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Originally posted by Q5echo no, you lost an argument and your pride has told you to deny and obfuscate.

Says you? LOL

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your tenuous grasp on history has failed to point out that we supported Castro and did little to intervene his rise to power. in fact, our first embargo in 1958 was an arms embargo so Batista wouldn't escalate conflict at our cost. we formally recognized the new Castro government you moron. until he completely screwed the people and now he treats them like caged animals.

What are referring to by all this?

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and guess what, JFK, the liberal Jesus, was a Democrat not a Neocon

When did I say Kennedy was a neocon? Let's not attribute arguments I havn't even made..

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FFS you kids that think that youre getting a formal education and you know everthing and can't be told you're wrong are really getting on my nerves

Sorry if we don't believe in police actions as foreign policy..

and your "tenuous grasp" of history is limited to what comes from the Bush Doctrine. I'm gonna keep shoving in your faces the founding fathers philosophy so you realize this is not where we are at today..Thus, principles will prevail in this argument, not fallacies..

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Originally posted by Krypton Thus, principles will prevail in this argument, not fallacies..

...says the guy who can't defend Castro weak.

your priviledges to invoke the Founding Fathers has been hereby revoked.

i mean these are the same guys who rounded up an entire army to put down the whiskey rebellion, and you think they'd handle what Castro did to us in 1960 with diplomacy? nigga please

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Originally posted by Q5echo ...says the guy who can't defend Castro weak. your priviledges to invoke the Founding Fathers has been hereby revoked. i mean these are the same guys who rounded up an entire army to put down the whiskey rebellion, and you think they'd handle what Castro did to us in 1960 with diplomacy? nigga please

Sorry I use the truth of the principles our country was founded on. I guess true freedom goes against your neocon philosophy.

You respond to an act of war with an equivalent defense. Are you trying to attribute to me the argument that diplomacy should be 100% used even when attacked? Are you crazy??

You have a mad habit of applying arguments that havn't been made, especially your assumption that I'm defending Castro. I opposing foreign interference in other state's internal affairs. Get it right..

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As for armies..........

Don't forget that even the proud Romans marched on Rome.

The question is... how close is too close?

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Originally posted by Krypton You have a mad habit of applying arguments that havn't been made, especially your assumption that I'm defending Castro. I opposing foreign interference in other state's internal affairs. Get it right..

Yes, we know you're a libertarian. As such, feel free to move to Switzerland anytime. It's a beautiful country. Geneva is one of my favorite cities in the world - very cultural, educated, scenic, and pleasant. Most importantly for you the Swiss are neutral.

The question is what will you do with all the extra free time on your hands once you can no longer criticize the government in which you live in?

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Originally posted by erdega America has killed millions of people in the balkans and middle east and millions more into refugees and they are still losers who can only fight defenseless people.

What ever you simple minded fock. Like your Pedo Warriors "don't hide behind women and children?

Try again

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Originally posted by Krypton I guess true freedom goes against your neocon philosophy.

no, communism goes against my Neocon philosphy as well would the Founding Fathers.

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You respond to an act of war with an equivalent defense. Are you trying to attribute to me the argument that diplomacy should be 100% used even when attacked? Are you crazy??

i seriously have no idea what youre talking about.

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You have a mad habit of applying arguments that havn't been made, especially your assumption that I'm defending Castro. I opposing foreign interference in other state's internal affairs. Get it right..

then don't make ridiculously ignorant statements like this:

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"country's like Cuba, which compares little in commodity power to the Saudi's, get embargoed specifically because of "human rights".

and prop up Castro like he's some helpless victim then denegrate your own country. and illogically using the Founding Fathers to do it as if you know ANYTHING about the Founding Fathers

call you Danny Glover from now on. ass

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Originally posted by CHRles Yes, we know you're a libertarian. As such, feel free to move to Switzerland anytime. It's a beautiful country. Geneva is one of my favorite cities in the world - very cultural, educated, scenic, and pleasant. Most importantly for you the Swiss are neutral. The question is what will you do with all the extra free time on your hands once you can no longer criticize the government in which you live in?

I will do everything in my power to keep my country from falling into the trash heap of the neo-conservative roaches that permeate Washington, and all those who support them. You serve the interests of our government. You need to realize that the government should be serving us.

The reason I speak of safe-havens is..

1. To escape the tyrannical tax code, that claims an illegal income tax, and also claims the right to tax even your assets outside the country.
2. I have a gloom n doom attitude towards the course of this nation (under neo-conservative tyranny), and I am not in the minority as you are about this view..

I plan 100% to find a second home outside of this country, and I see it as hedge against unforeseen events.

