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US should mind their own business (pg. 5)
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| tiesto14 |
| quote: | Originally posted by brashy
Perhaps you should consult other news sources, especially from foreign countries. You would be indeed surprised by the amount of brainwashing you have been exposed to by now.
+ thanks all for your opinions
+ thanks shaolin for yr support |
Do they sell nice tin foil hats in Jersey? |
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| tiesto14 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Spacey Orange
the very existence of the US depends upon on its ability to conquer or control. |
Doesnt the existence of the world depend on that?...Survival of the fittest...lol |
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| George Smiley |
Anyways, here's my two penneth (not two cents worth! bloody Americans should mind their own God damn business forcing their culture and silly sayings on the civilised world!!)
There are many examples of when people have wanted America to intervine (well, not neccissarily America but the international community) like in Bosnia. If the US intervines on behalf of the UN (like in the Balkans or Somalia) then fine. When else should they intervine? When their security (or others) is jepardised I will give. But the problem here is that you get wars like Iraq where they claimed it was for security (but it blatently isn't) and then when everyone realised it had all to do with security, it was about spreading democracy! If that is their aim (and it is an official neo-con policy to spread democracy) then they are quite capable of funding oppositions (when it is established that the opposition speak for the masses and they do want democracy - not some Pinochet wannabe) like in Afghanistan. If a conflict has broken out then America - with or without the UN's say so - and any other nation should get involved to keep the peace. There are only two actors in the world capable of taking on high level military operations - NATO and America, so you can see why people complain when America does not get involved (the EU is currently developing a capability in order to carry out high level military operations) This is also why I object to criticism at the UN for not doing enough to prevent attrocities - cos the UN has no military. Only NATO and America have the planning, control and command structures to take on high level ops so when they dont wanna get involved, there's not much the UN can do (if its a complex situation, obviously minor conflicts can be done by one country, such as operations carried out by the French or British).
But unfortunately, America is not concerned about humanitarian missions (even under Clinton they made it clear the Balkan conflicts were European problems to be sorted out by the EU). There is no way America will get dragged down in UN missions when it needs its troops where they are. America does not have the resources to fight another Iraq-type war for years - but obviously the current administration require that option so resources are gonna be directed at Iraq-style wars, and UN missions would divert resources away from that aim (this is why I think it is crucial the EU pulls its finger out of its arse and fully implements the Helsinki Headline Goals ASAP cos the EU's military raisin d'etre IS to carry out humanitarian missions)
So should the US mind its own business? Yes and no! If, one day with a new regime in charge America does feel the need to carry out humanitarian tasks then of course it should do everything in its powers to help. But under the current ideology then obviously it should "mind its own business" - but we all know that aint gonna happen!
US policy is centred around economic objectives. This is why there is tension with all and sundry in the Middle East right now and also explains the tension over Korea and Taiwan (S Korea and Taiwan both "allies" which means they are worth a bob or two to the Americans!) But I cant for the life of me see any conflicts over N Korea or Taiwan (not involving America anyway) so I guess the US will continue not minding its own business in the Middle East (altho no invasions for several years!) |
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| George Smiley |
Yea I was gonna say summat too!
Congress (who control the US economy) refuse to pay anything to the UN. In fact the US owes the UN billions of $!! |
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| zig |
| quote: | Originally posted by George Smiley
Yea I was gonna say summat too!
Congress (who control the US economy) refuse to pay anything to the UN. In fact the US owes the UN billions of $!! |
Yep the links above are for 2004 2005......in 2005 they havent paid a penny yet and payments are due each month...... |
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| zig |
A short list of questions for our American world helpers......
1. Which is the only country in the world to have dropped bombs on over twenty countries since 1945?
2. Which is the only country to have to have used nuclear weapons to take the lives of thousands of civilians?
3. Which country was responsible for a car bomb which killed 80 civilians in Beirut in 1985, making it the most lethal terrorist bombing in the middle east?
4. Which countrys illegal bombing of Libya in 1986 was described by the UN Legal Committee as a classic case of "terrorism".
5. Which country rejected the order of the International Court of Justice to terminate "its unlawful use of force" against Nicuragua in 1986, and then vetoed a UN security council resolution calling on all states to observe international law.
