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| quote: |
CROATIAN NAZIS THE WORST MONSTERS THE WORLD HAD KNOWN
They outdid German Nazi and Italian fascists |
Well, I guess you should like us then, right? Unfortunately for you, Croatian nazis were defeated by Croatian communists.
| quote: | | Serbs have more than valid historical reason NOT TO TRUST Croat or Muslim "democracy". What they were suffering during World War II is so gruesome and far beyond description. |
That is a pretty common serbian nationalistic claim that modern Croatia is a direct descendant of NDH. While it is true that some of the top Croatian politicians did infact sympathize with the former state, the modern Croatia is constructed upon the 1974 Yugoslavian constitution which allowed for every federal republic the right to break away, as well as its borders are ones defined by the 1943 AVNOJ council in Jajce. What is interesting at this point is that the very Chetnik movement that is so opposed to modern day Croatia has infact allied itself with NDH to cooperate against Tito's partizans because they, like Ustashe, sympathized Hitler.
| quote: | | The Western press carefully avoids to talk about recent history of the region. It denies the Serbs of Croatia and Bosnia the REAL MOTIVE for their current fear and struggle. This is because it clashes with the claim that, somehow, Serbs of these geographical regions were pushed by Belgrade autocrat Miloshevich to "rebel" against "newly born democracies". |
What real motive? If it weren't for Milosevic, Yugoslavia would still be in one piece now. If anyone started building up on nationalism first, it was Serbia. Croatia soon answered with its own nationalism, but it was Milosevic who demanded to end the federation system and to fully unify the country and to strip the states of any rights. The original response to that request by Croatian side was to convert Yugoslavia into a confederacy. Only after Milosevic insisted on carrying out his agenda did Tudjman win the elections in Croatia as a counter-nationalist.
| quote: | REFERENCE #1:
For decades Encyclopedia Britannica had the following sentence when talking about WWII in Yugoslavia
(Quote):
"...IN BOSNIA...THE CROATIAN FASCISTS BEGAN A MASSACRE OF SERBS WHICH, IN THE WHOLE ANNALS OF WORLD WAR II, WAS SURPASSED FOR SAVAGERY ONLY BY THE MASS EXTERMINATION OF POLISH JEWS"!!!!!!!!
(End quote)
One can find the sentence in the versions of Britannica from 1971 to 1986 (entry: Yugoslavia, World War II). Probably at later editions too...
We believe you have heard about suffering of Polish Jews. There you have the comparison!!!
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REFERENCE #2:
The New Encyclopedia Britannica, Volume 27, Macropedia (Knowledge in Depth), edition 1986, page 467, entry: Fascism in the Balkans (1930's)
Quote:
RADICAL FASCIST movements developed in some Balkan countries - MOST PROMINENTLY IN CROATIA,... they were OBSESSED by an extremist spirit of terroristic violence in a strange union with RELIGIOUS FANATICISM. As result of German victory the Croatian USTASHE, a party under the leadership of Ante Pavelic (1889-1959), turned Croatia into a state on the model of the MOST EXTREMIST NATIONAL Socialist Party formation, the SS, or Schutzstaffel,...
The Ustashe persecuted and killed hundreds of thousands of Orthodox Serbs and Jews. Catholic monks and other priests are alledged to have taken an active part in this STRUGGLE FOR THE "PURITY" OF THE CROATIAN LAND...
(End quote).
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REFERENCE #3:
Encyclopaedia Britannica, 15th Edition (1991 - i.e. still before Western anti-Serb propaganda campaign started) Macropaedia, Vol. 29, page 1111
Quote:
In Croatia [in 1941] the indeginous fascist regime set about a policy of "racial purification" that went beyond even Nazi practices. Minority groups such as Jews and Gypsies were to be eliminated as were the Serbs: it was declared that one-third of the Serbian population would be deported, one-third converted to Roman Catholicism, and one third liquidated. ... Ustasha bands terrorized the countryside. The partial [sic!] collaboration of the Catholic clergy in these practices continues to be a component of Serb-Croat suspicion.
(End quote).
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REFERENCE #4:
1945 Britannica book of the year, page 216, entry: Croatia
Quote:
Few regimes under German control had committed SO MANY CRUEL ACTS AS CROATIA DID. Serbs and Jews were persecuted and many of them murdered.