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Come to think of it, our founding fathers weren't very libertarians.
Let's see, we had numerous wars with numerous Indian tribes, we purchased Louisiana from the French, got Texas from Mexico, fought a war with Mexico, took control of the Philippines, had a civil war, and then there's the little issue of slavery. What else? Children worked in mines, chaos and lawlessness in the Wild West, the rise of the KKK. Ah, good times man, good times. Things were so much better back in the good old days...

I tell you, the days of our founding fathers were utopian. Not a care in the world, no European empires like the UK, France, Portugal, Spain, or Holland, ruling most of the world. Every country was perfect, there were no wars, the native population of Argentina didnt get completely wiped out by the white men, and....oh wait. Those things did happen, and America wasnt to blame for many of them. We just stood by and let them happen. Lovely.

Tell you what. I'm almost done building a time machine. Just gotta work out the kinks with this flux capacitor. Once I'm done I'll be happy to send you off on your merry way to 1790. We'd really like it if you could share with us your experiences of these glory days. Since no internet or electricity will be available to you, please feel free to start a journal/book depicting your libertarian life.

Last edited by CHRles on Oct-01-2007 at 01:53

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Originally posted by Q5echo no, communism goes against my Neocon philosphy as well would the Founding Fathers.

So should theocracy. You defend Saudi Arabia, then attack Castro, then say I'm defending Castro? Please..

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i seriously have no idea what youre talking about.

Im sorry, having a lil bit of amnesia?

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i mean these are the same guys who rounded up an entire army to put down the whiskey rebellion, and you think they'd handle what Castro did to us in 1960 with diplomacy? nigga please

I'm guessing your referring to the Cuban Missile crisis. Whereby I said if threatened, you respond action for action. Not pre-emptively. You didn't see the US invading full-scale in Cuba did you? Kennedy was a good man.

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then don't make ridiculously ignorant statements like this: and prop up Castro like he's some helpless victim then denegrate your own country. and illogically using the Founding Fathers to do it as if you know ANYTHING about the Founding Fathers

You don't see the hypocrisy of supporting a Wahabist regime with RELIGIOUS POLICE, but embargoing Cuba? I even showed you why we would support Saudi Arabia and not Cuba. It's all about securing our oil supply. You then tried downplaying Saudi oil, when in fact you take it out of our market, the economy would be wrecked by that alone. I smile everytime you think I actually support Cuba, when I don't. Keep trying..

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call you Danny Glover from now on. ass

I know you want war with everyone, chill, your faction is doing it in the Mid East, don't worry.

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Originally posted by CHRles Come to think of it, our founding fathers weren't very libertarians. Let's see, we had numerous wars with numerous Indian tribes, we purchased Louisiana from the French, got Texas from Mexico, fought a war with Mexico, took control of the Philippines, had a civil war, and then there's the little issue of slavery. What else? Children worked in mines, chaos and lawlessness in the Wild West, the rise of the KKK. Ah, good times man, good times. Things were so much better back in the good old days... I tell you, the days of our founding fathers were utopian. Not a care in the world, no European empires like the UK, France, Portugal, Spain, or Holland, ruling most of the world. Every country was perfect, there were no wars, the native population of Argentina didnt get completely wiped out by the white men, and....oh wait. Those things did happen, and America wasnt to blame for many of them. We just stood by and let them happen. Lovely. Tell you what. I'm almost done building a time machine. Just gotta work out the kinks with this flux capacitor. Once I'm done I'll be happy to send you off on your merry way to 1790. We'd really like it if you could share with us your experiences of these glory days. Since no internet or electricity will be available to you, please feel free to start a journal/book depicting your libertarian life.

America was founded to keep away from European wars and oppression. As a country where a minority would not be oppressed. The Constitution was written to be the final law of the land. And when I see our country doing things that run contrary to the constitution and the spirit in which it was written, I get mightily pissed. Why don't you support the enforcement of our constitution and stop supporting the Bush Doctrine??

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When was the constitution written?
It was based on some good ideas, but like fixed religion it needs to change with the times. Religion is based on good ideas, and principles that are set out to guide mankind, and give hope. The problem is over time fixed religion has been corrupted and taken to the extreme.
This is what you're doing with the constitution, and its what religious extremists do with religion.

BTW, this country is a land of immigrants. What happens in other parts of the world effects the families of the people who migrated to America. Furthermore, America is the most generous country on the face of the planet. Don't ask for proof, b/c if you don't know as much shame on you - look it up. So when we see the money that we send not going to those in need, but rather to tyrants in power, and when we see that things are further deteriorating then we try to act upon it.
Clinton did something about the situatio9n in the Balkans, and even about little Haiti. Sadly the US can't be everywhere at the same time, but yes we're the superheroes of the world. America is the lone superpower out there today, and despite all its faults is the one that tries to make the biggest positive difference on the global stage.
Can't say the same for Iran, North Korea, or Cuba. Can you?