quote:

Originally posted by Capitalizt Institutions are very stupid then. Ameritrade executes at the lowest price EVERY TIME, and it's a flat $10.

Nah, it's a completely different system from the retail side. Perhaps a small fund could manage money using a cheap online broker, but there are other services I get with a full service broker like 1) dedicated traders, 2) free crappy sell-side research, 3) access to analysts, 4) free dinners at 5 star restaurants, 5) complimentary box seats to sports events and concerts, etc. The institutional side is where it's at yo! Nothing like having someone else pick up your tab for a lap dance and actually smiling when they do it.

I do have an ECN that I can trade on (i.e. an electronic system where I control the trade and have no personal interaction. On that system, I pay $0.0065/share.

However, when you're constantly trading millions of dollars worth of stock, using a system like Ameritrade is a joke. I'm getting fills on 20K-30K share orders all day long. It's a completely different process.

quote:

Originally posted by Krypton Why wouldn't you guys want to pay $8 a trade?

See my above response. We get a lot of other stuff included with our huge commissions. We also have brokerage relationships like this with probably 20-30 different firms, so it gets us access to a broad swatch of research and opinions which we can criticize!

Dude, I'm totally sold. I'm calling all mutual funds to see if I can get an internship or something.

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are you guys finance majors? tomorrow's going to be a huge trading day
i <3 volatility

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soulful/latin/deep house + jazz

quote:

Originally posted by mndeg are you guys finance majors? tomorrow's going to be a huge trading day i <3 volatility

I am, but it's the summer, and I've just moved into a new house. I don't have my stuff yet. Just an air mattress, a computer, and the internet.

I believe it is impossible to try to predict volatility, or market movements, like bottoms and tops. I do it the Warren Buffet Way!!

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Alright guys help me out. I need stocks. I've basically run out of stocks to look at. Give me your favorite stocks, and tell me which ones you want a valuation on. I'll give you a "intrinsic strength", which is a consensus of several algorithms, and I'll give you an "intrinsic value", which is how much I think the stock is really worth...For those that don't already know...

Go!

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Any updated view on MSFT?

Also:

KMP
PVX

Last edited by Capitalizt on Jul-29-2008 at 14:24

An update on MSFT would be nice, since it hasn't been that good to me so far.

But what im really interested in is VMW and perhaps ATVID.

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Last edited by Moongoose on Jul-29-2008 at 18:13

wtf? we're in another fed induced rally
this is ridiculous. paulson essentially IS the stock market. he himself controls trillions of dollars. he controls not only the american stock market but the price movement of stock markets WORLDWIDE.
I was right look at the video below. they are propping up equities so financials can issue secondaries.

http://finance.yahoo.com/tech-ticker/article/43428/%27Profound-Implications%27-Govt.-Intervention-Good-in-the-Short-Term-Lousy-for-the-Long-Run?tickers=FNM,FRE,JPM,BAC,WFC,C,XLF

it's time to go long.

warren buffet is often the bagholder for years, going underwater up to 50%. averaging down with massive amounts of money.

the numbers don't even matter now. we're in that strange fed induced rally time where WB and WM can report terrible earnings but the market will still rally hard.

---

MER heavily diluted their stock today and it's up.worse than expected earnings by WM and WB and they rally 30%+ in two days. all of a sudden the stock market isn't a true indicator of the health of a company and the economy. i'm just going to play along

look at $vix (cboe volatility index) for today 6/29/08 today was highly volatile with a very quick 2% (HUGE) gain on the S&P500 and across the board and volatility DROPPED.

i'm checking again 7/16, 7/22, 7/29 all huge up days had the vix drop by large amounts, I can't find this happening anywhere in recent S&P history

I wonder if I will ever get to witness such large scale market manipulation in my lifetime again. ima get mah gumint cheese.

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soulful/latin/deep house + jazz

Last edited by mndeg on Jul-30-2008 at 04:56

Personally, I believe all naked short sells should be made illegal.

quote:

SEC extends restrictions on short-selling Wednesday July 30, 12:54 am ET By Richard Jacobsen, Associated Press Writer SEC extends restrictions on short selling of Fannie, Freddie, others through Aug. 12 Federal regulators on Tuesday extended through mid-August a temporary order banning a certain kind of short-selling of the stocks of mortgage finance companies Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac and 17 large investment banks. The Securities and Exchange Commission said the ban on so-called "naked" short selling will be in effect until 11:59 p.m. EDT on Aug. 12 and will not be extended. Short sellers make a bet that a stock's price will fall so that they can profit from it. They borrow shares of the stock and sell them. If the price drops, they buy cheaper actual shares to cover the borrowed ones, pocketing the difference. "Naked" short selling occurs when sellers don't even borrow the shares before selling them, and then look to cover positions immediately after the sale. The SEC order requires short sellers to actually borrow shares before selling them. SEC Chairman Christopher Cox said the order was also helping prevent potential "distort and short" manipulation of stocks, which occurs when rumors and misinformation are used to drive down the price of a stock that has been sold short. "In addition to continuing the existing order against naked short selling, the commission will continue exploring other remedies for the broader marketplace to further protect investors from 'distort and short' artists," Cox said in a statement. The SEC said that extending the restrictions on short selling will allow regulators more time to collect and analyze data on the order's impact and effectiveness. After ban runs out, regulators will move to draw up formal rules to provide additional protections against abusive naked short selling in the broader market, while allowing legitimate short selling, the SEC said. Advocates for smaller banks and investment firms have been urging the SEC to expand the ban on naked short selling to cover additional financial companies. Analysts and government regulators blamed aggressive short selling for exacerbating the recent plunge in Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac's stock, as well as that of big investment house Lehman Brothers Holdings Inc. The SEC initially announced the emergency order on July 15 after a perilous slide in shares of Fannie and Freddie, the government-sponsored companies that together hold or guarantee more than $5 trillion in home mortgages -- nearly half the U.S. total. The regulators' move followed a 13 percent drop in the price of Fannie shares and a 22 percent plunge in Freddie's on July 10, when a news report said the government had begun contingency planning in the event the companies failed. The next day, Freddie shares plummeted 33 percent at one point and Fannie stock lost 29 percent of its value.

http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/080730/sec_short_selling.html

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quote:

Originally posted by Krypton Personally, I believe all naked short sells should be made illegal. http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/080730/sec_short_selling.html

You're speaking about something that you obviously aren't well versed in.

Naked shorting (as the SEC is framing it) has never been legal. They have simply outlawed something that was already outlawed.

Naked shorting by a market maker is a different concept which has only served to add liquidity and order to a complex and fast-moving market place.

Now people are crying to re-implement the uptick rule, but to make it a 12-tick rule or something completely outrageous. How about instituting a downtick rule to prevent manic run-ups in stocks, eh?