(End quote).
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REFERENCE #5:
Worldmark Encyclopedia of the Nations, Europe, edition 1995, page 91, entry: Croatia
Quote:
Slavko Kvaternik (the second in command to the Croatian WWII fuehrer, Dr Ante Pavelic) explained (on the day of formation of the WWII "Independent State of Croatia", on April 10, 1941) HOW PURE CROATIA SHOULD BE BUILT - by forcing one third of the Serbs to leave Croatia, one third to convert to Catholicism, and one third to be EXTERMINATED. Soon Ustasha bands initiated a BLOODY ORGY of mass murder of Serbs unfortunate enough not to have converted or left Croatia on time. THE ENORMITY OF SUCH CRIMINAL BEHAVIOR SHOCKED EVEN THE CONSCIENCE OF GERMAN COMMANDERS, but Pavelic had Hitler's personal support for such actions which resulted in the loss of the lives of hundreds of thousands of Serbs in Croatia and Bosnia and Herzegovina. In addition, the Ustasa regime organized extermination camps, the most notorious one at JASENOVAC where Serbs, Jews, Gypsies, and other opponents were massacred in large numbers.
(End quote)
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REFERENCE #6:
Encyclopedia of the Holocaust, Vol 1, page 323, entry: Croatia
Quote:
CROATIA (Nazavisna Drzava Hrvatska or Independent State of Croatia, NDH) ... established during WWII, that was in existence from April 1941 to May 1945. Its area... CONSISTED OF WHAT ARE TODAY THE FEDERATIVE REPUBLIC OF CROATIA AND THE FEDERATIVE REPUBLIC OF BOSNIA AND HERZEGOVINA... Its capital was Zagreb. It had population of 6.3 million, of whom 3.3 million were Catholic Croats, 1.9 million Serbs, 700,000 Muslim..., 40,000 Jews, 30,000 Gypsies...
... Shortly after taking control, the Ustasha, WITH THE SUPPORT OF MANY CROATS, EMBARKED UPON WHAT IT CALLED "THE PURGE OF CROATIA FROM FOREIGN ELEMENTS," which had as its main purpose the ELIMINATION OF THE SERB MINORITY.
In a BRUTAL TERROR CAMPAIGN, more than half a million Serbs were killed, a quater of million expelled, and 200,000 forced to convert to Catholicism.
THE USTASHA REGIME IN CROATIA, AND PARTICULARLY THIS DRIVE IN THE SUMMER OF 1941 TO EXTERMINATE AND DISPOSSESS THE SERBS, WAS ONE OF THE MOST HORRENDOUS EPISODES OF WORLD WAR II !!!!!!!!!!
THE MURDER METHODS APPLIED BY THE USTASHA WERE EXTRAORDINARILY PRIMITIVE AND SADISTIC: thousands were hurled from mountain tops, other were beaten to death or their throats cut, entire villages were burned down, WOMEN RAPED, people sent to death marches in the middle of winter, and still others starved to death.
(End quote)
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REFERENCE #7:
The New Encyclopedia Britannica, edition 1986, Macropedia (Knowledge in Depth), Volume 27, page 467, entry: 'Fascism in the Balkans (1930's).'
Quote:
Catholic monks and other priests are alleged to have taken an active part in this struggle for the 'purity' of the Croatian land.
(End quote)
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REFERENCE #8:
Professor Helen Fein, "Accounting for Genocide - Victims and Survivors of the Holocaust," The Free Press, New York, Edition 1979, page 103
Quote:
Nonpartisan sources agree that mass genocide was authorized by the state of Croatia. They concur that the state instigated, planned, and executed massacres against the Serbian Orthodox minority... and that the Catholic clergy approved, led, or failed to denounce these massacres. The Croats' collective hatred of the Orthodox Serbs was explicit in folk sayings such as ["Srbe o vrbe" -] "Serbs to the willows [hang the Serbs]." ...
By June 1941, signs on public establishments read, 'NO SERBS, JEWS, NOMADS ['Gypsies'] AND DOGS ALLOWED.
(End quote)
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REFERENCE #9:
"Partisans and Guerillas, W.W.II," Ronald H. Bailey, Time-Life Books, Edition 1978, page 87.
