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anti-bush? (pg. 2)
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| Shad0wmaster |
| quote: | Originally posted by maxstradamus
"The winning ad will then air in the U.S. on national television, in advance of Bush's State of the Union Address planned for Jan. 20."
Source: Toronto Star |
That's GREAT news!! I just never suspected that the major USA networks would ever do anything to oppose the government :p |
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| failsafe |
| i think CNN is going to air it. |
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| Neo nEro |
| I am definately anti-bush. Women should shave down there. |
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| DigiNut |
| quote: | Originally posted by Neo nEro
I am definately anti-bush. Women should shave down there. |
Hahahaha I love it.
Anyway... this was already discussed at length in another forum but needless to say, most of those ads are extremely left-wing. I tend to hover near the political center, and those ads were hard even for me to swallow, so I doubt that the right-wing American majority is going to put too much stock into them.
Nevertheless, I suppose there's no harm in free speech and presenting a different perspective on everything. We'll see what kind of influence it has. |
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| jonSun |
Bush has followed through with everything he said he was going to do about the middle east. Its the most unstable area of the world & Clinton ignored it like a . With most of those mid east countrys having WMD/2 Nuclear the USA needs a presence there. Most of the mid east countrys are economically torn by sanctions & dictators or kings & also some of those countrys have corrupt governments & scientists that would possibly sell WMD's/possibly nukes on the black market to big $$dollar$$ terrorists. Wouldnt that be great? NO. Clinton was a that ignored those problems & the USA saw the most terrorism ever in the 90's, then 8 months out of office the USA saw 9/11. Even if the US & Coalition forces werent in the mid east & Iraq, every Muslim country would be bombing each other as its been in the past & we stepped in to help out (1991). Iraq vs Iran, Iraq vs Kuwait & Saudi's were next, Pakistan vs India (both Nuclear), Sunni's vs Shia's, Kerds vs Turks, Palastinian terrorists backed by Syria, Jew tanks running over palistinian children, 17 local Muslim tribes battaling for Lebanon, Nothern Alliance vs Taliban, Pakistan vs Tabliban, Israel vs Iraq & the rest of the middle east. These wars are almost on going. None of these countrys truely ever got along & still dont.
Given 10-20 years they would all be nuclear states & thier military dictators & kings who have been thier countrys only leaders for the last 20-40 years wouldnt hesitate to blow the outa each other.
Bush aint the but at least he's got the balls to do something about the middle east & bring democracy to the middle east for the first time ever. No other world leader has done it. |
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| DaveSaenz |
| quote: | Originally posted by DigiNut
[FONT=Tahoma][COLOR=#99CCEE]Hahahaha I love it.
I doubt that the right-wing American majority is going to put too much stock into them.
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It's not really clear if you were talking about the majority of the US "right-wing," or you were saying that the majority of the US electorate is "right-wing." If you were saying that the majority of Americans were "right-wing," I would take issue with that. As I've said in another thread, if you'd analyze all the democratic, republican, and third party candidates in their respective races, their beliefs, and how the people voted, you’d find that in the last 3 Presidential elections the country has voted to give a left-wing mandate for the office of the president (the electoral college notwithstanding).
| quote: | Originally posted by Trancemaster2k
Moby, Michael Moore, Michael Stipe (REM), Frank Blake are against Bush administration. |
I'm not a fan of Bush at all, but I don't like Michael Moore much either. In my opinion, you shouldn’t have to lie or mislead to get people on your side when you can use the truth. I’ll always respect the truth more than a lie, and in my opinion what Michael Moore does often sinks to the level of his opponents. Oh well, maybe we “need” a balance of misleading blowhards on the left to balance out those on the right.:rolleyes:
That site is really amazing with the grassroots support it has inspired:
| quote: |
Published on Sunday, January 11, 2004 by the Associated Press
MoveOn.org Becomes Anti-Bush Powerhouse
by Beth Fouhy
BERKELEY, Calif. - Chances are, Democratic Party consultants won't take credit for the hardest-hitting anti-Bush ad to air on network TV this month. That honor will likely go to MoveOn.org, an online group that has become too potent for establishment politicians to ignore.
Years before Howard Dean's use of the Internet dazzled analysts and propelled him to the front of the 2004 Democratic presidential field, MoveOn paved the way, evolving in six short years from something of a cybergeek forum to arguably the largest and most forceful voice in digital-era politics.