6. Which country was accused by a UN sponsered truth commission of providing "direct" and indirect support for acts of genocide in Guatamala in the 1980s.
7. Which country unilaterally withdrew from the anti ballistic missile treaty in 2001.
8 Which country renounced the efforts to negotiate a verification process for the biological weapons convention and brought an international conference to a halt in 2001.
9. Which country prevented the UN from curbing the gun trade at an arms conference in 2001.
10. Which country apart from Somalia has refused to ratify the UN convention on the rights of the child (For military reasons i might add). You could also ask another question here....which is the only western country to allow the death penalty to apply to chrildren.
11. Which is the only G7 country to not sign the 1997 mine ban treaty, forbidding the use of landmines.
12. Which is the only G7 country to have voted against the creation of the International Criminal Court in 1998.
13. Which was the only other country to join with Israel in opposing in 1987 a General Assembly resolution condemning international terrorism.
14. And lastly which country refuses to fully pay its debts to the UN but reserves the right to veto United Nation Resolutions.
hhhmmmmmm......quite a list.....i could add much more..... |
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| tiesto14 |
| quote: | Originally posted by zig
A short list of questions for our American world helpers......
1. Which is the only country in the world to have dropped bombs on over twenty countries since 1945?
2. Which is the only country to have to have used nuclear weapons to take the lives of thousands of civilians?
3. Which country was responsible for a car bomb which killed 80 civilians in Beirut in 1985, making it the most lethal terrorist bombing in the middle east?
4. Which countrys illegal bombing of Libya in 1986 was described by the UN Legal Committee as a classic case of "terrorism".
5. Which country rejected the order of the International Court of Justice to terminate "its unlawful use of force" against Nicuragua in 1986, and then vetoed a UN security council resolution calling on all states to observe international law.
6. Which country was accused by a UN sponsered truth commission of providing "direct" and indirect support for acts of genocide in Guatamala in the 1980s.
7. Which country unilaterally withdrew from the anti ballistic missile treaty in 2001.
8 Which country renounced the efforts to negotiate a verification process for the biological weapons convention and brought an international conference to a halt in 2001.
9. Which country prevented the UN from curbing the gun trade at an arms conference in 2001.
10. Which country apart from Somalia has refused to ratify the UN convention on the rights of the child (For military reasons i might add). You could also ask another question here....which is the only western country to allow the death penalty to apply to chrildren.
11. Which is the only G7 country to not sign the 1997 mine ban treaty, forbidding the use of landmines.
12. Which is the only G7 country to have voted against the creation of the International Criminal Court in 1998.
13. Which was the only other country to join with Israel in opposing in 1987 a General Assembly resolution condemning international terrorism.
14. And lastly which country refuses to fully pay its debts to the UN but reserves the right to veto United Nation Resolutions.
hhhmmmmmm......quite a list.....i could add much more..... |
oh please..like u couldnt make a list of every other country....:rolleyes: |
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| Shakka |
Heh. That's a convenient diversion, but I'm afraid what you've done is a stealthy attempt to dodge the issue. What you've pointed out is how much the U.S. supposedly owes the U.N., not how much the U.S. pays/has paid to fund the inept organization. I suggest you go back and read beyond 2005 and look at each year they have information on from 1992-2005 and tell me who is at the very top of each list in terms of absolute dollars paid. Hint: It rhymes with "Uncle Sam". So the U.S. apparently carries a lot of debt, but that's certainly not the exception to the rule if you look at the tables. Additionally, we're talking about more than just dues.
I'd post more charts if they were in image format, but they are not, so go here and look through them all yourself.
Not the exception
| quote: | America's $1.7 Billion Debt to the UN
Dateline: 10/31/99
From Where the UN Stands
According to the United Nations, the United States owes them $1.7 billion in unpaid dues and must pay $550 million of that amount by the end of 1999 or lose its vote in the UN General Assembly.
The U.S. is far from the only debtor UN nation. Secretary-General Kofi Annan has told the U.N. budget committee that without $2.15 billion in total unpaid dues by member states, "We cannot rationally manage the United Nations."
Secretary-General Annan points out that the United Nations had allotted $900 million for peacekeeping in 1999, but it had to reduce that amount to $650 million due to the shortfall in back dues.
