to kill her when they learned of her leaving the faith. that web site is pretty scary....in that it offers a POV of Islam from former Muslims and they seem to know their stuff. The guy even has debates against active Mullahs and even has a reward for any Muslim that can prove that what they state on the site about Mohamed and his teachings are wrong.

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the good christian people took on the bad christians. Why can't the muslims do the same? Could it be that all muslims want the same that these coward focks want??

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and instead of calling out the radicals that preach hate, the muslims seem to embrace it by not speaking out and taking thier religion back from the crazy radical leaders that are like a cancer and need to be cut out.. nothing to see here... move along, move along

DID Sure??

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"Politics is too serious a matter to be left to the politicians."



Charles de Gaulle

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Originally posted by digitul punk Wow... some of you guys are really FUCKING dense. Think about it this way... in a time when Radical Islam (which isn't exactly a religion btw, it's an ideology and if you want to argue about that... go study before you open your mouths) is a controversial issue. Does it make sense for your precious "scholars" to anoint a man who wrote a book (back in the 80's I believe) based purely out of context against a religion that's 2ND in the world, based on the number of followers? FFS i could use a Bible in the same way... but would I get anointed for that? I guess hating Islam is a fad nowadays for "intellects". LOL Don't expect any more replies from me. I prefer reading instead. May Allah/God be with you all.

No, seriously, I respect all religions and all religious people as much as I despise religion deep inside me. I won't ever come up to a Muslim, or a Jew, or a Hindu or whomever else and lecture them, tell them what to do and whom to worship. They can do as they wish. But so can I. If I want to write a book about how women are treated in SOME Islamic countries, then people should respect it, especially if its the truth. Same with this knighthood thing. No big deal. This is nowhere near the cartoons controversy that made more sense to me as to why it was a bad thing to do. This is just out of hand. This is suppression. And this should not be tolerated, we can do whatever we want, Islamic sharia law doesnt apply to here, and so on.

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Whenever you go and buy something, you are affecting someone somewhere, be it environment, a person, or a community - you're making a statement with what you buy. So make it a smart choice ... Its a big picture

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Originally posted by Magnetonium I fell off my chair laughing on this one. Wiseass, tell me how exactly are they meddling. Ummm, is it considered mmeddling, wiseass, when Russian government launches a formal protest with E.U. and UN over the illegal and pathetic dismantling of a WW2 dead soldiers monument that is protected under the post-WW2 agreeements? Wiseass, how exactly did they meddle when the statue still was taken down? Huh? In fact, it like dismantling your dad's grave who fought against bitter criminals and died a hero liberating someone else's land. The least they could do is leave it the way it is, to respect the people who saved they culture from extermination. But they spit in the face of the 250,000 dead Russian sooldiers who died liberating Estonia from Nazi regime. They died for nothing. We should have just stopped at the border and allowed Nazis to continue massacring them in concentration camps then, right? People like you make me sick.

no, but i would consider it meddling when russia hacks estonia's computer systems wouldnt you?

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p2pnet.net news:- Estonia says Russia is behind hack attacks which all but closed government and business sites across the country. Its government compares the events to an act of war, says The Wall Street Journal, but, “The Kremlin has denied any Russian government involvement”, says the story. The “cyber-offensive” has been, “linked to a furious diplomatic row between Russia and Estonia” and is believed to be, “the first time that a single state has come under concerted attack by hackers,” according to The Telegraph, which continues: The presidential administration’s website was inaccessible for six days late last month while those of most cabinet ministries suffered reduced connection speeds after they too were targeted. While there has been greater preoccupation in Tallinn with more tangible assaults on Estonian interests, including attacks by pro-Kremlin youths on its Moscow embassy and the disruption of fuel supplies, officials said the cyber-attacks set a worrying precedent. The attack started on April 27 after Estonia took down a Soviet statue in Talinn. It had commemorated Red Army soldiers killed in World War II, says the WSJ, going on, “The incident inflamed relations between the two countries. In Moscow, pro-Kremlin youth groups blockaded the Estonian embassy and harassed the Estonian ambassador. Estonia, with a population of 1.3 million, was formerly a part of the old Soviet Union.” Estonians say the statue reminds them of 50 years of Soviet occupation. A Nato spokesman said the organisation was giving Estonia technical help, says the BBC. “In the 21st century it’s not just about tanks and artillery,” it has Nato spokesman James Appathurai saying. “We have sent one of our experts at the request of the Estonian authorities to help them in their defence.” Some of the earliest attacks were linked by Estonia to Russian government computers, “including one in President Vladimir Putin’s office,” says The Telegraph, but it points out there’s been no hard evidence to connect the campaign to the Kremlin. “This is because the hackers used robots to infiltrate hundreds of thousands of computers around the world without their owners’ knowledge,” it states. “The infected machines would then have flooded Estonian websites with bogus information in what is known as a Distributed Denial of Service (DDoS) attack. It is believed that hackers have infected up to a quarter of the world’s computers, making tracing the true culprits almost impossible.” Said The Times Online soon after the cyber attacks began in April, Russia threatened to punish Estonia for the “blasphemous and inhuman” removal of a, “monument to the Red Army”. “The Estonian Government moved the bronze statue of a Soviet soldier in the dead of night after the Baltic state’s worst violence since independence more than 15 years ago,” says the story, adding, “One man died and 57 were hurt, including 12 police, during six hours of clashes on Thursday night that left the streets littered with glass.” Most Estonian ministry sites are nowonline again, but some banking and media companies say they’re still having problems, say reports. Estonia now wants the issue at the top of Friday’s EU-Russia summit agenda.

http://p2pnet.net/story/12262

also, they didn't "dismantle" a damned thing. they moved the statue's location. so dry those self-righteous tears mate.

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Geez, how this thread moved from Islamic extremism to removing a statue in Estonia is incredible, but fascinating nonetheless.

LOL at "Cyber-offensive." Is this the first time a country has used hackers to attack another country? I've never heard of this before.

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Originally posted by emc^2 IMHO, a day when Islam is finally and officially declared a religion of extremism and should be dealt with accordingly, could not be a day too soon.

IMO, this is one of the stupidest things I've ever read.