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Budget 2004: Your feedback (pg. 3)
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| Beemer |
| quote: | Originally posted by tubby
funny how quickly this turned from a debate on economic and social policy to an argument over the personalities in politics. Exactly the sort of behaviour we find juvenile in parliament, and we got there in only a couple of hours :)
must say it's more amusing than the work I should be doing, now if only we could have an all-in brawl, taiwan politics style.... |
why is it juvenile?? discussing the personalities is always just another facet in an over-all political debate.....if it's ALL u talk about, then yes it's a bit juvenile - but if it's one thing among many, what's the problem with it???
eta - and it's a bit hard to discuss labor's current economic and social policy when they don't really seem to have any!! aside from the "let's just kick the opposition - that'll impress the average joe voter...and we won't bother formulating anything to offer as an alternative cos mr average joe isn't smart enough to worry about that" policy........... |
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| Chookie |
| quote: | Originally posted by Paulie
HAHHAHAH @ this labour love.
- Lets not bitch about single or low income earners cause if you have no family you have the ability to work more to earn more. Families are where the money is needed.
It works both way guys. |
That's bull, I earn all in Welfare, but I guess I should have gone to uni and done law or something so I can earn money, oh but wait a sec, I can't afford to go to uni and I can barely afford to go to TAFE with the increase in fees.
Maybe I should just become a slave to the rich to earn more money, but that it ed up the arse! |
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| 00soups00 |
| quote: | Originally posted by webmeister
@ Beemer...
Why is that disgusting? He's from the outer Western suburbs and did grow up poor, and only went to uni because it was free back then.
Given the choice between a genuine person and a fake, serial liar like John Howard I know which I'd be choosing every time.
And who says he has no idea how to run the country? When has he had the opportunity to prove himself? |
Webmeister.. just a query.. howcome people say they 'cant' afford to goto uni. isnt everyone entitled to HECS?? isnt everyone able to put away a little bit of money to save for the HECS bill at the end of the time??? i dont understand where all these people saying that uni is too expensive to go to nowadays, if everyone is entitled to HECS assistance..
i mean, sure they will have to pay of a debt at hte end of their uni time, but isnt that something that everyone has to think about when they sign up for uni not only the 'upper class' members of society.
and yes.. Mark Latham is a twat, and is trying to appeal to voters just the same as John Howard is.. now not everyone may like the decisions that howard has made during his time as leader, but in my opinion is has done a pretty good job considering the predicament the world has been in lately, and australia's part in that too.
in the end, you cant please 20million people all of the time can you. |
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| bragi |
| quote: | Originally posted by Paulie
Bragi: You say earn 80K+ but feel guilty about where the tax cuts coming from. Ohh ing please cry me a river. You have no guilt whatsoever. I dont feel sorry for you, and i dont feel sorry for the people the tax cuts are coming from. |
:conf:
is it really impossible to seperate how you feel about something socially and what you do as a job?
i've worked my butt off, all the way through school to get where I am. I don't feel guilty for earning what I do, I've worked damn hard to get to this point.
I don't even feel guilty if i DO get a tax cut. In fact, I don't feel any guilt over any of it at all, because IT'S NOT MY FAULT. I don't even feel guilty for giving up years of my life to learn what I did to get me in this job.
What I do feel is that the policies shown through the budget are socially disasterous. What I do feel is that I don't care wether I get a tax cut or not. What I do feel is that more money needs to go to the lower end of the spectrum, and the best place to get it is from those so far up the spectrum they wouldn't even notice if you lopped a zero off the end of their bank balance.
Is it a sane and rational world that I pay more in tax for a job protecting people's money than someone earns PRE-tax for protecting and helping children, the elderly, the sick, the disabled, or the homeless? |
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| bassaholix |
Beemer.. you are a legend!
Hit the head of the nail right on its ugly head n drove it thru the coffin n past the 6 feet of dirt!
That mr average joe syndrome he seem to can't get rid of is geting annoying.. maybe he's way too average to run anything n should be voted out... hell i did that job he so proclaims to have done so much... n i turned out alright??? lol
Chookie is right on as well.. were screwed if we do n were screwed if we don't... its all politix, smoke n mirrors n everything else.
btw.. Paulie, that was a little harsh on bragi, u might wanna let up... just a quick question?
What do you do? work/school/centralink? |
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| lethal |
Soups just to give you a bit of an idea of WHY people arent being able to afford to go to uni.......
Its true HECS covers COURSE fees however it doenst cover uni fees (at the moment im paying just under $600 a year of these!) or textbooks (which usually are compulsory if youd like to pass the course - i spend at least $500 a year on textbooks and before someone says thats overspending you should know ive only resold 2 of those textbooks cause they ALL come in handy!) but thats not the part that kills prospective students!
My situation - i get no help from my parents (because they cant afford to help me), i recieve some centrelink (not enough to pay my rent each month if that was my sole source of income) but luckily i worked my ass off during high school and got a scholarship. I also have worked a fulltime job every summer holiday for the last 3 years. And before i came to sydney for uni i had $8000 in the bank that id saved from working every weekend for the previous 3 years.
