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Help me decide TTX1 or Technics 1200?? (pg. 2)
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| Vlad |
| quote: | Originally posted by prestige
ok man.... here is how it is... and this is the truth..
i own a pair of numark TTX1's and i am very satisfied,
and that thing about the ttx's not locking pitch..?? thats not true.
numark ttx's and techs 1200 are both at the top of the list, they are both excellent, precision instuments.. the ttx's have more features than the 1200's, which makes it a little better.. but no big deal..
but what im tryin to say is that..no one here can tell you what to buy man.. everyone has their own feel for their own thing.. my thing are the ttx1's and other ppl's thing are the 1200's.
go to the store, play with both of them, and see what you like..
its not about what turntable ppl mix on...its about the skill and creativity the person has.
and...if you learn how to mix on both of them, thats even better. not only will you know how to mix on the number one table, you'll know how to mix on both of them.
hope this helped out
-alan |
Definitely have to agree, people that have TTX1's will favor the TTX1's, people with Tech's favor Tech's. You really have to test both of them out. If you feel comfortable on both and you feel you would be able to mix at your best on both, than just go with whats cheaper or whichever you like more. We cant tell you how to spend your money because all have different opinions. The best opinion is your own, rent them, go to a store try them, it would be better if you had a first hand experience with them. Who knows, you might not like either of them... :p |
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| DJ Tranz |
Just get the new Technics MK5G :D :D :D
whoever said ttx1s are cheaper by $150.00 is shopping in a WRONG STORE/PLACE.
Numark ttx1-- $399.99
TECHNICS SL1200MKII -- $399.99
TECHNICS SL1200M3D -- $399.99
Technics SL1210MKII -- $399.99
Technics SL1200MK5S -- $549.99
Technics SL1200MK5G -- $749.95
technics MkIIs and M3Ds are pretty much priced at 399.99 almost everywhere. |
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| Vlad |
| quote: | Originally posted by DJ Tranz
Just get the new Technics MK5G :D :D :D
whoever said ttx1s are cheaper by $150.00 is shopping in a WRONG STORE/PLACE.
Numark ttx1-- $399.99
TECHNICS SL1200MKII -- $399.99
TECHNICS SL1200M3D -- $399.99
Technics SL1210MKII -- $399.99
Technics SL1200MK5S -- $549.99
Technics SL1200MK5G -- $749.95
technics MkIIs and M3Ds are pretty much priced at 399.99 almost everywhere. |
the M3D's were $449 and the MKII's were $499... Of course the tables are cheaper now, why would Tech's keep their prices high and loose business. They are slow, not stupid. Although it is quite stupid of them to be so passive when it comes to making new tables or creating a new design or just putting more gadgets into their tables.
EDIT:
DJ Mart - Technics <-- Care to explain?? And you work for them... |
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| DJ 2Slow |
I would have to agree with Vlad on this. I went to guitar center when i was shopping for some nice tables (started off on some Gemini XL500-II's, not bad, but i deff needed something better). So I put the TTX-1's head to head against the 1200's (The guys at guitar center were very cool with me, let me bring in my own headphones, vinyl and carts). To me the TTX-1 destroyd the 1200's in every thing i did, scraching, mixing, beatmatching, holding a beatmatch, everything. The tourqe on them is amazing too. I aslo have a pair of 1200's too, and I find myself using the TTX-1's alot more, and even got some of my 1200 friends to switch over. But honestly, it comes down to YOU at the end, and i would suggest putting the TTX-1's to the test against 1200's to see what would make you happier. It is an investment you know, a very expensive one. The guy at guitar center gave me the TTX-1's for 700 bucks, not too shabby, not you can find them on ebay for $649 for the pair, not too bad either. Just keep in mind, about 80% of everything on that ttx-1 is replaceable very easily(pitch fader, tone arm, strobe light, platter, button control surface, etc, etc.) so keep that in mind too, i just had to replace the pitch faders on my 1200's and they are only 6 years old, and were used by hip hop DJ who never used the pitch faders. Anyways I hope some of this helps you out with your decision.
peace
2 slow |
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| Tiger777 |
| Actually, it's a decision between features(the TTX1) or the standards(technics TT's) |
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| DJ A.i |
you can find TTX1 for $312 US on yahoo.com shopping area. i wouldnt buy it from there, but i would just take that price and go to pssl.com and ask them to beat the price(they will by 10%).
i have never used ttx1 before and dont plan on useing them in the future, but i thought id add my two cents :gsmile: |
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| Dj Flesch |
Here is a professional dj's review of the TTX1, and to note, he had been a decade long user of the 1200, so this is a very good review:
With the current turntable market now fluctuating, much like the over populated skratch dj mixer market, we have a series of turntables to hit the market. The latest is the numark ttx1, which beats any table out on paper. But does it stand up ?
