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Dear IGNORANT left wing liberal types (pg. 3)
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| missbliss |
I understand the view coming from each side.
Eviltree: I think I see the point that you're getting at but I don't think others get it because they read the ' you' or any other ranthing phrases. You are completely right in that a lot of people that say they are left wing say the pacifist remarks because frankly, it's just easier. War = bad, No war = good, plus it makes you feel warm and fuzzy inside. The fact is war (as well as many of the other values that right wingers promote) is necessary is many intances.
Now, having said that Right Wingers aren't exactly god's gift to politics. A lot of right wingers catch on to these political loafers (uninformed left wing pacifists) on the other side and try to call them on it - which is fine, but if you do decide to rant about something you need to understand where the other side is coming from too even if they are misinformed.
There are good arguments from both side. That's undeniable. But I'm still waiting for someone to step up and say that they understand where each side is coming from but can recommend something based on their findings. Someone who knows anything about politics should be able to call on the pros and cons of each side. Do your research then pick a side, not the other way around, people....
I haven't seen much enlightment in this post and given the title, I'm still waiting for someone to defend either side without saying ' you'...
Cheers
Jess |
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| EvilTree |
For the last time, I'm not right wing. LOL
This thread was not meant to debate the values of left wing vs right wing.
This thread was about ignorant left wing types. (though I suppose ignorant right wing types are even worse) |
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| Chiclet |
Can you blame us for thinking you're right wing?
The only time I ever hear " you, stupid liberals" is usually from foaming-at-the-mouth Bill O'Reilly and all his angry sheep... or equally ignorant people on the right.
"Shut the up! Cut his mic... CUT HIS MIC!!!"
If you consider yourself centrist, and you're Canadian, you'd probably be seen as a... *GASP* liberal down south.
You can't expect to start a thread telling people to off with their ignorance and not have people wanting you to explain your point of view.
Wasn't the point of this thread to complain about people who just trumpet their opinion with nothing to back it up? Well, back it up! I'm sure many of us are feeling a little ripped off.
:) |
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| EvilTree |
| quote: | Originally posted by Chiclet
Can you blame us for thinking you're right wing?
The only time I ever hear " you, stupid liberals" is usually from foaming-at-the-mouth Bill O'Reilly and all his angry sheep... or equally ignorant people on the right.
"Shut the up! Cut his mic... CUT HIS MIC!!!"
If you consider yourself centrist, and you're Canadian, you'd probably be seen as a... *GASP* liberal down south.
You can't expect to start a thread telling people to off with their ignorance and not have people wanting you to explain your point of view.
Wasn't the point of this thread to complain about people who just trumpet their opinion with nothing to back it up? Well, back it up! I'm sure many of us are feeling a little ripped off.
:) |
Hmmm... Just what do you want me to explain? The centrist point of view?
There isn't exactly a set in stone centrist theory, except that centrist believe that the govt and society should do its best to provide as much opportunities as possible to its citizens without compromising the integrity of the society. Meaning, give people the tools to succeed, but not at the cost of compromising some other citizen's chance to succeed.
Each centrist will have differing opinions on each subject. Some are pro war, some aren't. Some are pro gay rights, some aren't. You'll get different answers from each centrist.
Now if you're asking what my personal opinions are, give me a list of topics and I'll give you an answer on each. (I think I can afford to procrastinate a bit more) :)
PS: TOTA threads don't have to make sense. ;) |
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| TranceGrooves |
^^^^
so in other words a centrist is a person who is a left wing but at same time is also a right wing but wont admit to either.
according to your above post Evil i think you just made the whole world centrists. i mean who in their right mind wouldnt want to " provide as much opportunities as possible to its citizens without compromising the integrity of the society. Meaning, give people the tools to succeed, but not at the cost of compromising some other citizen's chance to succeed " . if u ask a right winger about this they wud say hellz yea and if u ask a left winger about it they wud say hellz yea too. more over if " Each centrist will have differing opinions on each subject. Some are pro war, some aren't. Some are pro gay rights, some aren't. You'll get different answers from each centrist " then how is a centrist any different from any one else on this planet ? i am kinda lost on this statement. i mean they are some left wingers out there who are pro war and there are left wingers who arent. same goes for right wingers so are they centrist :conf:
this left wing right wing centre wing talk is makin my head hurt. all i want is some goddamn chicken wings |
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| Cyrus King |
| quote: | Originally posted by EvilTree
you
Your ignorance and your persistent big mouth is getting very, very annoying.