Quote:
The real ruler [of W.W.II Croatia] was Ante Pavelich, a zealous Croatian nationalist and fanatical hater of Serbs... Pavelic lead a terrorist group called the Ustashi in a brutal campaign against Jews and Serbs in Croatia.
"A good Ustashi," he told his men, "is he who can use his knife to cut a child from the womb of its mother." According to an Italian correspondent, Pavelich once put a wicker basket on his desk - filled with 40 pounds of eyes gourged from victims of the Ustashi.
(End quote)
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REFERENCE #10:
Professor Edmond Paris, "Genocide in Satellite Croatia, 1941- 1945," Chicago, 1961, The American Institute for Balkan Affairs, from the introduction of the book.
Quote:
The greatest genocide during World War II, in proportion to a nation's population, took place, not in Nazi Germany but in the Nazi-created puppet state of Croatia. There, in the years 1941-1945, some 750,000 Serbs, 60,000 Jews and 26,000 Gypsies - men, women and children - perished in a gigantic holocaust. These are the figures used by most foreign authors, especially Germans, who were in the best position to know...
The magnitude and the bestial nature of these atrocities makes it difficult to believe that such a thing could have happened in an allegedly civilized part of the world.
(End quote)
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REFERENCE #11:
Herman Naubacher, Hitler's personal assistant for the South-East Europe and the Balkan affairs, in his book "Sonderauftrag Sudosten 1940-1945. Bericht eines fliegenden Diplomate", Gottingen, 1956, on page 31, writes:
Quote:
The Orthodox recipe of Ante Pavelic, Ustashi leader and Croatian Fuehrer, reminds one of the religious wars in the bloodest aspects: one-third must become Catholic, one-third must leave the country and one-third must die. The last item was executed. When the leading men of the Ustashi movement are stating that they have slaughtered ONE MILLION Serbs (including infants, children, women and aged) this in my opinion is a self-praising exaggeration. According to the reports that have reached me, my estimate is that the number of those defenseless slaughtered is some THREE QUARTER OF A MILLION. [=750,000]
(End quote)
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REFERENCE #12:
[Italian] Alfio Russo, in his book "Revoluzione in Jugoslavia", Roma 1944
Quote:
Even the most extraordinary massacres in the darkest era of history would not soil its name - Croatia... Kill, kill, scream the Ustashi against Serbs. And they cut their heads off and throw bodies away into the Sava river which flows slowly and gravely in the direction of Belgrade...
Go back to your motherland, go back to your motherland.
Neither Fascists nor Nazi have the remotests resemblance to the Ustashi, they are a fauna absolutely extraordinary and strange...
(End quote)
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REFERENCE #13:
Baron Avro Manhattan, "The Vatican's Holocaust," Ozark Books, 1986, page 54
Quote:
The Nazis had records of massacres of their own second to none. Yet the horrors committed by Pavelic's Ustashi troops proved to be of such bestiality as to shock even them: a most crushing evidence that the Ustashi massacres had surpassed ANYTHING experienced even by the Germany of Hitler. The magnitude of the butchery can best be gauged by the fact that within the first three months, from April to June, 1941, 120,000 people perished thus. Proportionately to its duration and the smallness of the territory, it had been the greatest massacre to take place ANYWHERE in the West prior to, during, or after that greatest of cataclysms, the Second World War.
(End quote)
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REFERENCE #14:
Dr. Nora Levin, "The Holocaust - The destruction of European Jewry 1933 - 1945," Schocken Books, New York, Edition 1973, page 515
Quote:
The Ustashi murdered and tortured Jews and Serbs in indescribably bestial fashion. One of the most notorious camps in Hitler's Europe, Jasenovac, was in Croatia. Here the Ustashi used primitive implements in putting their victims to death - knives, axes, hammers and other iron tools. A characteristic method was binding pairs of prisoners, back to back, and then throwing them into the Sava River. One source estimates that 770,000 Serbs, 40,000 Gypsies and 20,000 Jews were done to death in the Jasenovac camp.
(End quote)
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REFERENCE #15:
Encyclopedia of the Holocaust, Vol 2, page 739
Quote:
JASENOVAC, the largest concentration camp in Croatia. Jasenovac was in fact a complex of several subcamps, in close proximity to each other, on the bank of Sava river... established in August 1941 and was dismantled only on April 1945...
