quote:

Originally posted by Clovis Yes, again, you are the be-all end-all master of dance music. Let's all bow down before Dr. PETRAN and absorb his endless supply of wisdom. You keep regurgitating the same shit about subjectivity yet you fail to apply it to yourself. Once again, saying I only listen to minimal/techno when you're flat out fucking wrong. In 5 years I'll be playing whatever music I like, but as I said, I'm still able to pick up a speedy J set from years back or Sasha & Digweed northern exposure and enjoy them to death today. Hopefully by then you'll have learned not to be so damn hypocritical and make sweeping baseless assumptions about the music tastes and ideas of people you've never met or bothered to get to know. I'm so over arguing with you its ridiculous. It's akin to a white house press conference with Dana Perino repeating the same useless argument over and over and over till everyone just has enough and leaves. You win. I have better shit to do...

OMG, Clovis is angry again!!!

quote:

Originally posted by jupiterone Oh I never said I know much about trance at all but the majority of the trance jocks seem to associate it with just exactly that. Or maybe there is an underground trance movement I don't know about.

Sadly, there's no "trance underground" today. But to blandly discard the whole genre, when the post-Armin commerical takeover is all you're describing, is more than a little ignorant of what came before.

quote:

Originally posted by Cobalt Sadly, there's no "trance underground" today. But to blandly discard the whole genre, when the post-Armin commerical takeover is all you're describing, is more than a little ignorant of what came before.

We're all ignorant one way or another. That Armin commercial is pretty much what sticks out most though

quote:

Originally posted by Clovis I could find tons of examples from the "minimal" section on beatport or tech house areas that I think are full of emotion, melody, and interesting construction/substance, and not just The Field tunes.

I think that's a bit of an exaggeration.

quote:

Originally posted by PETRAN OMG, Clovis is angry again!!!

If you only knew...

___________________

quote:

Originally posted by ******** Seplling don't demonstrate intelligence and educatoin - knowing does.

quote:

Originally posted by jupiterone And I'm lonely here without you Miss your breath against my skin You love me then you leave me Still I lie here pressing fingers where your kisses have been

I have no idea where those lyrics are from, but I agree that it can get really saccharine and ridiculous. The second-worst thing to happen to trance was the introduction of lyrics. The worst was the insertion of two-minute-plus breakdowns in damn near every track.

The emotional content of a lot of vocal trance makes me think of cheesy '80s hair metal. And a number of trance tracks even use wailing distorted guitars in an '80s-ish vein, further cementing the association.

*Gag.*

quote:

Originally posted by Cobalt Sadly, there's no "trance underground" today. But to blandly discard the whole genre, when the post-Armin commerical takeover is all you're describing, is more than a little ignorant of what came before.

Even in the wake of this post-Armin takeover, tracklistings and mix comps from major Trance headliners generally aren't terribly dominated by Vocal Trance productions, despite them achieving some of the more positive responses.

By the way, let me launch an opinion that might be a little controversial here: while almost nobody will ever admit it, jumping into bandwagons happens to almost everyone, and it is perfectly natural and harmless.

This is how my tastes developed within EDM:
1998-2000: i'm a kid who's getting into it, i know little about it and listen mostly to commercial stuff (which is all that is available)
2001-2002: epic trance. Ferry, Armin. ASOT pwns.
2002-2004: progressive.
2004-2005: progressive and tech house, a little of "electro house".
2005-2007: tech-house and techno with a little of "minimal".
2007: that plus deep house.

It all felt like a natural evolution of tastes to me and I could swear I did not actively try to jump into any bandwagon - but the way it fits the trends in the scene from 2002 onwards is remarkable. When I came into these boards everyone liked epic trance, I listened to it. Then progressive was the cool thing and I listened to it. Then... you get the point.

There are natural reasons for it:
- My taste in contemporary music depends on what music is released. If there's tons of tech-house right now, it's more likely i'll end up browsing tech-house samples.
- People recommending stuff. If the cool thing is tech-house now, everyone on TA will recommend tech-house tracks. I'll end up liking some.
- Out of plain habit and getting bored of things. My ears are simply trained to listen to mostly 4x4-loop repetitive tracks nowadays. Play me a huge stadium trance track and they'll be annoyed. 5 years ago the situation was the opposite.

And I see absolutely nothing wrong with it as a listener, as long as you keep a relatively open mind for new stuff. From the dj'ing/producer point of view, I understand they end up trying to follow the market in order to sell, so they make/play music of the current trend and end up sounding stale/unoriginal. That's the only problem.

___________________
sempre contra a corrente do jogo

quote:

Originally posted by Paradox Lost Even in the wake of this post-Armin takeover, tracklistings and mix comps from major Trance headliners generally aren't terribly dominated by Vocal Trance productions, despite them achieving some of the more positive responses.

Unfortunately, most of the post-Armin production is just as paper-thin. The entire 2007 catalog of trance is worth less than a Breeder track.

quote:

Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles I have no idea where those lyrics are from, but I agree that it can get really saccharine and ridiculous. The second-worst thing to happen to trance was the introduction of lyrics. The worst was the insertion of two-minute-plus breakdowns in damn near every track. The emotional content of a lot of vocal trance makes me think of cheesy '80s hair metal. And a number of trance tracks even use wailing distorted guitars in an '80s-ish vein, further cementing the association. *Gag.*

I'm pretty sure it's: Luminary- Amsterdam

In regards to cheesy 80's metal, we can at least look back, laugh, and continue to enjoy it in a deliberately campy sense, but many look on these Vocal Trance productions and take them that seriously.

Perhaps we'll see this trend with Vocal Trance...

quote:

Originally posted by Cobalt Unfortunately, most of the post-Armin production is just as paper-thin.

No major disagreements there, but insofar as its Vocal incarnations are concerned, I don't think it's integrated itself so broadly as to be the immediate association that comes with the genre.

However, whether or not these productions are an overall minority in the larger spectrum of tracks, they sadly happen to make the most noise.

Last edited by Paradox Lost on Dec-19-2007 at 10:25

quote:

Originally posted by noikeee It all felt like a natural evolution of tastes to me and I could swear I did not actively try to jump into any bandwagon - but the way it fits the trends in the scene from 2002 onwards is remarkable. When I came into these boards everyone liked epic trance, I listened to it. Then progressive was the cool thing and I listened to it. Then... you get the point.

I wish my struggles were as cleanly linear. I could survive the Great Progressive Slowdown. I could even survive the Arminization of Trance, by clinging to the fragments of progressive and techno that appealed to me. But I was totally lost when electro-house took over, and numb by the time minimal captured the crown. I find bits and pieces here and there -- Ame, Agoria, Tiger Stripes, Cobblestone Jazz -- but most of it is a wasteland to my ears. Only the rise of deep house gives me any hope, and it's a vague one at that.

I know, I know, bring out the violin. But not everyone has moved on as you have.

Cobalt do you DJ? When I started looking for music myself as opposed to getting it through the eyes of someone else, it made a profound difference in the way I listen to this music and what I like...

___________________

quote:

Originally posted by ******** Seplling don't demonstrate intelligence and educatoin - knowing does.