well i dont really want to go very off topic but really these people who make minimal music nowadays dont really understand what minimal is all about. its really easy to make a minimal song than a lets say house or a trance or techno song. its like in paintings you know Picasso with his abstract paintings and matisse and all these people were doing these mad and unusual stuff but not because they couldnt draw a body of a person perfectly, they just found theyr style. A minimal music is something you have to get to its a jurney till there.
dont get me wrong i love minimal and stuff but alot of people are jumping on minimal nowadays. Luciano,Villalobos,Koze,Meyer,Lazarus,and all the other minimal masters are fuckin awesome but really you can hear a difference between theyr sounds and between the sounds that the "new guys" make and in those new guys's music something is missing, the depth is missing.
and i think that not only minimal but trance has lost its depth too, since alot of people who make music dont really spend alot of time infront of theyr music making gears, they just know the formula , throw it all together and voila they make tune that sounds technicaly very good but there are no intense emotions and thougts behind those songs.
producers nowadays dont really spend alot of times on theyr music, which is very sad imo.
i think technology has alot to do with this too, because it made making music a very easy and a fast process. people dont take the time to get to know theyr softwares or and stuff because there more and more new stuff coming out everyday so its very easy to get lost in it...
you just have to know what you want and use only the stuff that you need.

quote:

Originally posted by Mr.Mystery In a way, yes - at least if you think about the long term effects. When the next generation of music makers realise there's no quality control anymore, why would they even bother to do quality? And what happens when the current generation retires?

Quality or not, I havnt seen anything new in trance for a few years now, especially from big labels. Its time to break eggs and for trance to be given back to the people to fuck it around and re-invent it. I'm sure the older generation will still be pumping out megahits for years to come anyway. The ground for something really revolutionary that doesnt rely on commercial success is in the digital domain, not in the commercial realm of big labels. Sure, you might have to dig through a lot of yawnfull clones to get to it, but its the only way for trance to move forward.

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quote:

Originally posted by Mr.Mystery 90% of the time it does, though.

and you know this because you love digital releases so much that you have gone them all through. and you know every producer personally and know the story behind their tracks..
gimme a break with the bullshit already, you are acting like you know everything when you don't know anything.

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Originally posted by a98 and you know this because you love digital releases so much that you have gone them all through. and you know every producer personally and know the story behind their tracks.. gimme a break with the bullshit already, you are acting like you know everything when you don't know anything.

http://www.discogs.com/artist/a98




(i for one have to hear those, before i decide if your opinion is valid or not.)

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finally a good topic on here, some valid points made, my 2 cents...

Theres good side & bad sides to 'Digital Labels'

Pro's is that it can give upcoming producers the platform they need to get early releases out etc & form some profile, and also give accessibilty for tracks that might not cut the mustard for vinyl but still equally good enough for a release on download (less risks etc)

Con's of it tho is that there is a huge saturation in the market, as someone pointed out everyone is starting up 'digital labels' and theres a huge issue of quality control being overlooked by a lot of these labels. There definitely needs to be a more 'quality over quantity' if its going to get better & label bosses realising a release every 2 weeks is not doing the scene any favours!

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quote:

Originally posted by a98 and you know this because you love digital releases so much that you have gone them all through. and you know every producer personally and know the story behind their tracks.. gimme a break with the bullshit already, you are acting like you know everything when you don't know anything.

What's with the hostility, man? I know you're one of these digital "release" people, but really... there's no need for childish attitude like that.

Why would I need to know the producers personally? I've listened to tons and tons of tracks by these artists (including you) and most of the time they really do sound like 1) someone else or 2) completely amateurish. Yet, instead of giving them out for free they insist on making us pay for it.

Do you really think I'm just making crap up so I can bash someone? Feel free to disagree with me (this is an open discussion after all) but don't give me the attitude.

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Last edited by Mr.Mystery on Mar-20-2006 at 13:43

quote:

Originally posted by Akazi well i dont really want to go very off topic but really these people who make minimal music nowadays dont really understand what minimal is all about. its really easy to make a minimal song than a lets say house or a trance or techno song. its like in paintings you know Picasso with his abstract paintings and matisse and all these people were doing these mad and unusual stuff but not because they couldnt draw a body of a person perfectly, they just found theyr style. A minimal music is something you have to get to its a jurney till there. dont get me wrong i love minimal and stuff but alot of people are jumping on minimal nowadays. Luciano,Villalobos,Koze,Meyer,Lazarus,and all the other minimal masters are fuckin awesome but really you can hear a difference between theyr sounds and between the sounds that the "new guys" make and in those new guys's music something is missing, the depth is missing. and i think that not only minimal but trance has lost its depth too, since alot of people who make music dont really spend alot of time infront of theyr music making gears, they just know the formula , throw it all together and voila they make tune that sounds technicaly very good but there are no intense emotions and thougts behind those songs. producers nowadays dont really spend alot of times on theyr music, which is very sad imo. i think technology has alot to do with this too, because it made making music a very easy and a fast process. people dont take the time to get to know theyr softwares or and stuff because there more and more new stuff coming out everyday so its very easy to get lost in it... you just have to know what you want and use only the stuff that you need.

did you listen to any of those things that he linked? I found that some of them really did sound like a person spent alot of time thinking about the pieces. Occasionally I will bump into one of these internet musicians in IRC channels and stuff, and I find that they can actually be quite thoughtful people. Maybe we are just listening to different music, I am not finding formulaic tunes in the internet releases im getting nearly as much as I do in trance tunes.