SOME SIX HUNDRED THOUSAND PEOPLE WERE MURDERED AT JASENOVAC, MOSTLY SERBS JEWS, GYPSIES, AND OPPONENTS OF THE USTASHA REGIME... The living conditions in the camp were extremely severe... a particularly CRUEL regime, and UNBELIEVABLY CRUEL BEHAVIOR BY THE USTASHE GARDS.
(End quote)
A photograph that accompanies the text shows a smiling Ustasha in uniform with large "U" on its cap. The caption says (quote): "The former priest Miroslav Filipovic-Majstorovic, a member of the Jasenovac camp staff". In the text, later, it adds that this was one of the cruelest murderers, "who killed scores of prisoners with his own hands"... He was known as "Father Devil".
At different places in encyclopediae it is said how Croats participated EN MASSE in the slaughter. Actually, per capita, Croatia produced more soldiers then Nazi Germany. They tried, wery hard, to prove that CROATS ARE THE BEST NAZI OF THEM ALL! They were the best carriers of Hitler's New World Order.
CROATIA WAS THE FIRST NAZI STATE IN WORLD WAR II EUROPE TO DECLARE WAR ON THE U.S. While Nazi Germany did it in 1943, Croats did it as early as December 15, 1941.
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REFERENCE #16:
And who joined Nazi Croats in slaughtering the Serbs? You've guessed it: The Muslims!
Encyclopedia of the Holocaust, Edition 1990, Volume 2, Pages 706 and 707, entry Husseini, Hajj Amin Al ; The main Hitler's supporter among Palestinian Arabs...
Quote:
It so happened that Husseini made his contribution to the Axis war effort in his capacity as a Muslim, rather than as an Arab leader, by recruiting and organizing in RECORD TIME, during the spring of 1943, BOSNIAN MUSLIM BATTALIONS in Croatia comprising some TWENTY THOUSAND MEN, These MUSLIM VOLUNTEER units, called Hanjar (Sword), were put in WAFFEN-SS fought Yugoslav partisans in Bosnia, and carried out police and security duties in Hungary. THEY PARTICIPATED IN THE MASSACRE OF CIVILIANS IN BOSNIA and VOLUNTEERED TO JOIN IN THE HUNT FOR JEWS IN CROATIA... The Germans made a point of publicizing the fact that Husseini had flown from Berlin to Sarajevo for the sole purpose of giving his blessing to the Muslim army and inspecting its arms and training exercises.
(End quote).
A photograph, on page 704, shows al-Husseini inspecting Muslim troops in Bosnia.
TWENTY THOUSAND (20,000) Muslim volunteers for the Nazi SS - out of total population of 700,000 - that's a HUGE response.
Nazi Ustashe succeded in murdering more than third out of more than two million Serbs that got under thir hands in Croatia and Bosnia in WWII. Some 200,000 Serbs were forcefully converted to Catholicism. |
Wait, so what's your point? You like fascists, right? You like Serbs, right? You don't like muslims, although they were fascists? You don't like fascist Croatians although they ultimately allied themselves with fascist Serbs? Interesting.
| quote: | Yes, you say, but it was 50 years ago...
What happened next is that Communist dictator Tito, supported (and sometimes supplied with arms and ammunition) by Britain and USA got to control Yugoslavia. He served as a useful puppet in a buffer zone against the Soviet block. |
How was he a puppet of anybody? At first he was partially under the control of the Soviet Union, but after that he broke away and formed the block of countries that were neutral in regards to the cold war main opponents.
| quote: | | Tito, himself a CROAT, butchered Yugoslavia into six (so called) "Federative Republics". |
Hmm, let's see here. And how many regions did the Kraljevina SHS have? About the same number? Ok, then, let's move on...
| quote: | | He was sure to chop the largest nation, the Serbs, into four republics. And Republic of Serbia, itself, was the only one to be further divided (into three pieces: Vojvodina, Kosovo and "Serbia proper"). Some 42% of Serbs got to live outside "Serbia proper". And that is the CRUX of today's problem. (For the above numbers look at: Paul Shoup "Communism and the Yugoslav National Question". Columbia, 1968). |
Now, let's see the map of ethnic buildup in Yugoslavia:
While it is true that a large portion of Serbian territory did infact live outside of mainland Serbia, the same can be said for Croatia. Additionally, if you look at Kosovo, you will see that it is a Serbian region although the Serbs there are a total minority. And finally, he didn't chop Serbia into 4 parts because although ethnic Serbs lived in those areas, those areas never were an integral part of Serbia.