Its members' angry opposition to President Bush's policies has coalesced into a force that includes a political action committee and fund-raising organization that has pledged to spend millions on anti-Bush TV ads.
In its latest campaign, MoveOn invited people to create their own anti-Bush ads. More than 1,500 entries were submitted, and hundreds of thousands of wired MoveOn members voted for the most effective. The 15 most popular will be judged Monday in New York, and the winning ad will air the same week President Bush gives his State of the Union address.
MoveOn was founded by Wes Boyd and Joan Blades, computer entrepreneurs who also created the flying toaster computer screen saver, during the Clinton impeachment debate as an online petition urging Congress to censure him and move on to other business.
Today, MoveOn claims 2.3 million members whose energy has been channeled into advocacy and millions of dollars for anti-Bush ads — much of it coming in very small donations from people who never gave to politicians before.
"It's been a magic injection of courage and backbone for the Democratic party in many ways," said Democratic consultant Jenny Backus. "We've been overwhelmed by talk radio and Republicans' ability to stir up their base, and MoveOn has really stepped into that void."
With six paid staffers and Boyd and Blades serving as full-time volunteers, MoveOn has applied some of the same Silicon Valley strategies that turned eBay and Google into powerhouses.
The site is organized in ways traditional political consultants might not stomach. Any member can propose priorities and strategies to which others can respond, and the most-supported ideas rise to the top.
That means ceding control over much of the content to motivated online participants, producing interactivity that adds grass-roots credibility.
It also adds risk: When the GOP discovered that one of the 1,500 anti-Bush ad entries compared the president to Adolf Hitler, Republican National Committee Chairman Ed Gillespie called it "political hate speech" and demanded that the nine Democratic presidential candidates repudiate it.
Boyd quickly removed the proposed ad but promised not to be scared off.
"The lesson (traditional consultants) learned from that is, don't bring people in because they may say something that might reflect badly on you," Boyd said. "We have to be very deliberate and not let it change how we do things."
Once the MoveOn community arrives at a decision, it can move with lightning speed. Its "flash campaigns" can flood congressional offices with hundreds of thousands of phone calls and online petitions in a matter of days.
It also has attracted powerful allies. In November, billionaire philanthropist George Soros and his business partner, Peter Lewis, pledged a $5 million matching grant — a dollar for every two raised by MoveOn members — to create a $15 million advertising campaign to defeat President Bush. National Republican Senatorial Committee Chairman George Allen responded with an online petition denouncing Soros.
Boyd and Blades have tried to maintain a low profile during MoveOn's rise to fame. They've also tried to steer the organization toward "progressive" issues and avoid topics such as abortion rights and gun control that could rupture their members' unity.
"We grow stronger when we engage in an area where there is some frustration and broad consensus," Boyd said, "as opposed to partisans beating themselves over the head about cultural issues which get media attention and horse race coverage."
MoveOn's main target may be Bush and his allies, but its tactics also are a slap at Democrats. Boyd says they generally lack leadership and creativity, and could learn something from MoveOn's amateurs.
"In talking to a lot of the campaigns, you realize they're all run by the same group of a dozen professionals." Boyd said. "They're like carnies, they go from campaign to campaign, and the only way they can lose is doing something that seems stupid so they never try anything new."
Despite MoveOn's considerable buzz, it has yet to prove it can make voters turn out at the polls.
"They've shown us how to raise money but I don't know what it means electorally yet," Backus said, "and Republicans want the public to think of Democrats as elitist. That's the danger of an Internet-based strategy."
On the Net:
MoveOn: http://www.moveon.org
© Copyright 2004 The Associated Press###
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So even if you give only 10 bux to Moveon.org for their ad campaign, Soros and Lewis will give $5. I think since Soros worked with George Bush at one time, he must know him better than most anyone. ;) |
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| occrider |
| quote: | Originally posted by PHALPAX
ah yes, MoveOn.org....my homepage.:) |
You know what I love best about Moveon.org?
| quote: |
MoveOn.org delivered more than 15,000 email messages from constituents to Congress in support of the McCain-Feingold campaign finance reform bill today. The group launched the effort on Monday, March 19th, asking its members to sign and pass along a petition which says: "We believe Congress must: Immediately enact the McCain-Feingold bill banning Soft Money."
In the last election, more than $450 million was raised and spent in unregulated, unlimited political contributions known as Soft Money.
