quote:

Originally posted by srussell0018 Macklemore has a song that ends with the line "I'd rather be a starving artist than be successfull and fucked." I've heard his older stuff and its all good, but I think it was his producer Ryan whatever who made him break out.

His stuff sucked before he got together with Ryan Lewis.

Edit to qualify: As much as this sounds like a flippant American Psycho quote, he truly did come into his own commercially and artistically when he started working with Lewis.

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Well now that I'm writing...

My dad said something along the same lines. Suffering is what brings great art out. If you're happy, successful, whatever it may be, your art will be shit. Suffering is the process of pain and you need pain to create meaningful art. He said it much better than I can write here, but it made so much sense when I was telling him about my relationship. That's why so many great writers struggle with keeping a woman and struggle with themselves internally. It's the nature of the beast and I really never thought of it that way, but when he said that it started to make perfect sense when I reflected back on my own experiences and such.

In my opinion, art by happy people often comes across as trite and shallow. Maybe that's because I'm a cynical bastard.

I tend to think, with no documentation whatsoever for this belief, that more cynical people enjoy art more, at least of the "suffering" variety.

I mean, that's why we all liked John Digweed, right???

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quote:

Originally posted by OrangestO Well now that I'm writing... My dad said something along the same lines. Suffering is what brings great art out. If you're happy, successful, whatever it may be, your art will be shit. Suffering is the process of pain and you need pain to create meaningful art. He said it much better than I can write here, but it made so much sense when I was telling him about my relationship. That's why so many great writers struggle with keeping a woman and struggle with themselves internally. It's the nature of the beast and I really never thought of it that way, but when he said that it started to make perfect sense when I reflected back on my own experiences and such.

Kat Williams said something similar about being a comedian.

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It's so true. I mean, the best stuff I've ever written - whether a song, article, story - has been because I was enduring struggle and feeling some type of pain. And it's like I make this pain happen in my life on purpose to get my juices flowing subconsciously. Such a weird dynamic.

quote:

Originally posted by Lews His stuff sucked before he got together with Ryan Lewis. Edit to qualify: As much as this sounds like a flippant American Psycho quote, he truly did come into his own commercially and artistically when he started working with Lewis.

What I meant is that he's always been a talented lyricist.

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quote:

Originally posted by OrangestO This isn't about physics, this is about waves.

quote:

Originally posted by Lews In my opinion, art by happy people often comes across as trite and shallow. Maybe that's because I'm a cynical bastard. I tend to think, with no documentation whatsoever for this belief, that more cynical people enjoy art more, at least of the "suffering" variety. I mean, that's why we all liked John Digweed, right???

I get what you mean but I don't think it's always like that. It's just that sad and cynical artists often shock us more which can be a good or bad thing.

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I agree with Fledz. In fact, I think the notion of the tortured artist is in itself trite and shallow.

Don't get me wrong; familiarity with desperation, angst, longing, depression, misery - these are all components that lend themselves well to the artist and are so transposed into his or her art. But one does not have to be in this unhappy place to make excellent art. In fact, I would argue instead that one can be quite content and comfortable with themselves, and that art is regressive therapy into such horizons, equally as important as hope and optimism and happiness.

All facets are vital to the coalescence of the imperfect result, as art in the making is a reflection of life; Never undone is the making nor unmade is what's done; each life a refraction of that likewise undone gestalt.

Also, red wine.

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I think artist recognition is anti-artistic. Who cares who the artist is, if that matters then the art itself is shallow inherently. As long as it draws an emotional response from the viewer that the viewer appreciates then that is all that matters.


Artist worship is just like DJ worship, douchey.

Idk...

I think artists (writers specifically) have these peaks and valleys. You reach a valley in your life and write to build yourself back up to your peak. You enjoy that peak and then look for that pain to fall back down into the valley. A lot of writers I know, myself included, experience this sort of behavior; it's not balanced behavior and has an effect on relationships, jobs, etc.

My opinion, though.

Just thought it an interesting observation and I wish I made a separate thread for it because I think there's people on here that could add some great insight to this, aside from some of you that already have.

quote:

Originally posted by Halcyon+On+On I agree with Fledz. In fact, I think the notion of the tortured artist is in itself trite and shallow.

It's completely trite and shallow. However, to merely call it that is also just another iteration of our society's love of irony, e.g. "Oh, look at me, my soul is so black; I'm so tortured, I'm going to go make art." In a way, it's come back around. People love to roll their eyes at the trope of the depressing artist, now it's legitimate to roll one's eyes at the eye rollers

quote:

Originally posted by Halcyon+On+On Don't get me wrong; familiarity with desperation, angst, longing, depression, misery - these are all components that lend themselves well to the artist and are so transposed into his or her art. But one does not have to be in this unhappy place to make excellent art. In fact, I would argue instead that one can be quite content and comfortable with themselves, and that art is regressive therapy into such horizons, equally as important as hope and optimism and happiness. All facets are vital to the coalescence of the imperfect result, as art in the making is a reflection of life; Never undone is the making nor unmade is what's done; each life a refraction of that likewise undone gestalt.

Agree; I would argue that the best art comes from people who have seen both sides of the equation.

However, if I had to choose, I'd go with myopicly depressing art over colorful unicorns any day

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