Now even with the scholarship, work and centrelink im going to come out of uni with a maximum of about $3000 in the bank (prolly much less!).
I ask you, how are people from poor backgrounds who didnt have that savings safety net and the scholarship going to pay for university??? You need to remember that most people under the poverty line or close to it dont have the family background to encourage them to work hard at school to try and get a scholarship nor do they have the professional skills to get a part time job to supplement their income that way. And if you have to live away from home to go to uni - kiss that idea good bye unless youve got a very steady income stream coming in!
I hope that gives you a better idea of the REAL situation facing prospective uni students.... :)
Oh and ill write up my ideas on the budget after ive had more time to look into it in greater details.
One last thing...:rolleyes: Alli what policies hasnt Mark Latham given a plan for?? Dont just say all of them - give me an example... cause as far as i can remember everytime hes shot down a Liberal policy he has provided an alternative....... except for the shutting down of ATSIC but then Liberal hasnt said whats going to replace it either so i hardly think you can use that as an example! |
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| Chookie |
Well said Lethal, you just saved my brain from exploding.
I was going to add that it's also difficult to get into uni if you went to a public school with heads and for vaious reasons you can't get good marks.
Not everyone is intelligent enough to get into uni, in fact maybe they would have a chance if they had tutoring or if they went to a private school and had special treatment.
My situation is very different from that, I went to a public school, had a hard time at school due to ed up people, I started volunteering to help people with disabilities and reliased this is where my skills are.
We need people like me to work in Welfare, but unfortunatelty it pays and is often seen as unvaluable work.
Maybe I should just have some babies so I can get $3000 payout.
(does anyone know if this $3000 is just for disadvantaged people or do the rich get this too?) |
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| stamper |
| quote: | Originally posted by Paulie
- A SUM of $3000 to be paid to mothers on the birth of every new baby - with the payment to increase to $5000 over the next four years;
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Me thinks theres going to be a sudden influx of 15 year-old girls with Fubu jackets pushing prams around the local shopping centre. :whip: :whip: |
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| matt_a |
Geez stop whinging.
Does the budget really effect your lives that much! no
Has any other budget ever effected our lives that greatly? no
Would you still be whinging no matter who was in power? yes
Can the government please everybody? no
Remember you are not the only person living in Australia, the budget isn't actually going to effect you much at all.
When people say the government is trying to win votes . . doesn't that mean the government is doing what a majority want? Isn't that the role of a government! Think about it!
Just because there isn't a point in there saying you will pay no tax, and earn millions of dollars, does not mean that it is an irrisponsible government, or are making stupid decisions. Don't be so selfish, and realise that there are a load more people in the country other than yourself.
No matter which government was in power and released the budget, you'd whinge anyway. In two months time you wont even remember what was in the budget, it will have effected you so littly.
When it comes to State government that does matter, because everyone needs good hospitals, transport, education etc. It's a pity the state government has incompetant ministers like Michael Costa running public transport . . . hell is a coming.
*end rant at you all* |
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| escee |
The amount of idiocy in this thread is astounding.
Voting at the election will be as easy or hard as it was last term.
Good economic conditions = Liberal.
Good welfare system, health system, uni system = Labour.
Wasted votes = Greens, democrats, etc.
Personally, ill be voting liberal. Mark latham needs another term as the opposition before he is ready imo. |
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| matt_a |
| quote: | Originally posted by escee
The amount of idiocy in this thread is astounding.
Voting at the election will be as easy or hard as it was last term.
Good economic conditions = Liberal.
Good welfare system, health system, uni system = Labour.
Wasted votes = Greens, democrats, etc.
Personally, ill be voting liberal. Mark latham needs another term as the opposition before he is ready imo. |
What he said . . scary thing is i get to vote this time! :nervous: |
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| lethal |
Matt the budget does have a fairly big effect on a lot of peoples lives, not everyones but a lot of peoples. And your right that in 2 months none of us will be talking about the budget but thats because at that point there will be nothing we can do about it...
The sort of discussions were all having now are what happens in a good democracy, because as people talk about political decisions HOPEFULLY the views of the people will reach the ears of members of parliament (thats what their there for!) and hopefully if theres an issue such as education or health funding in the budget that the people are unhappy with that gets back to the members and they vote no to the budget and the budget changes slightly to reflect the views of the people before getting passed.
I hope you dont think im talking down to you matt but you dont seem to realise just how important good political debate is and how important the budget is (seeing as thats decides where all our taxes go). Oh and fyi - its the federal government who decides how much money goes to hospitals and education and transport! The states get to decide who gets that money but the amount of money is decided in THIS budget - so it is a fairly big deal!! :)
I will say one positive thing about this budget after the very quick perousal ive given it - im glad theres no major increase in funding for the defense forces - until they learn how to spend the money theyve got efficiently i dont think they should be given more!!! :mad: |
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