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Terrorist Attack or Not?
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| Spacey Orange |
I say yes, because a civilian attacked civilians over politics. My guess it you probably won't see 'terrorist' in the headlines.
| quote: | August 4, 2005
Israeli Army Deserter Opens Fire on Bus, Killing 4 Arabs
By GREG MYRE
JERUSALEM, Aug. 4 - An Israeli Army deserter dressed in a military uniform opened fire today aboard a bus carrying Arab passengers in northern Israel. Four Arabs were killed and at least a dozen wounded before an angry crowd beat the gunman to death, according to Israeli authorities and witnesses.
The shooting was one of the deadliest by a Jewish extremist in recent years and appeared to be an attempt to sabotage Israel's planned evacuation of Jewish settlers from the Gaza Strip, which is set to begin on Aug. 15.
The gunman was initially identified as Eden Tzuberi, 19, though the police later said his real name was Natan Zada. He went absent without leave from the army about a month ago after refusing to take part in preparations for the Gaza pullout, according to Israeli media reports and the police.
Mr. Zada had been living in Tapuach, one of the most radical Jewish settlements in the West Bank, according to the reports. But settler leaders denied that he was a resident of the settlement.
Israel's prime minister, Ariel Sharon, called the shootings "a reprehensible act by a bloodthirsty Jewish terrorist who sought to attack innocent Israeli citizens."
In the run up to Israel's withdrawal from Gaza, the Israeli security services have repeatedly expressed fears that radical Jews may carry out attacks against either Israeli leaders or Arabs in an attempt to sabotage the pullout.
Gideon Ezra, Israel's minister for public security, has spoken out in favor of detaining Jewish radicals without charge, saying such methods could prevent violence before and during the Gaza withdrawal.
Today's shooting, coming just 11 days before the Gaza evacuation is set to begin, is certain to further inflame passions on all sides.
"We are witnessing attempts by extreme right-wing people, terrorists, who want to set the region ablaze and feel they have freedom of action," Mohammed Barakeh, an Arab member of Israel's parliament, was quoted as saying by the Haaretz newspaper on its Web site.
Mr. Barakeh also described the gunman as a supporter of the Kach movement, which was founded by Rabbi Meir Kahane, the radical anti-Arab activist who was shot to death in New York in 1990.
While the Kach movement is outlawed in Israel, many residents of the Tapuach settlement are believed to be members or supporters.
Mr. Zada grew up in Rishon Letzion, a city in central Israel, south of Tel Aviv, but recently moved to Tapuach, according to the Israeli news reports.
The bearded gunman, who was wearing a skull cap that identified him as an Orthodox Jew, apparently boarded the bus in the northern Israeli city of Haifa and waited until it reached Shfaram, an Arab town several miles to the east.
When the bus reached the town, the bus driver asked to speak to the gunman and wanted to know if he had intended to come to the Arab town, according to Avtihaj Salameh, a passenger quoted by Haaretz.
The gunman then stood by the driver for several minutes before opening fire, according to the witness. A large crowd then charged the bus and attacked Mr. Zada, beating him to death, according to witnesses and media reports.
Israeli television showed footage of bodies on the side of the road, covered in sheets, and the broken windows of the bus.
Jewish extremists have carried out a number of attacks against Arabs in the past, but most were directed against Palestinians in the West Bank rather than Arabs who are citizens of Israel.
In the deadliest such attack, Baruch Goldstein, an American-born settler in the West Bank, fatally shot 29 Muslim worshippers in 1994 at the Tomb of the Patriarchs in Hebron, a site holy to Muslims, Jews and Christians.
As the Gaza pullout approaches, right-wing Israelis have been holding mass protests against the withdrawal, though the latest effort fizzled today.
Thousands of protesters initially gathered Tuesday night in southern Israel and camped out in the community of Ofakim, with plans to march to the Jewish settlements in Gaza.
But the police kept the demonstrators in or near Ofakim, which is more than 10 miles from the Gaza border, and the remaining protesters dispersed today.
Some protesters said they managed to sneak into the Gaza settlements in recent days, though it has been declared off-limits to nonresidents.
The police arrested dozens of demonstrators attempting to reach the settlements. But the protest, like other mass rallies organized by right-wing protesters, was staged without any serious confrontations.
