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Live PA question (pg. 2)
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| djmetatron |
| quote: | Originally posted by Dan1584
I'll use Infected Mushroom as my example. They basically bring along:
1 Laptop
1 Huge Mixing Board
Several Keyboard Synths
They have a pre-recorded set of their music and press play. While the set is going on they add and tweak instrumentation. Duvdev stands behind the mixer and utilizes it's functions, Erez adds synth lines and melodies with the keyboards. They have recently added a guitarist to play the guitar parts live. Duvdev also occasionally sings as well. |
I saw them live and it seemed like a hoax. The one guy stood still behind the laptop giving glaring looks at the croud while the other guy just danced behind the huge mixer twisting nobs every once in a while. I'm somewhat of a dj and I'm pretty familiar with effects and mixer functions and it really didn't seem like they were doing anything.
One REAL live PA I saw was Mano-Destra at The Ohm in Portland, OR. It was a one man show and it was really brilliant. He had a drum machine which he fiddled with (and when he fiddled with it, the drums actually changed). He had 2 keyboards set up, and you could tell he was actually playing them, and he would put one on a loop and move to the other :). I think he had prerecorded the basslines and some of the melodies (cause he obviously couldn't do it all), but pretty much all of the rest was done on the spot. A really awesome show and I'm waiting for him to do another. I'm pretty sure this is what a live PA is all about.
edit: also, there was no laptop, I think a laptop is pretty much antithesis to what a live PA is. |
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| twisted |
| quote: | Originally posted by djmetatron
edit: also, there was no laptop, I think a laptop is pretty much antithesis to what a live PA is. |
im not sure how a laptop is a antithesis to what live pa is. that doesnt make much sense to me. pa stands for preformance, and there are countless artists who have shows with ONLY laptops, i guess that varies from genre to genre, artist to artist among a load of other things... |
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| djmetatron |
| quote: | Originally posted by twisted
im not sure how a laptop is a antithesis to what live pa is. that doesnt make much sense to me. pa stands for preformance, and there are countless artists who have shows with ONLY laptops, i guess that varies from genre to genre, artist to artist among a load of other things... |
actually PA stands for Public Address... |
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| twisted |
| quote: | Originally posted by djmetatron
actually PA stands for Public Address... |
damn you do got me there :D |
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| Philby |
| quote: | Originally posted by Psy-T
in the 'playback' type of a liveact the gear is there not for 'show' but for the actual playback.
supposing the entire liveact is midi based, had the artist not brought his gear (including vsti's), all you would hear is a computers interpretation of the midi notes.... |
ah ok i didnt think of it that way. what i mean is that a lot of the time nobody seems to be "playing" anything, like when you have a synth or piano melody nobody is actually playing that out on the keyboard or something. that kind of takes it away a bit i think, its not really that different from a dj set of just the artist's own tunes. |
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| Pippins |
Hello all.
I could not help, posting my point of view on this forum.
To introduce myself, DJ Pippins is my stage name, and I've done some Public gigs. I mostly do Trance, Ambient, Techno inspired by PVD. I rarely would use vocal tracks, as I find them distracting for dance music. (There are some exceptions though!)
Now, firstly I'd completely disgree with djmetatron here. You say you are "somewhat of a DJ". So, you really don't have to bash any other DJ's just because they use laptop.
I use 2 PENTIUM 4 laptop, running ABLETON LIVE 4 on one, and re-wired Reason to the other.
I don't know how other DJ's do it, but I do it like this usually.
I have around 50-70 tracks in WAV format, in a folder directory. Only the intro (very important in a gig) and the first 30 mins are pre-sequenced. These are usually with a punched bass line drums and melodies. This gives the audience to warm up and myself too.(mentally). Then when I *get* in the mood myself, I drag in files from the folder into ABLETON LIVE.
So, what I'm saying is, I DO KNOW before-hand, what tracks I'd play, but the sequence of the songs, come real time, WHILE you are playing. Also you have to do lot of things real time. I use a UC-33 Midi controller, and hence I'm changing EQ settings, phasing and flanging, while bringing in tracks. So, for beat matching, and train-wrecking, and mashing, real time interaction is definitely needed. That's why they are called disk *jockies** ? :rolleyes:
If you folks have seen DJ's performing with laptops and doing nothing, maybe they are !! ? Otherwise, you may just play a burned CD, and play a ukelele! LOL:thepirate
Cheers!
DJ_Pippins! |
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| tranceaddict991 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Dan1584
I'll use Infected Mushroom as my example. They basically bring along:
1 Laptop
1 Huge Mixing Board
Several Keyboard Synths
They have a pre-recorded set of their music and press play. While the set is going on they add and tweak instrumentation. Duvdev stands behind the mixer and utilizes it's functions, Erez adds synth lines and melodies with the keyboards. They have recently added a guitarist to play the guitar parts live. Duvdev also occasionally sings as well. |
i saw em last friday...they basicly do live remixes of their tracks and they all sound ill |
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| SYSTEM-J |
| quote: | Originally posted by Philby
it has one of these "?" on the end of it :)
ive only seen a few live performances and i get the idea that most of the equipment is for show because everything seems to be sequenced before hand and there will be the occasional knob-twiddle or button-push. but then you can also get gigs like infusion, way out west and faithless where they have almost a whole band there as well as laptops and keyboards for the electronic stuff. i guess it depends on who you see really :) |
Faithless don't use any laptops. Faithless live is 100% analogue. |
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| placebo |
| quote: | Originally posted by Pippins
If you folks have seen DJ's performing with laptops and doing nothing, maybe they are !! ? Otherwise, you may just play a burned CD, and play a ukelele! LOL:thepirate
Cheers!