| quote: | | Next, the Croatian Communist dictator ordered Croatian and Muslim genocide of the Serbs to be forgotten - and new "Brotherhood and Unity" (under Communist dictatorship) to begin. The mountain pits where whole Serbian villages were hurled into - were cemented!!! And surviving Serbs were ordered NOT to come to the mass graves and morn their dead. |
What what what? So who built those huge monuments in places of Croatian concentration camps?
The only people whose deaths were not mourned were those of ustashas and chetniks who were killed when they tried to flee to Austria.
| quote: | | Some Ustashe Croats and Muslims got (usually small) positions in the new government. |
Hahaha, this is totally rediculous. The whole country ideology was based upon the hatred of nazis and those who colaborated with them, including ustashas and chetniks.
| quote: | | Their Nazi elite (including the above mentioned Croatian fuhrer Pavelic) ESCAPED through Vatican organized "rat channels". Croatian priesthood was instrumental in helping some 50,000 worst European Nazi escape justice. |
Just btw, you hate muslims but like catholics, right? Ok, thought so.
| quote: | | The whole operation was done with full knowledge of British and American intelligence. The fascist murderers were proclaimed new "freedom fighters" against the Red Flood. Many got positions in State Department (as special advisers) and other government institutions. (The files describing the operation were declasified resently. To learn more read recently published book "Unholy Trinity", by Mark Aarons and John Loftus. (Mr Loftus worked in the U.S. Justice Department in its Nazi-hunting unit). |
Yeah, well, they mostly escaped to neutral countries in South America. Like many Germans did as well. I doubt it that Americans and Brits actively helped them out though. Especially since they supported Tito.
| quote: | | And the Serbs stuck to their Christian tradition and did not seek revenge. |
Yup. Until Milosevic came.
| quote: | | They thought that the bloody episode will never repeat. But the Ustasha elite in South and North America, Australia, immediately started to organize dreaming of good old days... |
That is true.
| quote: | | The Serbs in many cases intermarried and started a new life. This is what the Western press calls today "the ideal multiethnicity and tolerance of ex-Communist Yugoslavia. So WHO WAS THE TOLERANT ONE? The murderer or his next door surviving victim - the Serb? |
Well, if anyone was tolerant, it was the newly installed multiethnic government, because let's not forget that chetniks also had a lot of blood on their hands.
| quote: | | Then came collapse of the Yugoslav economy (induced by the U.S.) and the rats came back home. Under THE SAME USTASHI FLAG (and giving the same threat speaches to the remaining Serbs). |
The collapse of the economy started in the early 80's mostly as a result of oil crisis. And it was not the same flag. Let's take a look at Croatian flags through history:
1848-1867
1867-1918
1918-1941
1941-1945
1945-1990
1990-
The checkerboard is a standard croatian coat of arms that was included on some flags. It was always a standard coat of arms of Croatia, although often in slightly different forms.
| quote: | | Dr. Franjo Tudjman, holocaust revisionist and apologizer for Hitler - won the first elections for new "democratic" Independent State of Croatia. With good suport of money he got from the Ustasha emigration. The hell broke loose! |
Well, yes, partially correct, but although he tolerated pro-ustashe elements in the society, he never supported Hitler.
| quote: | | Today, Muslims and Croats, are once again united. They were united under Hitler. They were (forcefully!) united by Bill Clinton. Hating each other with racist passion, their only common goal is (once again) to slaughter and expel the remaining Serbs. This is done under supervision of "neutral" UN, EC, US, NATO,... Under watchful "unbiased" CNN, ABC, BBC,... |
Umm, yes...that's why we're rebuilding houses for serbian refugees who want to come back now.
| quote: | American bombers can bomd Christian children as much as they want. American media can claim whatever they damn please. The Western "intellectuals" are absorbing all the Nazi propaganda without question.
