|
What The Hell Are Us Lefties Doing Wrong (pg. 2)
|
View this Thread in Original format
| biznology |
whatre we doing wrong?
not oversimplifying things for simpletons.
both right/left-conservative/noncons have reality based arguments that hold true in various situations. the right are just better at using vague terminology like 'moral value' to sway voters that either dont know enough about how the international world works - or dont care to and only care about their personal taxes...| |
|
|
| Rodas |
Also, I use "lefties" as a loose term.
I actually like Barack Obama's views and positions (I've seen alot of people throw his name around as a strong candidate for 2008's primaries), and I'm definitely more close to what he believes in. I think he would definitely be a good candidate but that’s me honestly.
Is America ready for a black president? Sure he is half white, but do you actually think that America would go for that? There are still conservatives out there who don't believe that people of color should have the same rights that those who don't do.
Hey you never know.. Even Sharpton was ahead of Kerry in the polls during the primaries.
The other thing is that Obama's now in the senate, thus I believe that his voting will haunt him like it did with Kerry (god forbid). But I don't think that he would "change positions" like Kerry was haunted for. He kind of took a shot at Kerry for doing that in an interview with Holmes (I don't remember exactly what he said but search for the transcript).
If he was to ever win the primaries I would support him 100%.
Rodas |
|
|
| Q5echo |
Obama = centrist thats probably why you would support him
Sharpton = separatist |
|
|
| wolverine16 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Q5echo
Obama = centrist thats probably why you would support him
Sharpton = separatist |
Obama is a great man, I'm so glad he won, but if he is a centrist, then how is Kerry "the most liberal in the Senate"? |
|
|
| Q5echo |
| quote: | Originally posted by wolverine16
Obama is a great man, I'm so glad he won, but if he is a centrist, than how is Kerry "the most liberal in the Senate"? |
compared to Sharpton, ideologically, as a black leader, he is a centrist.
i'm not familiar with his voting record |
|
|
| wolverine16 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Q5echo
compared to Sharpton, ideologically, as a black leader, he is a centrist.
i'm not familiar with his voting record |
OK, that's quite a fair evaluation. Obama is definately not Sharpton. He's a very religious man and a progressive politician, which is very representative of the constituency he has represented in the state senate. |
|
|
| Rodas |
| quote: | Originally posted by Q5echo
Obama = centrist thats probably why you would support him
Sharpton = separatist |
Exactly. And you know what? I think that's o.k.
Hell, even if someone isn't so far left or far right, someone who is at least moderate to both parties and shows it... That is something that I'd really like to see.
Hopefully someone who is honest and a "leader" and not just like "ok, we give up".
Let’s be honest, I know the Republican's would definitely like to see a republican leader obviously, and democrats would like to have a Democratic leader than the other way around. But like spoken earlier, even if someone like Juliani was elected and could be a moderate leader in agreeing with both sides without the arrogance and the other issue's that I believe are a factor in today's democracy, then I definitely think that it is something that most could agree on. Clinton managed to do build something with his two terms, now it just seems as if we’re back at stage one all over again.
It can be done.
Rodas |
|
|
| NiteKiD |
| quote: | Originally posted by Q5echo
it's a little something called "core values". liberals, by nature, don't have them. at least not in way one would define outlining a specific ideology that encompassed the entire group.
if you could, then you would need a leader. thats the second problem. who? who will lead you? who would you give legitamacy to?
no one really.
why? you figure it out. i bet it takes you decades and then the youth of tomorrow will rebel against you too. it's a vicious cycle...that only happens in this way in America. |
All depends on what you consider core values my friend. If it’s the lessons you live by in order to make you a better person, lessons you learn from your parents, religion, and self-experience, than I assure you liberals do have a set of core values.
If your definition of having core values includes imposing your values on others, such as unwavering opposition to gay marriage and abortion, then you’re right, that’s the conservative agenda and many liberals don’t believe in it
Here’s the dictionary.com definition which I think does it justice explaining the ideology:
A political theory founded on the natural goodness of humans and the autonomy of the individual and favoring civil and political liberties, government by law with the consent of the governed, and protection from arbitrary authority.
Whatwas the rest of your post about? We cant find a leader? Leader for what? Seemed all like just a set up just to get to your irrelevant punchline. |
|
|
| Shakka |
| quote: | Originally posted by Rodas
"Liberals aren't as outspoken as conservatives” claim.. I would have to say I disagree (at least not the one’s I know). Air America seems to be taking over AM Radio as of now.. |
Air America is outspoken, but all they preach is hate and arrogance. I listen to the webcast whenever I want a cheap laugh. |
|
|
| policerobots |
There are many things that the dems could have done otherwise (looking in hindsight) to help them win the election. However, the one that stands out most in my mind is that they tried too damn hard to cover every position in the country, and not try to piss anyone off. (And of course, if everyone is happy with your position, something is wrong.)
Simple is what works and essentially what the republicans did. Look at the RNC, every speech was out there hammering about national security, 9/11, defending our country, and etc.
While for an outsider watching it it might sound stubborn and simplistic, it is the message that people remember. Republicans really sent the idea about Bush being the post 9-11 president who will stand up to terrorists, while John Kerry, on the other hand, tried to tackle iraq, healthcare, fiscal deficit, and a whole bunch of other issues that just sounded quite frankly like a typical politician.
You're average joe cant remember every issue Kerry is talking about in this country. Talk smack about the average joe and how dumb he is as much as you want, but in the end you still need his vote. As MacArthur said, "There is no substitute for victory." |
|
|
| NiteKiD |
| quote: | Originally posted by Shakka
Air America is outspoken, but all they preach is hate and arrogance. I listen to the webcast whenever I want a cheap laugh. |
Not any more hateful/arrogant than Limbaugh :)
if u wanna use those words. Id use conviction, and im glad they realized that's what they need to reach the masses |
|
|
| Shakka |
| quote: | Originally posted by NiteKiD
Not any more hateful/arrogant than Limbaugh :)
if u wanna use those words. Id use conviction, and im glad they realized that's what they need to reach the masses |
I dunno, IMHO, Air America Radio has lacked any substance when I've listened to it. Limbaugh may be loud and outspoken, but he tends to address issues whereas a lot of the people on Air America just spout hate and call people on the right names. Garoffolo and Franken have made a new career out of it. |
|
|
|
|