I wouldn't mind you people if you knew what you were talking about. But most of you have no clue what you're talking about. I might as well be talking to a parrot because most of the time, your main reasons against GW2 or War on Terror is 'US is evil' and 'Bush is an idiot.'
While those 2 statements may be too general, but they are valid. However, if you can't back up what you're saying, then STFU.
Same goes for Canada's involvement in War on Terror or Afghanistan. Similar dumbass answers and statements. Most of you have no clue what Canada is doing in Afghanistan or other peace support operations.
The more eloquent of you ignorant types parrot what your left wing poli sci prof said and you take that as the absolute truth. I wonder how many of you did further research to what your profs said. Think for yourselves. Do a bit of research.
I still haven't forgot how some of you ignorant types called a 'babykiller' either. Thanks for showing your opinion in a very mature manner.
*end rant* |
You have become a victim of rape in this thread |
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| Jayx1 |
"liberal" and "conservative" definitions are twisted in Canada.
What i am about to describe has nothing to do with the political parties of the same names because they are not representative of true ideologies.
Canadians are conservative who THINK they are liberal. We are all socially conservative minded unless it comes to the odd pet project like gay marriage for example. We like to make ourselves feel good with "acceptance". By the way im not against that either but a true liberal would accept rights for EVERYONE, not just special interests. True Liberals would NOT be against 50 cent coming to canada for example. Thats a CONSERVATIVE move. A true liberal would also not be against scrapping last call. Thats a CONSERVATIVE idea.
The funny part about it is that traditional canadian conservatives are often in many ways far more liberal than canadian liberals.
Conservatives want to allow freedom of individual as well as collective health care. Conservatives want more rights and true equality whereas liberals are trying to curb our rights. The only thing that is truely liberal about canadian liberals is that they enjoy wasting our money at every given chance on feel good projects. |
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| DigiNut |
| quote: | Originally posted by TranceGrooves
Meaning, give people the tools to succeed, but not at the cost of compromising some other citizen's chance to succeed". |
Actually, that really is the centrist (free-market capitalist) point of view, and not the left or right. Many people would like to think that this is *their* belief, but when you investigate the specifics of how they think a country should be run, you find that they've strayed quite far off that beaten path. I'm not referring to anyone specific here, just the general case.
Right wing is fascist - enforcement of a particular religion, censorship of sex and violence, anti-abortionism, prohibitionism, etc.
Left wing is collectivist (the belief that an individual's personal rights are secondary to the needs of the less successful members of society). There you have welfare, gun control, affirmative action, and basically anything government-controlled other than the police and the military. Recently it has also come to include its own brand of censorship (political correctness).
I saw Chiclet hit on a particularly good point, although I'll bet she meant it as a shot against the USA and not against Canada: beliefs which are commonly held as "moderate" here in Canada would be seen as pretty far left in other parts of the world, particularly the USA. When you're surrounded every day by people with the same or similar beliefs, you tend to view that as moderate no matter what those beliefs are. However, even if 100% of the world were a communist dictatorship, that would not make it any less left-wing.
Someone who is truly "moderate" in their politics believes in giving people no more and no less than what they earn. A perfectly moderate government would use a flat tax to fund the police and military, and that's it. No last call, no regulations against sex on TV, and no earmarking of people's incomes for the "less fortunate". Let people do what they want as long as they're not directly hurting anyone else or their property.
So FYI your definition of a centrist as "a person who is a left wing but at same time is also a right wing but won't admit to either" is not correct. A political centrist is someone who holds neither the right-wing beliefs of a puritan monoculture nor the left-wing beliefs of a government-run socialist economy. |
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| DigiNut |
| quote: | Originally posted by Jayx1
Conservatives want to allow freedom of individual as well as collective health care. |
Sorry, but neither the conservatives in Canada nor the right wing in general have any interest in public health care. Public education, perhaps. |
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| EvilTree |
| quote: | Originally posted by TranceGrooves
^^^^
so in other words a centrist is a person who is a left wing but at same time is also a right wing but wont admit to either. |
In a way, yes.
