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St_Andrew
I <3 NYC



Registered: May 2003
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Thumbs up China's Next Big Export: Kidneys

quote:
UK kidney patients head for China

Britons are being targeted by an internet company offering the organs of dead prisoners in a trade condemned as 'disgusting' by surgeons

Jo Revill, health editor
Sunday December 11, 2005
The Observer

Kidney patients who need a transplant in Britain are being targeted by a medical group offering them new organs taken from executed Chinese prisoners.

The horrifying trade in human organs has been revealed by British surgeons who say patients are being tempted abroad, but may not fully understand the dangers or the human suffering behind the transplant operation.

It is thought that as many as 10 British patients may have gone to China this year to receive a new kidney, at a cost of £23,000. One UK patient was believed to be recovering this weekend at a hospital in southern China following such a transplant.

The internet company transplantsinternational.com makes it clear that the organs are from prisoners who are about to be executed. The prisoners apparently give their consent and are told that their families will receive money for the 'donation'.

Under the heading 'Where do kidneys come from?', the company states: 'A cadaveric kidney comes from a dead person and in the majority of cases in China, the dead people are prisoners, which allows for us to know at least two weeks ahead of time when the kidney will be ready.'

It also makes clear that before the death, blood samples are taken from prisoners to ensure they will be the perfect match for their Western beneficiaries.

'All donors are screened to prevent any disease transmission and the prisoners consent to organ donation. Unlike in some Western countries, the prisoners can receive money for their organs.'

Dr Peter Andrews, a consultant nephrologist from St Helier Hospital in Surrey, said: 'In the past 18 months we've had at least five patients say they are considering this. Five years ago, it would have been unheard of.'

Another doctor, Professor Stephen Wigmore, head of transplantation surgery at University Hospital Birmingham Trust, said that recently one of his patients had gone some way towards preparing for a liver transplant in China, before deciding against it.

Doctors in Oxford, Nottingham and Sussex have reported similar cases, according to Hospital Doctor magazine.

Prof Nadey Hakim, head of transplantation surgery at Imperial College London, said: 'It is so disgusting it is hard to know how any doctor can take part in this trade.

'Of course people become desperate for a new kidney - but do they realise what this trade is like? I first heard about it a few years ago from a Chinese doctor and I couldn't believe it. Would anyone want to receive an organ from someone who died in this way?'

Hakim also has worries about other kinds of transplants carried out in China. 'We know that they have done around 10 arm transplants so far, and I was told that these donors are also prisoners. It raises many difficult ethical issues.'

The kidney transplants are carried out at the Southern Hospital in Guangzhou by Dr Lixing Yu, who has performed thousands of kidney transplants over the past 30 years.

According to the website, he specialises in research on the long-term survival of patients and has received more than 19 national awards for his work.

Earlier this month, China broke its silence on the issue to admit that organs of executed prisoners were sold to foreigners for transplantation. Huang Jiefu, the deputy prime minister, admitted that the practice is widespread, but said they wanted to tighten the rules.

'We want to push for regulations on organ transplants to standardise the management of the supply of organs from executed prisoners and tidy up the medical market,' Mr Huang told Caijing magazine.


I don't get it, what's so bad about this?! If you are going to execute them, why not make some use of it as well?! And they even gave their fucking consent?!

Old Post Dec-11-2005 20:14  Europe
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Fir3start3r
Armin Acolyte



Registered: Oct 2001
Location: Toronto, ON, Canada

Wait, wasn't there a movie about body parts used from criminals changing the person who received them?

Found it.
Aptly named, "Body Parts"...

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0101492/


___________________
"...End? No, the journey doesn't end here. Death is just another path...one that we all must take.
The grey rain-curtain of this world rolls back, and all change to silver glass...and then you see it...
...white shores...and beyond...the far green country under a swift sunrise."

Old Post Dec-12-2005 03:50  Canada
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Trancer-X
mutatis mutandis



Registered: Jul 2001
Location: Shambhala

Well, if they ever begin exporting livers then I might just have to start drinking hard alcohol again.