Mike Runge drops the review for sqratchattack, after being one of the first in the nation to use and own one.
Until now, Numark has been recognized by DJs primarily for their line of mixers. I think the new centerpoint of their product line is now a turntable because you're gonna love the new TTX1 turntable from Numark.. No joke -- after nearly two decades of using Technics 1200s exclusively, I'm thinking about selling the old workhorses and getting another TTX1 (I only bought a single TTX1 deck so far).
Gearhead that I am, I have investigated and and tested out nearly every new turntable that has come on the market. The greater effect of all this effort has made me very skeptical, so I went into this wondering if I'd end up returning the unit to the store after playing with it for a few days. As for previous contenders, I thought the Vestax turntables were good, but the story wasn't completely compelling and I ended up sticking with my 1200s. The Stanton STR8-100 looked good and had nice features, but the construction wasn't up to 'snuff and the platter did weird things when trying to slow it down or speed it up (by dragging a finger on the platter's edge or twisting the spindle). On the other hand, in the TTX1 we have a very solidly constructed direct drive turntable, loaded with great features.
Before I start, in case you want to see the specifications for yourself, go to http://www.ttx1.com/pdf/TTX1SPEC_LTR.PDF
THE CONSTRUCTION OF THE UNIT:
This ain't no Calista Flockhart, it's more of a Nell Carter. Weighing in at 28.6 lbs, it's even heavier than the 1200 (27.6 lbs), the PDX2000 (21 lbs), or the STR8-100 (21 lbs). Numark calls it a "Solid-Core Steel Top and Rubber Base Construction", but I have no idea what "Solid Core" means. Maybe it was designed by Ashford & Simpson. All I can tell you is that it feels every bit as rugged as a 1200, probably even more so.
Aesthetics
It looks cool, man. Just check it out at the gallery.
THE PERFORMANCE OF THE UNIT:
The platter starts up quick. According to Numark, it has 3.7 kg/cm starting torque and 2.8 kg/cm constant torque. So it starts up in 1/7 of a rotation. Comparatively, the 1200 has 1.5 kg/cm of torque, and the PDX-2000 has 2.0 kg/cm of torque. Honestly, I can't tell if the TTX1 has more torque than either the 1200 or the PDX-2000, because they all feel about the same to me.
Accuracy
I found the TTX1 to be very accurate. This is despite the significant difference in wow and flutter between the TTX1 and the 1200 (I could not find any comparable info on this for the PDX-2000). According to the technical specifications I found, the TTX1 has <.15% WRMS and the Technics has .025% WRMS. But even though the 1200 looks better on paper, I couldn't find any perceptible difference in use. In fact, I put a copy of Planet Rock on my TTX1 and another identical copy on one of my 1200s. After getting them in phase with each other, they rode together in phase for all 6:25 of the song and another 1:15 of the bonus beats.
Features
There are many features on the TTX1 that make it so attractive. Let's start by looking at the bottom of the deck. It's solid rubber with molded hand-holds to make it easy to carry. The cables are not hardwired to the unit; instead you'll find connectors so that you can replace them easily if they get damaged. There are connectors for AC power (100/120/220/240V), S/PDIF (digital out), and RCA connectors. The RCA connectors can be hooked up to a mixer as either phono or line level, with a toggle switch near the RCA outputs on the bottom of the TTX1 for setting phono or line. For those of you that don't already know, S/PDIF stands for Sony/Philips Digital Interface and this connector allows for the direct transfer of audio in digital format.
Perhaps the most unique feature of the TTX1 is the interchangeable tonearm with both an S-shaped arm and a straight-arm included. There is a patent pending for this feature, so it may never be available from other manufacturers. The interchangeable tonearm is a great feature and I think it will help to make the unit popular with both club DJs and turntablists alike. Because of its straight-arm, I think that the PDX-2000 got labeled as a deck primarily for turntablists, and that affected the degree to which they gained broader acceptance.
