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Originally posted by djnitride You underestimate the number of loyal texans in the armed forces, and rednecks with tons of guns and ammunition.

Beat them once, we'll beat them again.

I'm not one to argue against the concept of succession (I support, to a point, the Cascadia Movement), however attempting to argue that a small percentage of the Armed Forces and a bunch of people who sit in a trailer all day could defeat a nuclear-backed army of 48 states is flawed from the get-go.

Edit: Plus the idea of a hardcore, red, "USA! USA! USA!" state ever wanting to leave the United States is just absurd.

Yes. The Cascadian succession movement would only be done through peaceful means. Once we have absolved ourselves from our former federal keepers though we would defend our land as would any nation.

Im pissed off that I wasted thousands of dollars on my education when I simply could’ve become a partisan hatchetman like 17sss for free and with less effort.

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Originally posted by DjWhooCares ...awaits for the 17sss rebuttal

Yeah, I was all excited for that, too.

who is this Obama man?

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Originally posted by boris_the_bear who is this Obama man?

are you saying ukraine is 100 years behind in news broadcasting, or are you just being a smart ass ?

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Originally posted by idoru Because a 2009 4Q GDP growth of 5.7%, the fastest pace in the last six years, definitely isn't an example of something getting better in the last year. Yeah, we sure fucking failed hard on improving the economy, didn't we?

Before you wet yourself over the surface numbers, read the fine print. First of all, about 65% of that number came from a slowdown in the liquidation of inventories, which means the actual growth was 2.2%.

This is the same reporting organization that estimated Q3 GDP at 3.5% growth. Later they had to revise that number downward twice, to the same 2.2% that remains in Q4 after eliminating inventory manipulation.
http://www.cnbc.com/id/35141739

The inventory accounting is a one-time deal according to the linked article, so watch for the numbers to slide back down next quarter. Housing sales were reported downward another 7.6% last month (from the 16% drop in November), foreclosures rose again last month, 48 states still have more people jobless or taking unemployment checks than each previous month (85,000 in December alone), and businesses are still not hiring.

But yeah!! Economy looks awesome!

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Originally posted by Moongoose In general people dont know whats best for them, not just americans. And sadly (for you) yes, it takes intelectuals, smart people, educated people, elite if you want to call them that to make the right calls for the rest of them. I dont want a plumber in charge of the economy, i want someone who knows whats going on. The plumbers common sense of whats best wont work very well when its time to make a choice that will effect a mass of people. On to the second point if i remember the debate correctly that 250k that youre so upset about is not the amount of money that the business brings in but the amount you yourself earn. And if i would agree that taxing a business that brings in more than 250k a year would be ridiculous taxing an individual who brings in more than 250 a year is perfectly reasonable.

No, politicians are elected to represent those who put them in office, not decide on their own once in office what they deem is "best for them". That's not how a representative republic works. And, yes the taxing does apply to business who bring in a gross profit of $250K.

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How about republicans loosing a seat that hasnt been held by a democrat since the civil war...that has got to hurt and has to mean something as well. And everyone of his agendas lacks majority support? Seriously? Because i could name a few that are very popular.

Is that really as big as Massachusetts having Ted Kennedy's seat go to a Republican 6 months after his death, in the bluest state? Or as big as Republican governors getting elected in two states that went heavily in Obama's favor? Obama went to all 3 states to campaign for the Democrats and it had the reverse effect.

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Seriously, lay off the drugs. Peslosi and Reid radicals? What have they done that is remotely radical? On their best of days they are at most centre left.

LOL! You've lost it... officially. Check voting records for god's sake.

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And yes people dont like whats being presented now...they did like what was being presented in the beginning though...before it was butchered and watered down to appease the republicans for some hope of bipartisanship. Which was doomed to fail from the beginning anyway...the dems should know by now that thats not the game the republicans play.

"Bipartisanship" for Democrats means nothing more than Republicans making the concessions. Tell me who the John McCain of the Democrat party is, that walks across the aisle on the regular? Once upon a time Joe Leiberman was that guy, but he got booted from his own party and had to run as in Independant to get re-elected.

Fiscal Republicans are just like their religious base, everything is based on blind faith and not in the real world. Its pointless to argue with people like Kevin because they live in a dream world where they expect it will be like their lives and everything can be handed to them and they wont have to pay for anything.

Yep. Thats true. They want to have all the good parts of government like a strong national defense and the public services they think are useful but they don't want to spend a penny of their own money on it.

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Originally posted by Joss Weatherby Fiscal Republicans are just like their religious base, everything is based on blind faith and not in the real world. Its pointless to argue with people like Kevin because they live in a dream world where they expect it will be like their lives and everything can be handed to them and they wont have to pay for anything. Yep. Thats true. They want to have all the good parts of government like a strong national defense and the public services they think are useful but they don't want to spend a penny of their own money on it.

Sorry Nou, but you're projecting now. I've been where you are... with textbooks, media, and 15 years or so of academia being 99% of my understanding of life. But I have graduated from that insulated life and live/work in the real world. I own a business and I am responsible for the livlihood of several employees. You have no fucking clue what that's like. And I put in the time to be where I am... never took a dime from anyone, or expeced it. But you understand better than me about real responsibility and business and how to live in the real world right?

Usually you're pretty cool but I take exception to your statement that "I expect everything to be handed to me and shouldn't have to pay for anything"; that is much more along the lines of what a welfare case who "expects" free health care, free unemployment checks for 92 weeks, and so on. I am the complete opposite of that. I pay my motherfucking taxes and I fully understand the importance of doing so to support an effective government. What I don't like is an ever increasing tax burden that kills my ability to grow my business... which would allow me to provide more jobs for people. I feel sorry for you man. Time to move out of mom's basement.

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Originally posted by The17sss Sorry Nou, but you're projecting now. I've been where you are... with textbooks, media, and 15 years or so of academia being 99% of my understanding of life. But I have graduated from that insulated life and live/work in the real world. I own a business and I am responsible for the livlihood of several employees. You have no fucking clue what that's like. And I put in the time to be where I am... never took a dime from anyone, or expeced it. But you understand better than me about real responsibility and business and how to live in the real world right? Usually you're pretty cool but I take exception to your statement that "I expect everything to be handed to me and shouldn't have to pay for anything"; that is much more along the lines of what a welfare case who "expects" free health care, free unemployment checks for 92 weeks, and so on. I am the complete opposite of that. I pay my motherfucking taxes and I fully understand the importance of doing so to support an effective government. What I don't like is an ever increasing tax burden that kills my ability to grow my business... which would allow me to provide more jobs for people. I feel sorry for you man. Time to move out of mom's basement.

You are also from the South.

My father is a business owner (well he is a full partner in his law firm) and you know, he has never complained. He also has employees to take care of. He gladly votes every every school bond, votes solidly blue (though he does support bi-party candidates for state AG), votes down public initiatives for tax reform laws that screw the state, and makes probably more than you can imagine, but feels a social responsibility to give back as much as he needs to and not complain. If anything he complains that not as much is given back and we live in Washington State. For disclosures sake, he does represent public institutions (though his practice is private), and in turn directly benefits from them being payed more, because that means they can afford his firms legal skills.

Anyway, you claim that you want the government to support your growth of business, but you'd strike down things like health care reform that would potentially allows businesses to save lots of money on providing health care for their employees (you do that right, I am not sure, I mean North Carolina, they seem like the type to fuck their employees, I mean, they are just employees right?).

Also if you are that heavily burdened by the government then you are probably not doing something right someplace else or your fears are unfounded and actually not a real issue.