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according to your above post Evil i think you just made the whole world centrists. i mean who in their right mind wouldnt want to " provide as much opportunities as possible to its citizens without compromising the integrity of the society. Meaning, give people the tools to succeed, but not at the cost of compromising some other citizen's chance to succeed " . if u ask a right winger about this they wud say hellz yea and if u ask a left winger about it they wud say hellz yea too. more over if " Each centrist will have differing opinions on each subject. Some are pro war, some aren't. Some are pro gay rights, some aren't. You'll get different answers from each centrist " then how is a centrist any different from any one else on this planet ? i am kinda lost on this statement. i mean they are some left wingers out there who are pro war and there are left wingers who arent. same goes for right wingers so are they centrist :conf: |
Generally the 'left wing' are the 'socialist' and 'right wing' are 'conservatives'. Rarely you'll meet someone who is completely 'left wing' or someone who is completely 'right wing'. It's just term used to describe how a person leans towards to in most issues.
As for how centrist differ from others, let's say an issue is govt deciding whether to give a tax cut or to spend more money on health care. There are 2 centrists. One centrist think that with a tax cut, a citizen have more economic opportunities. The other thinks that more on health care provides more opportunities. Tax cut is generally a 'right wing' thing while health care is more 'left wing' thing. Both are thinking what is more important in terms of providing opportunities for the society, so both are falling in lines with centrist thinking.
Don't confuse centrists with moderates who try to take halfway on issues because centrists will generally take a side (left or right) on an issue. But on next issue, they might just switch political spectrum. That's why on most political test thing, most centrist will fall somewhere in the middle.
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this left wing right wing centre wing talk is makin my head hurt. all i want is some goddamn chicken wings |
Me too. I can use some nice suicide wings right now. Burn a hole in my belly. :) |
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| EvilTree |
| quote: | Originally posted by DigiNut
Actually, that really is the centrist (free-market capitalist) point of view, and not the left or right. |
Most centrists will be free market capitalists, but there are quite a few centrist who do believe in strongly regulated, protectionist and centralized economy.
| quote: |
Someone who is truly "moderate" in their politics believes in giving people no more and no less than what they earn. A perfectly moderate government would use a flat tax to fund the police and military, and that's it. No last call, no regulations against sex on TV, and no earmarking of people's incomes for the "less fortunate". Let people do what they want as long as they're not directly hurting anyone else or their property. |
You're describing libertarianism which is... 'south' wing. The 'north' wing would be authoritarianism.
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| Orko |
| quote: | Originally posted by EvilTree
you
Your ignorance and your persistent big mouth is getting very, very annoying.
I wouldn't mind you people if you knew what you were talking about. But most of you have no clue what you're talking about. I might as well be talking to a parrot because most of the time, your main reasons against GW2 or War on Terror is 'US is evil' and 'Bush is an idiot.'
While those 2 statements may be too general, but they are valid. However, if you can't back up what you're saying, then STFU.
Same goes for Canada's involvement in War on Terror or Afghanistan. Similar dumbass answers and statements. Most of you have no clue what Canada is doing in Afghanistan or other peace support operations.
The more eloquent of you ignorant types parrot what your left wing poli sci prof said and you take that as the absolute truth. I wonder how many of you did further research to what your profs said. Think for yourselves. Do a bit of research.
I still haven't forgot how some of you ignorant types called a 'babykiller' either. Thanks for showing your opinion in a very mature manner.
*end rant* |
Maybe some of these people are under educated about the topic at hand, and are trying to learn something along the way. It has been my experience that when some people are confronted by issues, which they are uneducated about, they resort to very generally acceptable statements, because they do not want to look foolish, and they do this unconsciously.
I just think, rather than a rant, maybe you could actually provide some of this research and reading material that you are talking about. Telling them to shut up, and off, and go to some research, when they have no idea where to start, wont help things.
If you want things to change, help educate, who knows, maybe somebody will join you on the right?
Honestly, I would be interesting in reading something I am not aware of, but I just do not what I should be reading, or even looking for when it comes to politics.
EDIT: maybe I should have read more of this thread, because some people already stated some of my points. |
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