On the other hand, with the swappable tonearm, this deck will be equally well received by all DJs. In using the TTX1, I was able to swap out the tonearm and recalibrate it very easily (it takes just a few seconds).
The tonearm has adjustments for setting the tracking force, tonearm height, and antiskate. There is also an extra counterweight to be used with the S-shaped tonearm. While you're not using the extra counterweight, there is a small hole located just behind the tonearm for storing it. (I wish Numark had also provided a similar storage place for the 45 adapter. It won't be long before mine is lost. Not that I ever use a 45 adapter...)
The TTX1 has a multi-directional design that makes it easy to use in the tradional and battle positions. The pitch fader and button controls are interchangeable so that they can be set in the best position for the user regardless of their preference for traditional vs battle setup. When I set up my deck, I swapped the pitch fader and the control buttons so that they would be optimized for the battle style setup. Numark included a tool for making the change and it was quick and easy to do. Notice how the pitch fader is aligned across the bottom of the deck in the photo below and the button controls are on the right side, battle style.
If you prefer things 1200 style, you can switch them around. The blue readout presents the pitch (shown as +8.0% here) and other text so that it appears upright to the user. Once you swap the pitch fader and button controls for traditional style setup, the text in the blue readout turns 90 degrees counterclockwise so it appears upright in that configuration.
Two of the button controls allow the user to set the speed to 33, 45 or 78 RPM (the top two buttons shown above). One can activate 78 RPM by pressing the 33 and 45 buttons simultaneously. The third button is for setting the key lock. I'll talk more about key lock below, but it allows the user to lock in the key of the song so that the key remains constant even if the BPM is altered by using the pitch fader. The fourth button is for Quartz lock and it's like the pitch reset button on the 1200 M3D. When the Quartz lock button is pressed, it resets the pitch to zero, regardless of how the pitch fader is set.
The pitch fader is smooth and does not have a depression at the zero position like the SL-1200MKII. I really liked the fact that I could customize the position of the pitch fader for battle setup, making it easier for me to access it.
The circular blue readout doesn't just look cool, it displays a lot of information:
pitch setting
33, 45, or 78 RPM
range of the pitch fader (8, 10, 20 or 50%)
BPM of the song that is playing
There are two buttons located at the edge of the blue readout. The top (or left) one is for BPM and pressing the button once tells the blue readout to display the BPM of the song. Pressing it a second time reverts the readout to display the current position of the pitch fader. Pressing the BPM button and holding it for two seconds recalculates the BPM of the song. As the pitch fader is moved, the BPM readout changes accordingly as the tempo of the song changes. The BPM counter works automatically and does not require the user to tap any buttons for calucation of the tempo. I used it with serveral songs of varying tempos and genres, and it was accurate in every case. When I bought the TTX1, I was not aware of the BPM feature. It is the most accurate and easy to use BPM counter I've ever seen and I think it's going to be very useful for lots of users. The picture below shows the BPM function displayed (125 BPM).
The other button at the bottom (or right) side of the blue readout is for setting the range of the pitch fader. It can be set to 10, 20, or 50% by cycling through the options in that order. Pressing and holding the button for two seconds sets the pitch fader range to 8% for users that want to emulate the range of the 1200.
Just below the pitch fader shown above is the stylus light. It is removable, and therefore easily replaceable if it breaks. No visit to the repair shop needed. I thought the brightness of the light was too dim when I used it in a dark room , despite the fact that Numark calls it a "super-bright" white LED. ( Maybe mine is defective?) Actually, the blue readout gave off more light than the stylus light did. The brightness of the 1200's pop up stylus light was a lot more intense than the one on the TTX1.
At the bottom (or left side) of the TTX1 there are three buttons and two wheel knobs. The two large buttons at the corners are start/stop buttons which are identical to each other (each can both start and stop the platter). The small center button changes the direction of the platter's rotation. The left wheel knob (near the left start/stop button) sets the speed of the platter start and the right wheel knob (near the other start/stop button) sets the speed of the platter brake, both with a range of 0 to 6 (0 is quick start/stop and 6 is slow start/stop). All of these controls were easy to use and had a good, responsive feel to them.
Behind the platter and located just next to the tonearm is the power button. It is recessed and out of the way so it would be very difficult to accidently power off the unit, but it is located in a spot that makes it easy to get at (e.g., it's not on the underside of the unit).