What ever happened to: COGITO ERGO SUM! (I *THINK* therefore I exist). Is the term "Western intellectual" an oxymoron? Can you please check the above quotes? Can you see the obvious? |
Eh, whatever. The whole world is against Serbia. And all they're trying to do is to claim every bit of land where there are Serbs living or where they once used to live. Gdje je srbin, tu je Srbija! And let's not forget how Seselj demanded that the Croatian border be reduced to the Virovitica-Karlovac-Karlobag triangle. And he had the support of about 30% of the population.
| quote: | | But the last ETHNIC CLEANSING of the remaining Serbs in Croatia and one half of Bosnia-Herzegovina - was done by "democrat" BILL CLINTON with help of NATO force. At the same time the Western media had audacity to blame the Serbs for "Ethnic clensing" and even "self-cleansing"!!!!!! |
Because the Serbs did commit ethnic cleansing just as well as other nations did.
| quote: | | It proves, once again, that a copy can never be as good as the original. ORIGINAL NAZIS WERE BETTER. At least they were honest to say, the FIRST DAY, what they planed to do with Jews, Serbs, other Slavs. Today's Nazi are covering their act calling it "democracy", "peace"... |
Then why won't you admit for Serbian attempts at ethnic cleansing.
| quote: | | The replica of the USTASHA FLAG FREELY FLIES in front of the United Nations. |
Well, if that's Ustasha flag, then the modern Serbian flag is equal to Chetnik flag.
[img]http://images.google.com/images?q=tbn:beCa0oSi-iYJ:http://abrasevic-valjevo.org.yu/zastava_srbija.gif[/img]
| quote: | | It flies freely IN JASENOVAC, ABOVE THE MASS GRAVE OF SOME 600,000 VICTIMS. Do you see a better sarcasm!? On May 1st, 1995 Croatian army, carring Ustasha symbols and flags, broke through the UN lines. They did it at will. They did it with the knowledge and support of Washington. They flooded so called "United Nations Protected Zone - West". The Serbs were ordered by the "international community", well in advance, to disarm and put their heavy weapons under UN supervision. Just days before, under Croatian "pressure", the zones were renamed to UNCRO = United Nations Confidence Restauration Operation. What a sarcasm!!! What a crime! |
Well, maybe because Jasenovac is a part of Croatian territory defined in 1943 and agreed upon by Serbs at the time?
| quote: | | Ustasha tanks went over civillians. Women and children were machinegunned. A few thousand were murdered in cold blood. The New York Times (and alike Big Brother Trumpets) praised "liberation" of part of Croatia... There was also a short note that Croatian police did not let newspapermen in for couple a days and that the whole area stunk of chlorine. The roads were hozed but still pools of blood were visible... |
Of course there is blood when there was fighting going on. As for any civilian casualties, that's why Hague tribunal is for. And we're cooperating with it much better than you are.
| quote: | | At least, that time, for some reason, the Serbs were not blamed for that particular genocide. The front page of the New York Times carried a story of how (aledgedly) Serbs fired two rockets with cluster bombs to Zagreb. The rockets killed two people, the story says. The front page shows a body. A lady lies on the main street, face down, in chrystal clear white coat. A bus is in the background. All window panes intact. The Serbs have amazing rockets. Cluster rockets at that. |
Look, moron, I was fucking living here when those rockets were fired and I remember them damn correctly. And the serbs admitted they fired those rockets.
| quote: | | And here is the sarcastic result of NATO-Croatian-Nazi genocide of the last year: The leader of the Croatian Serbs is declaired a war criminal.... And no Croat. |
NATO-Croatian-Nazi? Interesting. I guess that if the article was newer you'd also add up muslims into that mix. Nevertheless, there are like 20 or so Croats sitting in Hague as convicts, so that is again a totally false claim.
| quote: | | Today, Nazi Croatia is the MOST ETHNICALLY PURE COUNTRY OF EUROPE. Hitler and Pavelic must be laughing in their graves. |
Eh? Although minorities reach about 15% of the population???
| quote: | | There will be no justice in the Hague Kangaroo Court. But would there be enough room for all the souls of the "democratic West" that were the architects of the Yugoslav tragedy? |
Right. No serbs comitted war crimes. And the whole world has accused those 50 or so serbian guys just out of fun.
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1+1=10
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Nathan Fake - Outhouse (Valentino Kanzyani Remix) 