From Where the US Congress Stands
There are currently three bills before the US Congress addressing the UN debt, each in very different ways:
1. Pay them (some of it)
2. Don't pay them (any of it)
3. Get the US of the UN altogether [Online Poll]
...more
Don't Pay Them (Any of It)
H.R. 346, To prohibit the payment to the United Nations of any contributions by the United States until United States overpayments to such body have been properly credited or reimbursed., sponsored by Rep. Roscoe G. Bartlett (R. MD), proposes that the US debt claimed by the UN is erroneous due to unreimbursed expenses of $4.7 billion for peacekeeping services incurred by the United States during the years 1992 - 1995. |
In an older story...
| quote: | ...The United States is the largest contributor to the United Nations but also its largest debtor, owing about $1.7bn, according to UN figures.
However, Washington puts the amount at closer to $1bn. ... |
http://www.cato.org/dailys/6-15-98.html
| quote: | | The United States paid more than $11 billion for international peacekeeping efforts between 1992 and 1997. |
| quote: | | True, Congress has withheld some money from the UN: some members believe we are being overcharged, and others want to force UN reform. But it's also true that the administration has been diverting additional billions of dollars to assist the UN without asking it to credit them against our "dues." |
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| zig |
Your origional statement was that the US bankrolls the UN.....
Hardly likely, if you havent paid a penny in 2005.....and owe hundreds of millions........
I will research it further tomorrow......but i do remember a certain memeber of your congress or senate who blocked payments for years...year after year...... |
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| Fir3start3r |
| quote: | Originally posted by zig
A short list of questions for our American world helpers......
1. Which is the only country in the world to have dropped bombs on over twenty countries since 1945?
2. Which is the only country to have to have used nuclear weapons to take the lives of thousands of civilians?
3. Which country was responsible for a car bomb which killed 80 civilians in Beirut in 1985, making it the most lethal terrorist bombing in the middle east?
4. Which countrys illegal bombing of Libya in 1986 was described by the UN Legal Committee as a classic case of "terrorism".
5. Which country rejected the order of the International Court of Justice to terminate "its unlawful use of force" against Nicuragua in 1986, and then vetoed a UN security council resolution calling on all states to observe international law.
6. Which country was accused by a UN sponsered truth commission of providing "direct" and indirect support for acts of genocide in Guatamala in the 1980s.
7. Which country unilaterally withdrew from the anti ballistic missile treaty in 2001.
8 Which country renounced the efforts to negotiate a verification process for the biological weapons convention and brought an international conference to a halt in 2001.
9. Which country prevented the UN from curbing the gun trade at an arms conference in 2001.
10. Which country apart from Somalia has refused to ratify the UN convention on the rights of the child (For military reasons i might add). You could also ask another question here....which is the only western country to allow the death penalty to apply to chrildren.
11. Which is the only G7 country to not sign the 1997 mine ban treaty, forbidding the use of landmines.
12. Which is the only G7 country to have voted against the creation of the International Criminal Court in 1998.
13. Which was the only other country to join with Israel in opposing in 1987 a General Assembly resolution condemning international terrorism.
14. And lastly which country refuses to fully pay its debts to the UN but reserves the right to veto United Nation Resolutions.
hhhmmmmmm......quite a list.....i could add much more..... |
Maybe you could quote your source next time? There's no shame in admitting you couldn't think up things yourself.
That's a nice U.S. bashing list but hardly supports the arguement of why the U.S. helps other nations the way it does.
The point of the whole thread is why does the U.S. get involved?
| quote: | Originally posted by zig
HUGE pieces of land? What the are you on? Before they were colonized/massacred/conquered they had ALL of the land. The european colonizer had no ing business being here in the first place. So I don't really see what you're point is.
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The european colonizer had no ing business being here? What??
Good greif. What a convenient and selective history we have.
Yes, HUGE pieces of land. Do a google and check it out yourself.
I've said it before and I'll say it again; it was the era of exploration and colonization. To put a finer point on it; there was nothing wrong with doing what needed to be done at that point in time. Wealth was driven by LAND and the annexing of new lands.
THAT was my point of answering the driveling question regarding the Native Americans (god knows why they even entered the equation). |
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