This is definitely a moral issue you're dealing with here.

Maybe it's just me, but I don't think that I'd ever truly feel comfortable knowing that I was carrying around an internal organ that was cut from someone who's only crime could simply have been speaking out against their repressive government. For all we know, in 30 years they could start doing that here in America.

Old Post Dec-12-2005 04:27  United States
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Trancer-X
mutatis mutandis



Registered: Jul 2001
Location: Shambhala

quote:
Originally posted by Fir3start3r
Wait, wasn't there a movie about body parts used from criminals changing the person who received them?

Found it.
Aptly named, "Body Parts"...

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0101492/


Also similar the one that came out not too long ago, The Island. I actually caught it in theatre and can only comment that going to see it was a waste of good money.

Old Post Dec-12-2005 04:32  United States
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St_Andrew
I <3 NYC



Registered: May 2003
Location: Stockholm, Sweden

quote:
Originally posted by Trancer-X
Well, if they ever begin exporting livers then I might just have to start drinking hard alcohol again.

This is definitely a moral issue you're dealing with here.

Maybe it's just me, but I don't think that I'd ever truly feel comfortable knowing that I was carrying around an internal organ that was cut from someone who's only crime could simply have been speaking out against their repressive government. For all we know, in 30 years they could start doing that here in America.


Well, they are going to execute that person no matter if you buy that kidney or not.

Old Post Dec-12-2005 17:23  Europe
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Fir3start3r
Armin Acolyte



Registered: Oct 2001
Location: Toronto, ON, Canada

quote:
Originally posted by Trancer-X

This is definitely a moral issue you're dealing with here.


Is it though?

If both sides are consenting, where's the dilemma?

(I still find it creep though.....ick)


___________________
"...End? No, the journey doesn't end here. Death is just another path...one that we all must take.
The grey rain-curtain of this world rolls back, and all change to silver glass...and then you see it...
...white shores...and beyond...the far green country under a swift sunrise."

Old Post Dec-13-2005 00:53  Canada
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Trancer-X
mutatis mutandis



Registered: Jul 2001
Location: Shambhala

quote:
Originally posted by Fir3start3r
Is it though?

If both sides are consenting, where's the dilemma?

(I still find it creep though.....ick)


If someone's theoretically holding a gun to your head saying that they're going to kill you, but that you can make some money for your family before they pull the trigger - wouldn't you give consent? It's not like you're going to need that kidney when you're dead, but is that still (morally) the right thing for them to do? Obviously they wouldn't even be doing it in the first place if they weren't also profiting from it. Also, who's going to know any better if you DON'T give consent and they kill you and take your kidney? Dead men don't talk, so there probably wouldn't be any repercussions (from either scenario.)

Old Post Dec-13-2005 01:10  United States
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Fir3start3r
Armin Acolyte



Registered: Oct 2001
Location: Toronto, ON, Canada

quote:
Originally posted by Trancer-X
If someone's theoretically holding a gun to your head saying that they're going to kill you, but that you can make some money for your family before they pull the trigger - wouldn't you give consent? It's not like you're going to need that kidney when you're dead, but is that still (morally) the right thing for them to do? Obviously they wouldn't even be doing it in the first place if they weren't also profiting from it. Also, who's going to know any better if you DON'T give consent and they kill you and take your kidney? Dead men don't talk, so there probably wouldn't be any repercussions (from either scenario.)


I see where you're coming from.

I think I'd want to know more about the source as well.
I guess that's the source of the creepiness...
would you truly believe that the kidney was given up with free willing consent?
Knowning the Chinese really aren't that open to anything about their inside-the-border practises, buyers are obviously willing to overlook that and pay the price.
Does love conquer all?


___________________
"...End? No, the journey doesn't end here. Death is just another path...one that we all must take.
The grey rain-curtain of this world rolls back, and all change to silver glass...and then you see it...
...white shores...and beyond...the far green country under a swift sunrise."

Old Post Dec-13-2005 01:56  Canada
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