Although I briefly mentioned the key lock feature, I want to spend a little more time on this feature. Maybe you've seen the "master tempo" feature on some CD players or the "key adjust" feature on the Stanton STR8-100. Those allow the user to adjust the tempo of the song without affecting the key of the song. The TTX1 works in a similar fashion, but with one major extra advantage. You can lock in the key at any setting of the pitch fader (by pressing the key lock button) and then change the tempo by subsequently moving the pitch fader. Just about every other master tempo control that I've seen locks in the key at the zero pitch setting (the original key of the recording). With the TTX1, you get an extra degree of freedom to mix songs harmonically even if the songs were recorded in discordant keys and in differing BPMs. Pretty cool.
One important thing to note about key lock is that it ONLY works if you set the output of the deck as line level. The phono output option is true analog, but the key lock feature requires the onboard digital processor to change the key of the song, so the line level output must be used. Unfortunately, this means that your decks will occupy the line inputs on your mixer -- so it's a tough choice if you have a two-line mixer (like my Vestax PMC-06ProA) and already use the line inputs for CD players. Maybe some manufacturers will pick up on this subtlety and will add extra line inputs (three-way inputs for each channel, one phono and two line).
The average listener probably won't know when you've engaged key lock because it sounds pretty clean. But if you're like me, you'll know it. It has a tendency to alter the quantization of percussion like high hats. Simply put, it kind of throws them off a bit in their timing, but the degree to which this happens really depends upon the song itself and how much you alter the tempo. So there will be cases where key lock works really well and some where it sounds worse than if you had left key lock off and just lived with the change in key. Another observation is that key lock sometimes makes scratches sound like they're flanged.
THE FAVORITE FEATURES OF THE NUMARK TTX1:
interchangeable tonearms; the straight arm results in less skipping while scratching
multi-directional design for traditional and battle configurations
key lock
BPM counter
rugged and well designed
IMPROVEMENTS THAT CAN BE MADE TO THE UNIT:
stylus light is too dim
unfortunate (but understandable) that key lock requires use of line level output
I really like the feel of the strobe spots on the side of the 1200's platter and the TTX1's platter notches take some getting used to
Availability of the NUMARK TTX1
I think I got lucky having been able to pick up the TTX1 from a local Washington DC music store without having to pre-order. They had received 8 of the units and sold 7 very quickly. I got number 8 just in time. I called up Numark and asked them about availability. They would not comment on how many have been manufactured so far (it was worth asking anyway). They said that it depends on where you order them from, but that they are available at some stores and distributors. There is already a growing backlog of units on order. Suggested Retail is equivalent to that of the 1200.
Will Technics Innovate?
It's amazing how little has changed in the 1200 over the last 20-odd years. It is the poster child for design integrity. Well, design integrity is one thing, but hey we'd really like some new features. It will be very interesting to see what kind of reception the TTX1 gets and how Technics will respond.
Caveats
I've only had this TTX1 for a few days and there are limitations to the amount of testing I've done. For one thing, I've never used it in a club so I don't know how well isolated it is (anti-vibration). And I've only had them for a couple days, so I don't know how durable they are. You try them out for yourself. I think you'll like them.
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NUMARK TTX1 UPDATE SEPT 2002
After writing the TTX1 review for SA, I did end up selling my old 1200s and getting a second TTX1. So far, so good. There are no major negative points I'd like to make about the TTX1 other than to temper somewhat my earlier commendation for the BPM counter. It's still very good, but I have noticed a number of instances where it has been inaccurate. Usually, resetting the counter will correct the error after it has had time to recalculate the tempo.
There is one major thing that I want to make note of, though. I realized after writing the review that straight tonearms and curved tonearms have an important difference for battle djs which may not be apparent to everyone. Of course the straight arm has less skipping while scratching, but if you mark records with stickers to find cue points, the straight arm won't work very well. It's the natural tendency of a curved arm to head toward the center of the record and that's what makes the concept of marking the record viable. That's why the stylus jumps to the cue point. When you throw on
the straight arm... no worky! My experience has been that the stylus jumps *over* the marker instead of moving to the cue point. So keep that in mind if you battle and use record sensors (markers).
For those of you that want more information about straight tonearms, check out this useful page at http://www.kabusa.com/str8_doc.htm
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This review was conducted by Mike Runge for sqratchattack.com, Copyright 2002. The Numark TTX1 unit was provided by Mike Runge for review. If you have any questions on this mixer, feel free to contact Mike Runge for further information. sqratchattack provides this review for education purposes. Please do not publish or reproduce this review in any form without prior consent of the webmaster. For a complete technical breakdown of the Numark TTX1 Turntable, please visit www.numark.com.
