I'm afraid I don't know what you are referring to. To you have any info. on the subject and seminars?

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Originally posted by MisterOpus1 I'm afraid I don't know what you are referring to. To you have any info. on the subject and seminars?

Yeah sounds interesting but would be moreso in the details, let's know what it was all about girllovingtvibe if you get any info. By the way UT might be going there for gradschool, hopefully

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Yeah sounds interesting but would be moreso in the details, let's know what it was all about girllovingtvibe if you get any info. By the way UT might be going there for gradschool, hopefully

very cool....

I was only able to catch one seminar: "Marxism vs. Post-modernism". The seminar provided no new information but apparently the rest of the weekend was quite informative. There was a push to join the international socialists - I was more interested in their monthly discussion groups....other than all that I met some cool people...

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Last edited by girllovingtvibe on May-11-2004 at 18:20

I was there on Friday. Attended "Palestine and Israeli Occupation", "ABCs of Marxism" and "Marxists and the Middle East".
I'm not going to join the IS until I learn more, but I am interested in their discussion groups, but won't go until the fall.

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What is their to discuss?

Marxism is a failed theory.

He's a great philosopher undoubtedly, but his theory failed.
He overestimated the will of the bourgeoise, plain and simple. At the point of capitalism the bourgeoise are free enough, rich enough, enlightened enough to demand revolution.

If anything, as demonstrated to us by China, Marxism might be the step before a capitalist economy, not one after it.

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Originally posted by Yoepus If anything, as demonstrated to us by China, Marxism might be the step before a capitalist economy, not one after it.

Not to nitpick, but didn't the revolution in China install a Maoist regime that was markedly different to a Marxist one? Then there's the argument that pure Communism is in fact impossible to achieve, and that the 'communist' countries are in fact socialist (non-democratic Socialism of course) rather than Communist.

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quote:

Originally posted by Yoepus What is their to discuss? Marxism is a failed theory. He's a great philosopher undoubtedly, but his theory failed. He overestimated the will of the bourgeoise, plain and simple. At the point of capitalism the bourgeoise are free enough, rich enough, enlightened enough to demand revolution. If anything, as demonstrated to us by China, Marxism might be the step before a capitalist economy, not one after it.

you don't get it. Marxism is cool.

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Originally posted by arctic Not to nitpick, but didn't the revolution in China install a Maoist regime that was markedly different to a Marxist one? Then there's the argument that pure Communism is in fact impossible to achieve, and that the 'communist' countries are in fact socialist (non-democratic Socialism of course) rather than Communist.

then you must discuss Deng Xiaoping's influence as far as China is concerned.

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Originally posted by arctic Not to nitpick, but didn't the revolution in China install a Maoist regime that was markedly different to a Marxist one?

How is it markedly different?

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Then there's the argument that pure Communism is in fact impossible to achieve, and that the 'communist' countries are in fact socialist (non-democratic Socialism of course) rather than Communist.

My rebuttal. There is no such thing or ever will be of a pure communism. Just like no form of pure capitalisim will ever exist. Humans are imperfect creatures and our creations - such as socities, philosophies, and politics will always be imperfect a sa result.

Philosophy should take this into account - you are arguing in absolutes to bring understanding to the complexity of an overall situation. But when you get to a stage that you are so abstract from reality philosophy loses all meaning. Marx never believed in a pure communisim - altough he did paint a good picture of it - he believed in the idea of communism and so did the Soviet Russians and the Maoists. Just as the United States and some of the Western world believed in the Capitalist idea (and they aren't pure capitalist).

Second, Marx to my recollection never mentioned anything about a "socalisim" state - its no in their in his theory for the progression of social structures. Capitalism is there and communisim is there - He could not comprehend the merge of the two concepts, he believed revolution would lead from one to another.

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I'l admit i'm quite an ameteur when it comes to political opinion, but thsi is the way I see it aynway.

Marxism is unworkable. We opened Pandora's box, no doctor is going to work for the same rewards, financial or otherwise, as a binman. Nobody is only going to eat their indigenous foodstuffs when they can walk to Walmart or a supermarket and buy anything they want. We as a species want the best for ourselves, the diea that we should all work for what we need not what we want is very abstract and while quite a charming idea does not take into account the undesirable attributes we all possess such as greed.

We seem to have reached an amicable stalemate in between socialism and capitalism though, from my viewpoint in merry Britain. The bourgeoise run the country, they own industry and create wealth. The government are basically their puppets, installed to keep the proletariat happy and revolution free. They do this by granting us liberty and state benefits such as sick pay, pensions etc. The rich stay rich while the worker ploughs his guts out day after day happy to have a house, a TV and a wife and kid.

I personally cannot envisage any society that could be run better than this. The proletariat are still slaves to the machine, but at least that machine gves them the illusion that they are free and keeps them happy enough.

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Originally posted by Palestinian I was there on Friday. Attended "Palestine and Israeli Occupation", "ABCs of Marxism" and "Marxists and the Middle East". I'm not going to join the IS until I learn more, but I am interested in their discussion groups, but won't go until the fall.

I am with u on the discussional groups. I don't want to officially join any kind party - but I love to listen, learn and discuss....should be interesting...

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Last edited by girllovingtvibe on May-18-2004 at 22:37