"Americans are demanding reform," said MoveOn.org founder Wes Boyd. "With charges of corruption coming from every side, ordinary citizens are losing faith in the integrity of our democratic system."
Last fall, MoveOn.org's members chose campaign finance reform as their top priority "great goal" for the country, in an online forum conducted at the group's website. 97% of respondents agreed that "We need equitable and common sense Campaign Finance Reform. To give the voice of America back to her people, we need campaign finance reforms to eliminate corporate welfare and give the voice back to the people, not special interests and lobbyists." This goal was proposed by Marlene Jones of Richmond, Kentucky.
http://www.moveon.org/press/pr/release032201.htm |
| quote: |
George Soros may be the new central banker of the Democratic Party. He's given $10 million to America Coming Together, a Democratic voter mobilization group aimed at defeating President Bush. He pledged another $2.5 million to the liberal group Moveon.org for a television advertising campaign highlighting "Bush policy failures," and as much as $3 million to a new Democratic think tank, the Center for American Progress.
http://www.campaignlegalcenter.org/press-943.html
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Goddamn I love the hypocrisy associated with politics :)
Hmmmm I wonder how much flaming this thread is going to take before it is officially decreed as crap and moved to the polit forum. |
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| whiskers |
| quote: | Originally posted by occrider
Hmmmm I wonder how much flaming this thread is going to take before it is officially decreed as crap and moved to the polit forum. |
i think it's halfway there... i didn't really want it to be a political thread thus i posted it here, but what else can you expect with a tagline like that? ;)
carry on! |
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| Elmo-On-XTC |
| quote: | Originally posted by Ian^
I dont see personally what the big fuss about him is, he's just a kid with a toy he can't control |
he's the dictator of a democratic nation
he's a tool
he lies, prevents the truth from being revealed, has middle eastern oil as his #1 priority and not to mention became the President of the most powerful nation in the world without being voted into power. But the public would rather watch "American Idol" & "Survivor" than question his presidency.
edit: i should say wasn't officially voted into power...we'll never know to real results of the election recount |
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| DaveSaenz |
| quote: | Originally posted by jonSun
Bush has followed through with everything he said he was going to do about the middle east. |
I don't remember, "making the world hate us" being part of his plan, but I do recall something about African uranium, WMDs, and imminent threats...
| quote: |
Bush aint the but at least he's got the balls to do something about the middle east & bring democracy to the middle east for the first time ever. No other world leader has done it. |
It remains to be seen what will happen in Iraq, but perhaps it would be best to split the country into 3 factions. Now that the US has invaded after alienating most of our old allies, we do have a responsibility to that region.
Anyways, you're forgetting how hard Clinton worked to get an Israeli/Palestinian peace settlement. When Israel laid everything on the table, that was the closest that region has ever been to true peace in 50 years. I do blame Arafat for his unwillingness to compromise when a reasonable Israeli administration was at the negotiating table, and I believe the Palestinians deserve a better leader than him. They deserve a Gandhi or a Martin Luther King Jr.
Bush is really only a puppet of Cheney, Wolfowitz, Perle, Rumsfeld, Enron, ExxonMobil, etc. He always has been from day one. |
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| Elmo-On-XTC |
| quote: | Originally posted by DigiNut
I tend to hover near the political center, and those ads were hard even for me to swallow, so I doubt that the right-wing American majority is going to put too much stock into them. |
I know thats opinion and all but some are factual.
the U.S. has a $200 billion budget surplus when clinton left and bush took over (correct me if im wrong) and it now stands at a $400 billion deficit.
That fact that youth will be the ones to pay off America's debt when Bush is out of office...their the ones who will be paying the taxes. (unless of course bush has a Fight Club-like plan to erase all debt and financial records to put this world into chaos :eek: )
i mean, these views are exaggerated...it's not unusual to be running in a deficit or increase taxes, but it's obvious that since bush took over (despite the rise in GNP of the states in 2004) the economy is headed downhill...corporations and CEO's will account for half the wealth in America sooner or later |
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| Elmo-On-XTC |
| quote: | Originally posted by jonSun
Bush aint the but at least he's got the balls to do something about the middle east & bring democracy to the middle east for the first time ever. No other world leader has done it. |
well yeah, you're right...previously the U.S. has assasinated democratic leaders and put dictators in charge so this is a step up. however, making two key players in one of the largest U.S. oil corporations (unocol?) in power in afghanistan (sp?) doesn't sound like he's doing this for the good of the people in the middle east |
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