.SQRATCHATTACK.COM.2003. |
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| ChavezHype |
| I've already read that review... what scared me about the TTX was the pitch issue. It seems after using it for a little while, there was not this problem. Which brings me back to the question... what then was the problem with some people in this forum and others dealing with the pitch not staying in sync? It seems to be a rare problem. Maybe faulty turntables or faulty users...(I don't really mean that, but its the only other explanantion if barely anyone has this problem). |
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| Dj Flesch |
| I think that the main issue here was that those who were having problems with them were not giving the tables a proper chance. Most people who returned them, returned them after only a couple days (maybe 3-8 hours of mixing), which is hardly a good amount of time to become accustomed to the nuiances of a new table. Especially one with so much more torque than any other table out there. |
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| gibbo |
I would say technics
the numarks are in a lot of ways a better turntable with more torque but if u intend to play clubs u will find that they all still have technics so it will be easier to get used to when u play out if u buy the technics. If u just want them for urself then the numarks are a far smoother and better turntable with more features |
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| ChavezHype |
| quote: | Originally posted by gibbo
I would say technics
the numarks are in a lot of ways a better turntable with more torque but if u intend to play clubs u will find that they all still have technics so it will be easier to get used to when u play out if u buy the technics. If u just want them for urself then the numarks are a far smoother and better turntable with more features |
I would say this is a good rundown on it all. But, I still think its short-sighted to buy TTs simply because they are used in clubs. If you want to set up your own gigs, and/or use your TTs in your studio, then the TTX's will be great additions.
The best option is, however to get other DJ friends with 1200s IMO and use those to get aquainted with them for use in a club, otherwise just ask the club owner/manager for a day to use their decks to get aquainted with them. The reason clubs will use techs is not because they are the best in terms of what they do, but are the most reliable and do their job, a club can't afford to have its decks fail on them during a night, techs have been around since modern DJing took off and in that way there are no other decks that can compete for relaibility. But why spend top dollar for decks that really don't stack up to what other decks can do? You'll be able to get the "feel" for the techs anyway if you have too, but you're going to use your decks for other functions too I'd guess, don't limit yourself to what the clubs use. If/when various clubs ever start to change the TTs they use, then all the big name DJs will be seen using them won't they? They use techs cause they DJ in clubs and events all the time, since techs are the standard, they really can't fo wrong and will use the decks that they are almost always provided with at gigs. Still, Techs will have to prove more than reliability if any other deck can match up with this. They have done little to solidify their status as standards, and they really should innovate, because other TTs will start a fire beneath Technics if the deck remains a 1980s medium.
Heh well just my thoughts seeing as how im just slightly upset that technics offers little more than a 16% pitch adjustment on their latest "Grand Master" model, can't they do a little more!? The only thing Technics has gunning or them is standard - due to their reliability. They're riding on their name and standard for years while other companies just recently started making a more advanced/innovative TT, you think Technics would repond with a TT that would shut everybody down, but they keep at it with their tried and true (not to mention blue LEDs). At this point I'm just thinking Technics is profiting from DJ culture and is not really trying to make a truly better product of which other companies seem to be doing.
Thats all of my venting.
But, 1200s are solid as nails TTs, you can't count them out, the fact that they still can compete somewhat today shows how advanced they were for their time.
However with a ttx, you can count on better performance, no proven reliability track record, not standard, so this ones on your plate. |
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| Dj Flesch |
| quote: | Originally posted by ChavezHype
I still think its short-sighted to buy TTs simply because they are used in clubs. |
I agree, not to pee on anyone's parade, but most of us here will never make it outside of our own bedrooms. I've spun out few times, but, for me, two things holding me back are the fact that there is no demand for trance where I live :( and the fact that I WILL NOT spin stuff that I don't like, just so that I can spin in public. Other things that hold people back are their lack of knowledge of how clubs operate, lack of connections, lack of ability to schmooze club owners and even lack of skill and originallity, and again, in my case, the lack of time to go out and follow up on demos that you send out.
Just because lots of clubs have techs doesn't mean that they all do. And, no offense, but if you have different tables, and you can't pick up how to mix with techs in one transition or less, then you aren't ready to spin out anyway, so pack up, go home and make room for Djs that have a right to be there. |
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