Bentzi Lieberman, the head of the main settler organization, the Yesha Council, condemned today's shooting in northern Israel.
"Murder is murder is murder, and there can be no other response but to denounce it completely and express revulsion," Mr. Lieberman said.
Earlier today, an estimated 10,000 Palestinians rallied outside their parliament building in Gaza City to celebrate the planned Israeli withdrawal.
Gunmen fired into the air, while others waved the Palestinian flag and danced in the street.
"After 38 years of ugly occupation, they are leaving and they will never come back," the Palestinian prime minister, Ahmed Qurei, said of the Israelis.
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| shaolin_Z |
| You keep forgeting that Israeli attrocities are mistakes and accidents. |
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| Spacey Orange |
| quote: | Originally posted by shaolin_Z
You keep forgeting that Israeli attrocities are mistakes and accidents. |
you should have put a ":rolleyes:" at the end of your statement.;) |
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| shaolin_Z |
:rolleyes:
:p :) |
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| pkcRAISTLIN |
| hey, even those of us that lean towards favouring israel arent stupid. so yes, id label this a terrorist attack. |
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| shaolin_Z |
| quote: | Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
hey, even those of us that lean towards favouring israel arent stupid. so yes, id label this a terrorist attack. |
amongst countless others which you guys ignore, justify, or deny (I'm not saying it's you in particular, since I'v never really read any of your post regarding Israel-Palestine) |
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| pkcRAISTLIN |
^^ i think the main prob is that the media does not focus on attacks by israel. and i certainly argue that israel has committed a bunch of atrocities. and the world should pay more attention.
having said that though, i put more \"faith\" in a recognised, elected govt (that can be ousted) than i do in a group(s) who\'s PRINCIPLE method of effecting change is the deliberate murder of civilians.
i have little problem with groups targeting soldiers and those that can defend themselves. but blowing up people who\'ve just stepped out of the house to go to the market sucks most of the compassion from me to be honest. |
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| shaolin_Z |
| quote: | Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
^^ i think the main prob is that the media does not focus on attacks by israel. and i certainly argue that israel has committed a bunch of atrocities. and the world should pay more attention.
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Yup, it's called bias. The dirty-savage-sandni**er image needs to be maintained so that the victims can be blamed.
combine the 2
Israel:
| quote: | Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
having said that though, i put more \"faith\" in a recognised, elected govt (that can be ousted) than
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IDF:
| quote: | Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
i do in a group(s) who's PRINCIPLE method of effecting change is the deliberate murder of civilians.
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= Israeli policy.
Not to mention destroying infrastructure and "ethnic cleansing" of Palestinians from their own motherland.
| quote: | Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
i have little problem with groups targeting soldiers and those that can defend themselves. but blowing up people who've just stepped out of the house to go to the market sucks most of the compassion from me to be honest. |
Well, IDF targets civilian (including children and women) who have absolutely nothing to do with terroism. |
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| Goashem |
1) obviously he is a terrorist
2) he does not represent israel just like hamas and islamic jihad dont represent palestine so please dont lump this with "israel attrocities"
3) these kind of events get overlooked by the media because they mostly dont happen. the israeli army been cracking down on the jewish terrorist group, making arrests and preventing attacks against palestinians.
edit: and since noone on either israeli side or palestinian side want these prisoners they actually remain in jail. |
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| pkcRAISTLIN |
well, imo shaolin terror groups often hide behind women and children which puts them in danger. im not saying the IDF havent committed atrocities (and should be accountable for them) but i dont believe that the israeli govt\'s goal is the murder of civilians.
and i think lots of people tend to forget that the land that the israeli\'s have occupied since the 6 day war was stolen after israel won a pre-emptive war which was designed to wipe them out. i dont think they should have that land now however.
overall its a nasty nasty situation and i hope over the next decade some meaningful, peaceful change can occur :( |
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| TranceGiant |
Israel's biggest daily paper "Maariv" has the following headline today: JEWISH TERRORIST.
Guess that answers your question. Obviously, the difference between Israeli society and the Palestinian, is the ability to self-criticism. While Israel clearly calls this murder what it is, Palestinian have never ever even put the word "terrorism" in their mouthg when shallowly "condeming" Palestinian acts of violence (mainly using the old and boring formula of condeming "violence on both sides" ). |
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