DJ_Pippins! |
:wtf: |
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| djmetatron |
| quote: | Originally posted by Pippins
...
Now, firstly I'd completely disgree with djmetatron here. You say you are "somewhat of a DJ". So, you really don't have to bash any other DJ's just because they use laptop.
I use 2 PENTIUM 4 laptop, running ABLETON LIVE 4 on one, and re-wired Reason to the other.
I don't know how other DJ's do it, but I do it like this usually.
I have around 50-70 tracks in WAV format, in a folder directory. Only the intro (very important in a gig) and the first 30 mins are pre-sequenced. These are usually with a punched bass line drums and melodies. This gives the audience to warm up and myself too.(mentally). Then when I *get* in the mood myself, I drag in files from the folder into ABLETON LIVE.
So, what I'm saying is, I DO KNOW before-hand, what tracks I'd play, but the sequence of the songs, come real time, WHILE you are playing. Also you have to do lot of things real time. I use a UC-33 Midi controller, and hence I'm changing EQ settings, phasing and flanging, while bringing in tracks. So, for beat matching, and train-wrecking, and mashing, real time interaction is definitely needed. That's why they are called disk *jockies** ? :rolleyes:
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I wasn't bashing DJs that use laptops. I was just saying that it isn't what a live PA is about. And I'm affraid what you are doing is NOT a live PA either. If that's what you were saying. It's just Ableton mixing. You do the same thing as normal DJs, you just don't use turntables, you use Ableton. :wtf: Just because you CAPITALIZE ABLETON LIVE doesn't make it a live PA.
I've got nothing against DJs that use laptops, well I do a little. Because most of the time it feels like the DJ aint doin' . Just dragin and dropin. They maybe doing more, but I just looks kinda lame to me. Infected Mushroom is a good example of this, they may have been 'remixing' or adding synths and bass, but it just looked like they were just jerkin off up there. :p I know it's more about the music, but I can't help but be affected by what the fact that I think the DJs aren't doing any work. Sasha was also an example, but I had more complaints about what he played than what he did when I saw him. PvD is an exception because all he uses a Laptop for is to load tracks using Final Scratch. Then he has to beatmatch and adjust levels and so on, and you can see him do it. :)
Back to the point, Live PAs usually consist of actual production hardware such as a sample board, drum machine and/or keyboards etc. Not a laptop where you can drag tracks into your favorite mixing program. |
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| Pippins |
Hi djmetatron.
I still disagree with you on this quote. Like I had mentioned before, Lot of work is involved, when doing a live DJ act, whatever the software is. I've sene NU NRG using Tractor, and I use Live.
Using a Laptop is no different than Vinyl. with 24-bit sound card, it can sound as good as a Vinyl.
When a track is playing, we do have to do beat-matching, mashing, EQ, and all other just like any other DJ. You have a completely wrong idea in your head, that laptop does all the work for you. All the laptop does, is PLAY the track, just like a Vinyl spinning.
You must have been seeing the wrong kind of all new kids on the block Wannabee DJ's. Who is Infected Mushrooms anyway ?
I've actually had the chance to meet PVD in person, and have talked to him, and was behind Armin in the DJ booth. So You as a DJ should know many things get involved. Let me ask you this ?
What is your technique of beat matching? Can you do a actual trainwrecking, mixed with a needle-drop, and water-drops?.
Whatever technology you use, the point is an ear for the music, and talent and techniques. I cna tell you many Vinyld DJ's who basically s***K!. Here is an example. Markus Schultz .
Saw him once, and last time. That guy has no talent. Playing all TATW tracks, and wearing funky clothes, and nodding and clapping made him a super DJ. He fades out a track........ and fades in the next... My neighbors 3 year old son can do it, with a cross-fader.:toothless
| quote: | Originally posted by djmetatron
I wasn't bashing DJs that use laptops. I was just saying that it isn't what a live PA is about. And I'm affraid what you are doing is NOT a live PA either. If that's what you were saying. It's just Ableton mixing. You do the same thing as normal DJs, you just don't use turntables, you use Ableton. :wtf: Just because you CAPITALIZE ABLETON LIVE doesn't make it a live PA.
I've got nothing against DJs that use laptops, well I do a little. Because most of the time it feels like the DJ aint doin' . Just dragin and dropin. They maybe doing more, but I just looks kinda lame to me. Infected Mushroom is a good example of this, they may have been 'remixing' or adding synths and bass, but it just looked like they were just jerkin off up there. :p I know it's more about the music, but I can't help but be affected by what the fact that I think the DJs aren't doing any work. Sasha was also an example, but I had more complaints about what he played than what he did when I saw him. PvD is an exception because all he uses a Laptop for is to load tracks using Final Scratch. Then he has to beatmatch and adjust levels and so on, and you can see him do it. :)
Back to the point, Live PAs usually consist of actual production hardware such as a sample board, drum machine and/or keyboards etc. Not a laptop where you can drag tracks into your favorite mixing program. |
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| Psiweaver |
| Bt's laptop symphony is pretty good. |
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