I guess there is no real point in trying to convince anybody, people will think whatever they want to think, but I think you guys would be surprised about the good music out there that is free to download, and I'm just trying to share the enjoyable stuff I've been finding.

quote:

Originally posted by skip http://www.discogs.com/artist/a98 (i for one have to hear those, before i decide if your opinion is valid or not.)

those are not real releases, they are old netlabel releases that someone has for some weird reason uploaded to discogs.
for my current releases head to http://a98.subtraxx.com/
though i don't see how that has anything to do with my opinnion.

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Originally posted by Mr.Mystery What's with the hostility, man? I know you're one of these digital "release" people, but really... there's no need for childish attitude like that.

well i'm sorry, but i'm getting really tired of reading you complaining about everything in every single thread in every single board, i haven't heard anything positive from your mouth ever.
and the point was that you generalize big time even though you haven't heard much of digital releases.

and i for example worked for a remix i did for deep blue (digital release) for many many hours, days and months, and did A LOT of exports on that, and then someone comes saying that all digital releases are crap produced in few hours and with only goal getting cash.
if you think that the release of yours deep blue was going to sign was suppose to be vinyl you are way off, they are mostly signing for digital releases nowadays (unless it's really really good). so if it's so easy to get signed for digital releases, why didn't your song became one?

quote:

Why would I need to know the producers personally? I've listened to tons and tons of tracks by these artists (including you) and most of the time they really do sound like 1) someone else or 2) completely amateurish. Yet, instead of giving them out for free they insist on making us pay for it.

well you must know them, if you know that 90% of the tracks are produced with FL and they were offered to "big" labels first.
the reason for me to sign something for digital release is that because that way it gets a lot more attention and promotion for it. it's not for the money at all.

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Last edited by a98 on Mar-20-2006 at 15:08

quote:

Originally posted by Mr.Mystery Since the "releases" are digital, there are no real expenses in running a label - therefore there's no need to be selective about what you're signing whatsoever.

I disagree. If you're serious about running a label you're trying to build a reputation, a following - doesn't matter if releases are digital or on vinyl. To me it is every bit as important to be selective about my digi only releases as the vinyl ones - my name is all I've got really.

Not that I don't understand where you're coming from in this, there is too much sub-standard music coming out from the digi only lot at the mo. But all that will change soon, as these labels are being dropped one by one from the big shop sites.

quote:

Originally posted by a98 well i'm sorry, but i'm getting really tired of reading you complaining about everything in every single thread in every single board, i haven't heard anything positive from your mouth ever. and the point was that you generalize big time even though you haven't heard much of digital releases.

What do you mean I haven't? Do you really think I would had even made this thread if I hadn't heard much digital releases?

As for the other thing, people like you only see what they want to see. I help people when I can, write tutorials, do mixes from them but do you notice that? Of course not.

quote:

and i for example worked for a remix i did for deep blue (digital release) for many many hours, days and months, and did A LOT of exports on that, and then someone comes saying that all digital releases are crap produced in few hours and with only goal getting cash.

Now you're putting words in my mouth. Never did I say all digital releases are crap. I said there are certain labels that do this. For some reason you seem to be taking this as if I was accusing you of something which certainly isn't the case.

quote:

if you think that the release of yours deep blue was going to sign was suppose to be vinyl you are way off, they are mostly signing for digital releases nowadays (unless it's really really good). so if it's so easy to get signed for digital releases, why didn't your song became one?

I don't even know what this is supposed to mean. I've never even sent a demo to anyone unless they've asked for it first. When I was in contacts with Deep Blue digital releases were a very new thing and rarely anyone did those - besides, if someone offered me a deal for a digital release I would most likely turn it down because I'd rather just give my music away for free.
What does this have to do with the topic anyway?

quote:

well you must know them, if you know that 90% of the tracks are produced with FL and they were offered to "big" labels first.

I really have no idea why you assume I must "know them" to know that. Are you honestly telling me you can't tell if some average track was made in FL or Reason or whatnot? They all have a distinct sound to them, and only the artists that are good at what they do can make a track with said programs and get rid of the standard sound.

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the reason for me to sign something for digital release is that that way it gets a lot more attention and promotion for it. it's not for the money at all.

Good for you.

I really have no idea why you're being so hostile about this. I've shared my views and asked if people agree with me - I have never claimed my views to be facts nor did I mention any artist/label names directly. Yet you feel like I've insulted you personally and said all digital releases are shit by default.

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Latest releases:
Endless Cycles [Capital Heaven]
The Charlatan [Morphosis]

well it was basicly that "90% of the digital releases are crap" statement that got me going. now you say that "some of the digital labels", but 90% of the whole digital catalogue is a bit more than just some.

anyway i'm sorry if i've gotten the wrong image of you, i don't follow this forum much, but when i do that's the picture i've gotten, i apologize.
anyway i respect your opinnion on this case, sometimes people opinnions just come out a little harsh, like they are the truth or something.

digital releases are the future, weather we like it or not.
personally i think few years back they even released a lot of crap on vinyl, atleast nowadays tracks on vinyl need to be quality (unless the artist is already very known = name sells)
and if my own opinnion hasn't come clear yet, i really think respected labels, weather they are half digital or totally digital, still have high standards for the digital releases. don't let few bad releases ruin the whole new culture we are having here.
for instance, i got payed more for my digital remix to deep blue, than i got from my vinyl remix to monster tunes, so atleast that label takes digital releases seriously.

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